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str1p3s said:
Do you need a separate picnic tap than your normal serving tap? i.e. can you pull the modified bottle filler out once you are done or is it jammed in there so well that it's stuck or you'll break something?
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You can use any picnic tap just be careful when you insert the racking cane. I made the mistake of pushing too hard and broke the plastic lip on my picnic tap. It doesn't have to be all shoved up in there- a gentle push is all that's needed.
 
Gusmedic said:
With over 1,200 posts on this topic, it's been tough to find a clear answer. What's the sanitation protocol for all this? Same as normal bottling? Or is it just rinsed cleaned bottles and not much of an infection worry because sugar is all used up and it's going to be typically stored cold?
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Clean bottles and rinse with starsan. Rinse caps with starsan. Cover bottles with foil or caps then chill in freezer.

If you're going to be drinking within a day or two, you can be a little more lax. But if you plan on aging beer for any significant length of time, then you need to be more stringent with sanitation. With that said, it takes 5 seconds to do a starsan rinse...
 
Attempt #2 of this was spectacular. First attempt not so much. First time, the hole in the stopper I got from LHBS was too big. Air leaked around racking cane so pressure unable to build up.

Second attempt with a different stopper worked great as the hole was smaller.

One thing that worries me is there are bubbles in the line from all the constant starting/stopping of the picnic tap when switching between bottles.

Does everybody get this or am I doing something wrong? Only way I could seen to prevent it is trying to turn the co2 pressure on higher.
 
mclaughlindw4 said:
Attempt #2 of this was spectacular. First attempt not so much. First time, the hole in the stopper I got from LHBS was too big. Air leaked around racking cane so pressure unable to build up.

Second attempt with a different stopper worked great as the hole was smaller.

One thing that worries me is there are bubbles in the line from all the constant starting/stopping of the picnic tap when switching between bottles.

Does everybody get this or am I doing something wrong? Only way I could seen to prevent it is trying to turn the co2 pressure on higher.
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The bubbles are common and not usually a problem if you run a small amount of beer out into a bucket immediately before filling each bottle. If they still create too much foam, simply fill as much as you can, set the bottle aside and gently top it up when the excess foam subsides.
 
mclaughlindw4 said:
Attempt #2 of this was spectacular. First attempt not so much. First time, the hole in the stopper I got from LHBS was too big. Air leaked around racking cane so pressure unable to build up.

Second attempt with a different stopper worked great as the hole was smaller.

One thing that worries me is there are bubbles in the line from all the constant starting/stopping of the picnic tap when switching between bottles.

Does everybody get this or am I doing something wrong? Only way I could seen to prevent it is trying to turn the co2 pressure on higher.
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You can do as carvetop said and dump a little beer into the bucket (or a glass for later)between bottles or just empty it into the next bottle and give a little time for the foam to settle before continuing to fill the bottle. No need to mess with the tap once your start filling, just release pressure with the stopper at a slow steady pace. Let the foam escape with the CO2 and stop/close the tap when beer starts to squirt out.

I found with some of my kegs if I lower the pressure too low(5PSI) I get more bubble in the line so I usually transfer with about 8PSI. I have even had pretty good luck using the serving pressure of about 12PSI but the additional pressure can blow the tap off of the filler wand.
 
Guy at the LHBS said he just uses approx. 12-14" high temp silicone tubing cut at a 45 degree angle off of the cobra tap. He gave me a piece and told me to try.

I bottled a couple and they were flat.

help?
 
That's why the stopper is important if you aren't going to drink the beer that night. If I'm going to drink it that night and I just need a quick growler filler, I'll attach a small piece of 1/2" ID to my perlick faucet and fill the growler.
 
mtnagel said:
That's why the stopper is important if you aren't going to drink the beer that night. If I'm going to drink it that night and I just need a quick growler filler, I'll attach a small piece of 1/2" ID to my perlick faucet and fill the growler.
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Really? I think I remember asking the guy about the stopper and he wasn't worried about it.

The stopper just aids in keeping excessive CO2 in the bottle? I would think as soon as you lifted the stopper, all of the additional CO2 would escape...?
 
You're not how gases work :D

Just FYI commercial breweries have open containers between the fill and the cap/lid.
The stopper is more for the actual filling so it doesn't foam up as much (keeps CO2 in solution better). This doesn't mean that you will never have a chance at oxygen getting into the bottle, but the exposure will be lessened.
 
Yea I know. I was half picking, but I don't understand why so many people think gases stratify when a mixture of gases (air) is all around them.

