Beer For An Unborn Kid

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KingBrianI

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My wife and I are expecting our first kid next February. As many others have already done on the forum, I'd like to brew a special beer to commemorate the occasion that can be put aside for the kid to have on his/her 21st birthday (as well as other special occasions). I want to make a beer that can not only handle that kind of aging, but thrive under it. Here's what I've come up with.

Baby's Beer

OG 1.088
IBU 58
SRM ~12-16
ABV ~8.5%
5.5 gal batch

16 lbs. Warminster floor-malted maris otter
0.75 lbs. Carastan (Baird's)
0.25 lbs Pale Chocolate Malt (Crisp)

I'll do a kettle caramelization with a gallon or two of the first runnings to richen things up a little.

1.5 oz Brewer's Gold 90 min
1 oz Northdown 30 min

Wyeast 1084 (suggested by Wyeast when I asked them what would age well under these circumstances)

I'm also going to age it on some home-toasted oak (https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/how-prepare-toast-char-oak-beer-287013/) and probably bottle with cork and cage.

Some of my favorite beers are Riggwelter, Hobgoblin, and Traquair House Ale. This beer should have elements of each of them together with enough strength to hold up to extended aging. And I've heard the Warminster maris otter is amazing. This will be my first time with it. Hopefully the kid likes it.
 
You think it will hold out for that long? I wanted to do the same thing, my son was just born on June 16th but I didn't have faith in something aging that long and tasting good.
 
Very cool idea. I think you should up the gravity and hops if you are set on making this go the distance. A wine or mead might be a better choice.
 
You think it will hold out for that long? I wanted to do the same thing, my son was just born on June 16th but I didn't have faith in something aging that long and tasting good.

I don't see why it wouldn't hold up that long. I've heard of beers going much longer and being great.

Very cool idea. I think you should up the gravity and hops if you are set on making this go the distance. A wine or mead might be a better choice.

+1. look into brewing a 10-12% barleywine, and up those IBUs. you could crank 'em up to over 100, they'll be well faded by the time you crack one open.

I contemplated making it stronger when I was first coming up with the recipe. I was also tossing around making it with just the Warminster floor-malted maris otter since that stuff is supposed to be so good. But in the end, I decided to make something more along the lines of what I find enjoyable. I find beers in the 8-9% ABV range much more balanced to my taste than beers in the 10-12% ABV range. And there are plenty of beers in the 8-9% range that have aged exceptionally well. I don't know that the extra few % would necessarily help a beer that much. I was also contemplating upping the IBUs, knowing that they will drop over time. But then I decided that that would be part of the fun. That the beer will be totally different in 20-odd years. I'll be having bottles now and then throughout the years following its progress.
 
It *will* help the beer. You're going 20+ years... not many brews age gracefully in that timeline. Two decades is nothing to scoff at... you should really do everything possible to help your beer make it. How disappointed would you be if in 2033 you opened the bottles and they sucked? It's really not worth taking chances.

Since you're looking at kettle caramelization, I'd recommend going with a massive Wee Heavy. Barleywines, and some Quadrupels/Belgian Dark Strongs have the potential too. I'd aim for at least 12%... that would go a long way towards helping it remain great. That's not a small increase... That's a full 50% higher than what you've planned. There's a bit of a threshold for this kind of thing though, and with such epic aging, I guarantee you that 8-9% is on the wrong side of it.

Also keep in mind that hop character will fade to almost nothing in that time frame, so going bigger than you think you should is actually probably a good idea. If you want to restrain the bitterness, going with a portion of aged hops (a la lambic) might be something to consider.

Also, be very careful about oxygenation with this brew. Hot side aeration may not be something you normally care about, but for such a long-term beer it might be prudent to be careful... there's no "next time" for a special beer like this. And obviously, be careful with transfers. Purge bottles with CO2 before filling, if possible. Maybe even add a bit of ascorbic acid (aka vitamin C... but buy "ascorbic acid" in powder form, preferably from a HBS) to the priming solution, as it's an antioxidant that could very well help it remain drinkable after all these years.

Other than that, good luck!
 
I don't see why it wouldn't hold up that long. I've heard of beers going much longer and being great.





