I did not ruin my beer.

Hello HBT,

It's been a while but I wanted to share a crazy brew day experience in hopes that a new brewer may be able to get something out of it and learn from my mistake. Basically I am turning a total f**kup into a learning opportunity. I really have no idea how this will turn out but I'm planning to post results of a salvage attempt here as I track what will either be epic success or epic failure. Wish me luck!

OK, first I want to state that I have learned a very important truth about brewing that all new brewers will soon realize:

water + malt + hops + excellent sanatation + technique + time + patience = homebrew

That is why my title says "I did not ruin my beer" because no matter how you slice it, I am making beer. The recipe, on the other hand, was totally botched and there is no amount of salvaging that is going to magically fix it or bring it back to the intended original style...but I still made beer and there is no way I am dumping it. Period. Now for the details.

I have been teaching a buddy to brew and he naturally has a ton of questions. I do the best I can to answer what I can and refer him to some of my books for answers I don't have. We were planning an extract with steeping grains IPA - something really simple but great for explaing how adding the exact same type of hops at different times in the boil (along with dry-hopping) has a profound impact on the final product. This particular brew day, I let myself get really distracted by the questions and forgot to add the second half of the DME at the end of the boil! Boys and girls, I left out over 3 lbs of DME when the recipe calls for a total of 6.25 lbs!!!

*reapeatedly bangs forhead with stapler*

Now obviously I noticed a lower OG reading when everything was cooled and transferred (1.030 when shooting for around 1.056), but since I can't yet do a full boil I chalked up the low reading to poor mixture of wort and water to make the full 5 gallons even though I shook the carboy like a madman to aerate. I just didn't put it together until I had moved everything to my swamp cooler and pitched the yeast. I was at the end of clean up nearly 30 minutes after pitching when my buddy said "why do we have all this DME left over?"

*reapeatedly bangs forhead with stapler*

Once I regained composure, I decided to RDWHAHB - Best advice EVER, by the way - and came up with a plan. Like I mentioned before, I know I made beer but the recipe was totally botched. There was plenty of action and the yeasts (US-05) were doing their thing just not as rigorous as expected. I guess I made the world's first Light IPA, maybe? Either way I wanted to experiment rather than call it a loss.

The following morning, I boiled up about 3 qts. of water and added the 3 lbs. of DME I forgot the previous day. I let it boil a good 5 or 6 minutes to ensure sanitation, allowed it to quickly chill in an ice bath, sanatized the buh-gee-zus out of a funnel, and filled a spray bottle with the remaining iodophor solution. I sprayed the outside of the airlock and cork and opening to the carboy and placed the sanatized funnel inside. Then I carefully added the remaining DME mixture to the original wort which was alread fermenting. Yes, yes, I am a gambling man. Holy Moly did that take off like a rocket! The yeasts were already awake and feeding and when I introduced a second batch of food they went balistic! Naturally, the carboy is filled way to high so I knew a blow-off was inevitable if it worked. But I never thought it would work that well!

Bottom Line: I realize that adding the forgotten DME this way was not going to magically correct my mistake or automatically guarantee that I would hit my target OG. But I figured as long as my sanatation was superb, it couldn't hurt to experiment and it HAS to be a lot closer than if I just let it go. Still, i have no earthly idea what this will do to the final product but my plan is to post here every few days to let everyone know how it goes. As I said, this is either going to be an epic success or an epic failure but it should be enlightening no matter how it turns out. In about six weeks I'll be drinking it either way. I just won't be entering any competitions!

Wish me luck!

-Tripod

Hi kids (and I use the term with the highest respect),

Just a quick update. I originally pitched the yeasts into the low-grav wort on the 11th and my attempt to fix was the 12th. So it has been 8 days and everything looks good so far. Fermentation has finally started to show signs of halting, Krausen falling, wonderful smell from the airlock. That's right, I am a proud airlock sniffer!