I know that some people will fill all their bottles then go back and cap them after they have been sitting. In commercial settings after evacuating the bottle and filling the bottle is typically sprayed with either a few ul of water or liquid nitrogen to cause beer foaming which displaces O2 and prevents further entry until bottling.:tank::off:

I'm just in this thread to look up the stopper size since I lost mine between the last time I bottled a year or so ago and now.:D Finally decided to take the applevine and cider that I've had on tap for 8+ months (requested by friends that never drink it over the beer) and bottle them to open up the kegs.
 
jddevinn said:
That's not how gases work.
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true, based strictly stratification....However, that's not really what I'm talking about, I'm talking CO2 moving UP and out or air moving in and pushing the CO2 out. Nearly impossible. if the area between the top of the liquid and the opening is full of CO2, there may be a small amount of outside air that gets in, especially if it's not a narrow opening like a growler or a bottle, but the molecular weight of the CO2 prevents the majority of the air from displacing it. Sure, you're going to get a small amount of displacement, but not a total exchange to cause a major short term issue with oxygenation, and certainly not in the short period of time between filling and capping/sealing. But, hey, to each their own level of care with such things. We all do things a bit differently. ;)
 
beernbourbon said:
true, based strictly stratification....However, that's not really what I'm talking about, I'm talking CO2 moving UP and out or air moving in and pushing the CO2 out. Nearly impossible. if the area between the top of the liquid and the opening is full of CO2, there may be a small amount of outside air that gets in, especially if it's not a narrow opening like a growler or a bottle, but the molecular weight of the CO2 prevents the majority of the air from displacing it. Sure, you're going to get a small amount of displacement, but not a total exchange to cause a major short term issue with oxygenation, and certainly not in the short period of time between filling and capping/sealing. But, hey, to each their own level of care with such things. We all do things a bit differently. ;)
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No that's not how gases work, they do not stratify they mix by diffusion. The particles are constantly moving in random directions they do not "care" about up or down. Some CO2 will immediately move "up" while air moves "down". The molecular weight does not prevent CO@ from being displaced. If you fill multiple bottles before capping it is entirely possible for all of the CO2 to be mixed into the air.

Not that it matters here as most of the beers filled this way are drank soon.
 
I just bottled 15 beers without the stopper. My first time trying this, so hopefully all is okay. I used to bottle straight from my tap and my beers would stay carbonated for a few weeks (AT LEAST.. I just happened to drink them all quickly, I didn't experiment to see how long they stayed carbed) so I don't see an issue with not using the stopper.
 
You'll be fine :D definitely no worse than straight from the tap!!!!

My point was just that that is not how gases work :mug::off: not that anyone should change their methods for short term bottling out of a keg.
 
As I read through this thread more, I got worried about my process. As stated above, I didn't use the stopper, and I left my regulator at serving pressure (have it set to about 7psi). I filled up the bottles until it was overflowing with beer(not foam) and then capped it. This was roughly 24 hrs ago. I just opened a bottle out of curiosity and poured it into a glass, and still has the upside down snow storm effect. Hoping it stays like that on all the bottles!

I will say I stopped at the LHBS yesterday and picked up a #2 drilled stopper, just to be safe for next time.
 
treacheroustexan said:
As I read through this thread more, I got worried about my process. As stated above, I didn't use the stopper, and I left my regulator at serving pressure (have it set to about 7psi). I filled up the bottles until it was overflowing with beer(not foam) and then capped it. This was roughly 24 hrs ago. I just opened a bottle out of curiosity and poured it into a glass, and still has the upside down snow storm effect. Hoping it stays like that on all the bottles!

I will say I stopped at the LHBS yesterday and picked up a #2 drilled stopper, just to be safe for next time.
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The stopper isn't really needed. It only serves to reduce foaming. If you use low serving psi, cold bottles, and a racking cane or tube, then it's not really needed so long as you cap on the foam
 
I made something similar to this but without the tap. I just used the clip off the bottling siphon which I stuck through a rubber stopper.
My finding however is that you want the pressure to be high and you can use a short hose fine. Basically you put the super into the bottle and open the clip. You get a little foam as the pressure equalises but then as the pressure is high no further loss occurs as you carefully squeeze the stopper to let out the air. Then re close the clip and release excess pressure.
You need to be careful to avoidmaking a mess but works quickly and perfectly and better yet costs pennies...
Cheers for the original idea..
 
What's the longest anyone has left a bottle to age and still had carb when opening? It seems like it's all about process and how much carb you can maintain before capping, but I'd be curious to hear people's experience.
 
anteater8 said:
What's the longest anyone has left a bottle to age and still had carb when opening? It seems like it's all about process and how much carb you can maintain before capping, but I'd be curious to hear people's experience.
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I opened up a few bottles from August recently. Haven't noticed any loss in carbonation or anything!
 
anteater8 said:
What's the longest anyone has left a bottle to age and still had carb when opening? It seems like it's all about process and how much carb you can maintain before capping, but I'd be curious to hear people's experience.
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I had a bottle of cider from April take BOS in a comp in October.
 
treacheroustexan said:
I opened up a few bottles from August recently. Haven't noticed any loss in carbonation or anything!
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tmendick said:
I had a bottle of cider from April take BOS in a comp in October.
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Nice! Thanks for the feedback. I have four different stouts/barleywines in secondary now that are all between 11% and 15%. I'm hesitant to bottle condition the stronger ones so I'm looking to invest in a bottle from the keg set up. I'd like to keep some of these beers for at least a year or two, possible longer.