I contemplated making it stronger when I was first coming up with the recipe. I was also tossing around making it with just the Warminster floor-malted maris otter since that stuff is supposed to be so good. But in the end, I decided to make something more along the lines of what I find enjoyable. I find beers in the 8-9% ABV range much more balanced to my taste than beers in the 10-12% ABV range. And there are plenty of beers in the 8-9% range that have aged exceptionally well. I don't know that the extra few % would necessarily help a beer that much. I was also contemplating upping the IBUs, knowing that they will drop over time. But then I decided that that would be part of the fun. That the beer will be totally different in 20-odd years. I'll be having bottles now and then throughout the years following its progress.
how many 20 year old beers have you tasted? something that works over 3-5 years might not over 20. i think your frame of reference might be a little off. hell, two decades might be enough to make Avery's Beast drinkable :D

if you plan on tasting the beer over the years, then i - personally - would definitely up the hops and watch how they change. the higher the IBUs, the longer the fade and the potentially more interested the effects will be. a lightly-hopped beer will face very quickly and there won't be much change after a few years. also, hops are a preservative so more can't hurt.

obviously this is your beer, so follow your heart. please let us know how it turns out, and how it changes. i'll be on the lookout for updates to this thread. best of luck!
 
how many 20 year old beers have you tasted? something that works over 3-5 years might not over 20. i think your frame of reference might be a little off. hell, two decades might be enough to make Avery's Beast drinkable :D

It's funny, I was going to use the same argument on those who are suggesting a higher gravity beer. How many 20-year old beers have you tasted or brewed to be so sure 10-12% ABV is better than 8.5%? Yeah, I know that's what's commonly believed, but most people on this forum believe a 3-week primary is necessary among many other things. The bottom line is, I've read about many beers in this alcohol range tasting great after far longer than 21 years.
 
KingBrianI said:
It's funny, I was going to use the same argument on those who are suggesting a higher gravity beer. How many 20-year old beers have you tasted or brewed to be so sure 10-12% ABV is better than 8.5%? Yeah, I know that's what's commonly believed, but most people on this forum believe a 3-week primary is necessary among many other things. The bottom line is, I've read about many beers in this alcohol range tasting great after far longer than 21 years.

I highly doubt that, but it's pointless to argue so I won't ask for proof. But I don't need to wait 21 years to know a beer sucks by then, since they generally crap out well before then. On the other hand, you DO need to wait that long to know it will be good. Funny how that works, huh? 20 years is a LONG freaking time for beer.

You made a post to ask what people think, and they've told you. If you want to take such a retarded gamble on a very special beer you only have one shot at, be my guest.

Oh. Congrats on the kid.
 
I highly doubt that, but it's pointless to argue. You made a post to ask what people think, and they've told you. If you want to take such a retarded gamble on a very special beer you only have one shot at, be my guest.

Oh. Congrats on the kid.

You'll notice I didn't ask anyone anything in the first post. It was merely intended to document what I'll be doing. Thanks for the congrats!
 
I think this sounds like a fun experiment and congrats on the little one! I wanted to something similar for the birth of my kids, but I don't have the patience to wait that long! Instead, I brewed a special beer to share with friends and family on their 1st B-day parties. What beers have you had that are over 20 years old...the oldest to cross my lips was 7?

Cheers and happy brewing! :mug:
 
I did this, I made an overhopped (first wort hops, 3 additions, and hopback) barleywine at 12% ABV. Use O2 absorbing caps and a bottle filler that can purge with CO2. I have mine stored in the beer fridge at 50F. We tried some at the first birthday, and it was more like a double IPA. We will start tastings when my daughter is 14 and go to 21. Good luck.
 
I think this sounds like a fun experiment and congrats on the little one! I wanted to something similar for the birth of my kids, but I don't have the patience to wait that long! Instead, I brewed a special beer to share with friends and family on their 1st B-day parties. What beers have you had that are over 20 years old...the oldest to cross my lips was 7?

Cheers and happy brewing! :mug:

Thanks for the congratulations! I myself haven't had any beers over 20 years old, I've only read tasting notes. The oldest beer I've had was probably only 5-7 years old. There are frequently accounts online from people tasting old beers though. Here are a couple I found quickly searching just now.

http://www.yorkpress.co.uk/leisure/..._35_years______/?action=complain&cid=10452122 I couldn't find an ABV for this beer but I doubt it was over 9% and possibly much less.

http://www.realbeer.com/discussions/showthread.php?t=9329 An account of old Ballantine Burton Ales, some as old as 71 years. 60 IBU although they did have 10% ABV, this is 71 years we're talking about.

http://brookstonbeerbulletin.com/new-albion-vintage-beer-tasting/ watch the attached video of them trying 33 year old beers that were not intended to age including an irish dry stout probably around 4% ABV.

Fuller's do their Vintage Ale to 8.5% ABV and although they've only been produced since 1997, they seem to be aging well and are intended to keep for a while. Here's one person's account http://www.pencilandspoon.com/2011/10/fullers-vintage-ale-15-year-vertical.html

There are many more but that's what I found with a quick search. There are also some good videos on youtube.
 
I did this, I made an overhopped (first wort hops, 3 additions, and hopback) barleywine at 12% ABV. Use O2 absorbing caps and a bottle filler that can purge with CO2. I have mine stored in the beer fridge at 50F. We tried some at the first birthday, and it was more like a double IPA. We will start tastings when my daughter is 14 and go to 21. Good luck.