Sounds to me like losing carb isn't an issue if you fill and bottle well, but I'm more concerned about oxidization.
 
I bottled a flanders red off the keg in April with this method and it just took BOS in a competition this past weekend. Just drank one on Monday and carbonation was fine
 
anteater8 said:
I'm more concerned about the beer holding up against oxidization.
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I'm going to experiment with some big beers and filling with this method.

Was thinking of carbing it up very slightly in the keg and then adding priming sugar to make up the difference and bottle using this method.

This is actually how allagash does it. I figure it can't be worse than bottling I'm a bucket, could be much better.
 
mclaughlindw4 said:
I'm going to experiment with some big beers and filling with this method.

Was thinking of carbing it up very slightly in the keg and then adding priming sugar to make up the difference and bottle using this method.

This is actually how allagash does it. I figure it can't be worse than bottling I'm a bucket, could be much better.
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I overcarbonate very slightly some of the times. I usually don't notice a huge drop in carbonation either way.
 
fun4stuff said:
I overcarbonate very slightly some of the times. I usually don't notice a huge drop in carbonation either way.
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Yeah I think me and anteater are having the same problem. We're talking about minimizing oxidation, not so much concerns over losing carbination.
 
tmendick said:
If you cap on foam you are already minimizing oxidation. This is exactly how pro breweries minimize oxygen as well.
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Oxidation isn't a concern using this method on a homebrew level.

I semi recently switch to perlick 650ss flow control taps and just bottle from the tap using a growler filler and cap on foam. Works as well as a beer gun but easier (less clean up) and cheaper than a beer gun/more bang for your buck. More expensive than method detailed in this thread, of course, but I think if you the money it's better spent on flow control taps.
 
I'm interested in using this method instead of the more traditional bottling bucket/bottle conditioning method as a means to reducing oxidation in such things as barleywines, quads etc. Because these types of styles, I want to have in bottles so I can age and drink them over several years. But I feel like if I use this method I can reduce the o2 levels introduced when bottling.

Now before someone goes ahead an point out that oxidation is a part of some of these styles, I will add that I realize that, but I would rather it happen slowly over time as 02 creeps into the bottles as opposed to being a product of higher 02 levels introduced at the beginning.

So to put it another way, I am wondering if I make a barleywine, force carbonate very slightly in a keg, then add priming sugar and bottle using this method, that this will work BETTER for long term aging then using a bottling bucket and simply bottle conditioning with priming sugar.
 
fun4stuff said:
Oxidation isn't a concern using this method on a homebrew level.

I semi recently switch to perlick 650ss flow control taps and just bottle from the tap using a growler filler and cap on foam. Works as well as a beer gun but easier (less clean up) and cheaper than a beer gun/more bang for your buck. More expensive than method detailed in this thread, of course, but I think if you the money it's better spent on flow control taps.
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I'm glad you posted this as I didn't want to read this 132 page thread before asking this very question...How is this working for you?

I also just got that 650ss and was thinking, rather than getting a beer gun or CPF, why not just purge the bottle with a slow blast of C02 from my airgun and then fill with the 650ss with growler filler attachment and cap on foam? Seems like a pretty solid method for the occasional bottle that will likely be drank in a few weeks tops.
 
This may have been covered in the 132 pages but I noticed in a separate (pro-beer gun) thread, that this method might cause issues with high pressure beers...

Long story short, I keg everything. Bought a Blichmann beer gun because I wanted to be able to bring my beer to the local brewery owners/brewers to try and mostly because I want to bring home some medals! So we bottled up three really good beers with the gun and sent them off to competition, me and my brew buds went down to the awards party all confident and didn't place, which was fine, but we were a little surprised. When the scoring info was available, all of our beers had carb issues. I was pretty damn surprised and super annoyed. So I really want to enter more comps but I've been hesitant to risk making this mistake again. I was excited when I stumbled across this "invention"...even though I already have the gun this looks sooo much damn easier in terms of set up and break down and cleaning that it would be worth it to take the $100 loss.

Now here's the issue. I make a lot of berliner Weiss treatments that I keep at high psi (16-18). The other thread I mentioned suggests that this method may not be a good option for high pressure styles. What say you all?
 

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