That's awesome, it's great hearing from people who are doing this. How are the oxygen absorbing caps working for you? I like that they will keep oxidation down in the bottle, but I'm worried about whatever makes them work giving weird flavors to the beer or breaking down and falling into the beer after years of storage.
 
I've got a case of miller lite in my house that's 7 years old (got it for a party when we moved in and it sat forgotten in a corner). Maybe I should drink one per year and see how it ages.
 
I've got a case of miller lite in my house that's 7 years old (got it for a party when we moved in and it sat forgotten in a corner). Maybe I should drink one per year and see how it ages.

Hang onto it a while longer. I think 2005 vintage miller lite might be collectable. :D
 
Its a fine idea, but speaking from experience, that is all it is. I started brewing when my oldest was 1 yr old, now it wasn't a giant beer, it didn't have 200IBU's, but it was a barley wine. I only kept the last bottle for 10 years. I know I was a newbee, but it wasn't real good. Oxidized more than anything. Good luck with yours though, we have the internet now!
 
Always planned on doing something similar, although I wonder if force carbonating and cold storage would be better for the beer's flavor (in the long term) than doing it via a secondary bottle fermentation. I say this because most of the old homebrewed 10-15yr bottles of beer I've had were either completely dry and over attenuated or had some of those meaty/mushroom flavors you get with yeast autoloysis.

If you change your mind about doing a brown ale type of thing, the old Courage Imperial Stout recipes are godly. Got to try a few of the late 60's versions and they were still amazing.
 
A better idea would be to brew a batch with him when he turns 20 and then give it to him when he turns 21. Do you think somebody would really appreciate a heavy beer for their first beer?
 
A better idea would be to brew a batch with him when he turns 20 and then give it to him when he turns 21. Do you think somebody would really appreciate a heavy beer for their first beer?

Not to get into a philosophical or parenting debate, but it definitely won't be his/her first. I'll raise them both with exposure to and respect for alcohol. They'll be brewing with me starting much earlier than 20, and I won't deny them tasting the results. This beer is more a special token that they can go through life drinking on special occasions, knowing it was made while they were in utero and that it is the same age as they are.
 
KingBrianI said:
Not to get into a philosophical or parenting debate, but it definitely won't be his/her first. I'll raise them both with exposure to and respect for alcohol. They'll be brewing with me starting much earlier than 20, and I won't deny them tasting the results. This beer is more a special token that they can go through life drinking on special occasions, knowing it was made while they were in utero and that it is the same age as they are.

My two cents, I would probably go with a wine for the long haul, but this isnt me so go for it. I would also think the brew the beer together would be awesome.

Or how about doing all three. Make a wine and a beer now and wait, and then brew a new beer so its ready for 21 and then get completely obliterated when its time.
 
Not to get into a philosophical or parenting debate, but it definitely won't be his/her first. I'll raise them both with exposure to and respect for alcohol. They'll be brewing with me starting much earlier than 20, and I won't deny them tasting the results. This beer is more a special token that they can go through life drinking on special occasions, knowing it was made while they were in utero and that it is the same age as they are.

I am so happy for you that you are expecting! That's so awesome, and I wish you congratulations. That's an exciting time of your life, and I'm excited for you.

I'd probably consider something big. Like Utopias clone. I finally had my sample that paulthenurse sent a few years ago. It was beyond wonderful, and it ages so well that 5, 10, 20 years would be easily within expectations.
 
+1. look into brewing a 10-12% barleywine, and up those IBUs. you could crank 'em up to over 100, they'll be well faded by the time you crack one open.

THIS!!!

You need to jack everything up super high, expecting it to fade. Look at my 5 year aging Barley Wine thread for ideas. It had an OG when all was said and done of 1.170, we aimed for 150 Ibus, and now it's been aging for 3 weeks in an oak barrel and still has 3 years to sit in bottles til my 50th birthdays.

If you're planning to do 21 years, you need to kick what I did up a notch or 3. Look at Paul The Nurse and Cape Brewing's multiple Utopias clone recipes for ideas.
 
I'm doing this for my Granddaughter Eva.
Calling the beer Evalution.

Brewed a big beer every November for the last three years.
E0 is a RIS
E1 is an Old Ale
E2 is a Barleywine

Thinking of a really big wheat wine for E3

The hardest thing is staying out of the stash. :drunk:
 
As part of my sons birth announcement to close friends and family- I gave out corked and caged bottles of an American Farmhouse Style Ale (no such thing obvs) with a special label. I've saved 2 for myself and him. I came up with a unique recipe that he and I can brew for his 21st Birthday Party (it uses like 12 malts and a blend of yeasts). The beer was fantastic and I have many people asking for more but it is pricey to brew and the next time I will brew it will be with him. So get creative and everyone will love it. On another note I have a 13% barleywine I've brewed every year for the last 11 and it is getting better with age and the beer is still really good. Each vintage is different and ages differently.
 
Maybe I'll brew that really big crazy beer for my second kid (if one comes)! But I'm pretty well decided on an 8.5% ABV English Strong Ale for this one. I may up the IBUs a bit, but I'm not sure. I kind of like the idea of a beer that tastes great from the start, not one that is over-bittered and boozy for several years. Maybe that's a mistake, but we'll just have to wait (21 years!) and see. I actually think a moderate-alcohol beer might start slightly ahead of the curve, since the yeast will be much happier than if they had to deal with crazy high sugar and alcohol content. Whatever.

I've actually been reading a lot lately about beer stability and it seems like it's not a very well understood subject. It's actually kind of hard to make anything of the info out there. Firstly, everything seems to be aimed at commercial breweries attempting to maintain their product on the shelf for up to a year - nothing like what I'll be aiming for with a beer that will be cellared for 2 decades. Secondly, much of the information is contradictory. Maillard products are said to both help and hurt. Antioxidants like ascorbic acid (Vitamin C) are said to both help and hurt. The story is the same for different hop compounds, cold break, etc. I think my best course of action will be to do what I can to minimize oxygen exposure throughout the whole process, and to keep everything as "clean" as possible. Not sterilization-wise only, but being sure to get the runnings really clear into the kettle, keep all the cold break out of the fermenter, use really fresh and healthy yeast, etc. That should do the trick.

By the way all this talk and research about aging beers made me pull out one of my several years old westy 12 clones. Very nice!
 
Sam Adams Utopias is blended from beer that is over 18 years old.... At least the tag on my Bottle tells me that.
 
Alright, so this one will happen this weekend. I've decided to bump the gravity up by about 10 points to split the difference with all of your thoughts. That should give me about 10%ABV which should let me maintain healthy yeast, while getting closer to the alcohol percentage you guys think will help it age better. In order to minimize oxygen exposure I'm going to take my time and not dump the water into the mash, stir too hard, let the runnings fall into the kettle, etc. I've also adjusted the recipe slightly to hopefully help it age a bit better. In my research, it seems like dark worts and dark malts are unanimously regarded as helping a beer age. Unmalted grains are also widely regarded as helping beer stability. So instead of chocolate malt, I'm using roasted barley. The final ratio should be about 95% warminster floor-malted maris otter, 4% carastan, and 1% roasted barley. I'm also going to bump the IBUs up, though I haven't decided to what extent, yet. Hopefully, it all comes together to make a beer that not only will taste good in 6 months, but in 21 years!
 
Brewed yesterday. Hit 1.094 OG. Not as high as I was aiming for but I came in a bit over volume. Took it slow and easy the whole time making sure to minimize any unnecessary O2 exposure during the process and keep all wort, runnings, etc completely free of grain bits and particulates. I bumped the hop additions up a bit so there would still be a good amount of bitterness left after many years. Pitched a BIG slurry of healthy, active yeast and it was holding at 58 F this morning in the fermentation freezer. I'll let it rise to 62 or so starting this afternoon. The blow-off tube was bubbling nicely this morning. Here's where the recipe ended up.

OG 1.094
IBU 100

95% Warminster floor-malted Maris Otter
4% Bairds Carastan
1% Black Roasted Barley

2 oz Brewers Gold FWH
1 oz Northdown @ 90 min
1 oz Northdown @ 20 min

I took 2 gallons of first runnings and slowly reduced them down to about a quart of syrup then added back to the kettle.

Wyeast 1084

I'm going to let it ferment for a couple weeks, then crash cool to get most of the yeast out. Then rack to secondary on some oak that has been sitting in spirits for several months. There it will stay until February of next year, just before the baby is due. I still have to decide whether I want to do a cork and cage thing for these or go with traditional caps then dip in wax. The O2 absorbing caps are also an option, though I'm a bit scared of whatever is on them that makes them work will break down or taint the beer after all those years. Anyway, that's a decision that can stand to wait for a few months.
 
I wish you luck man hopefully it can go the distance. A couple of years ago I bought a bottle of sam adams triple bock. That beer was supposed to be hopped pretty good and was like over 17% alcohol. I was told by the guy at the store they were from 96 and apparently forgot about in their warehouse. Man that beer was terrible. I looked up reviews and it sounded pretty good when it was in its prime but it had oxidized and tasted like horrid soy sauce and rotting meat.
 
So I crashed the primary to 32 degrees after fermentation was done and it had been sitting there for the last couple of weeks. Yesterday I racked it to a secondary that was purged with CO2 on top of a couple sticks of used oak. The nice thing about racking it that cold, was that as it warmed up, it blew off lots more CO2, so the carboy is now completely purged and ready for extended aging.
 
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