But I know that looks can be deceiving. The real test is going to be this saturday. I normally do not use a secondary vessel but since I've been planning an IPA I have some dry-hopping to do. This weekend will mark 14 days in the primary, plenty of time for frementation to do its thing plus a little rest for clearing. I plan to rack into secondary soon and that will be my chance at taking a gravity reading and taste testing. I'll post some results soon.

Like I stated above, attempting to add missing DME after the fact may be and old trick to experienced brewers like the Yoopers and Revvys and Deathbrewers out there...or it may be a well documented no-no. But this is my first time making a mistake like this and I'm really curious to see what will come out of it. Also, if I couldn't find a similar thread I'm betting a new brewer would have an even harder time so if someone can learn what to do (or what not to do) in this situation then at least I can feel like I'm giving something back to HBT.

Here goes nothin'!

-Tripod

Well. I've subscribed to this thread.

It's time for an overdue update on this attempt to fix a broken batch. It ended up being Sunday before I could get around to dry-hopping and testing the batch but what I found waiting for me was very nice!

First of all, the scent coming from the carboy was heavenly...first test = pass!

Having no reason to believe things are ruined, I decided to move forward and start racking to the secondary. Looking through the hose, I found the liquid to be very clear and light in color. Not at all suprising considering how low the OG reading was (1.030 before adding the remainder the next day). No cloudiness and nothing weird or off-color floating around...second test = pass!

The specific gravity was going to be the big question for me. I'm sure the addition of the missing DME added something to the OG but exactly how much?? I decided to consult Palmer's How-to-Brew to find a simple equation for calculating gravity. There is a section here that describes bittering calculations. The first step is to find out the gravity of the boil which is directly dependent on the amount of water and the amount of DME or grains added. Palmer also says "dry malt extract typically yields about 40 pts/lb./gal" so that will be added to our equation. The formula is:

OG = (amount of DME or grains) x (gravity points) / (boil volume)

In my case, the late addition was 3qts with 3lbs of DME, so...

OG = 3 x 40 / .75 = 160 which translates to 1.160.

Remember, this 1.160 is not the OG of the entire batch. I added 3qts of OG=1.160 to the other 5 gallons of OG=1.030. I don't really know what I ended up with for the OG of the entire batch and since the yeast were already working I didn't want to use the thief to grab a sample. Certainly the OG went up but I don't know how to calculate exactly how much.

Time for a gravity reading to see where this ended up. I used a thief to take a sample and the trusty hydrometer said 1.008 for the FG. I made beer! No matter how you slice it, my FG was much lower than the OG so beer has been produced! Third test = pass

The final test I could do for now was a taste test. While the rest of the beer was racking to the secondary, I drew a sample and let it chill for a bit in the fridge. I went ahead and finished up the transfer and add the 1.5 oz. of Sterling I was planning for the dry hop addition. The hops had been in the freezer since the botched brew day so they were ready to go by this time. Hops addition completed, top and air-lock in place, brew moved back to the fermetation chamber...on to the taste test.

I am very pleased to announce that the flavor was fantastic! No crazy oders or off flavors at all, it tasted exactly as expect. The one thing that is way off is the body/mouthfeel which was very light and comparitively watery. To be expected, of course, with a FG of 1.008. But I can't complain at all and the flavor was right where I wanted it to be so fourth test = pass!

I'll let it sit for another week or maybe two to dry-hop and then bottle. I really can't wait to see how the final product comes out but I'm hopeful now that the first round of testing went well. If things are still good at bottling time, I'll have to remember to save a sixer and then brew the same recipe but right this time. Then I can compare both versions side by side.

-Tripod

It will be fine, I'm confident!

Me too! The results so far are grand. Hence the title "I did NOT ruin my beer".

This is coming across so far like a Light IPA. Not heavy at all and very quaffable but the flavor profile is pretty close to what it should be. I'll know for sure once it is bottled and matures a bit.

-Tripod

If I'm doing my math right, the effective OG of your beer was 1.047. Someone correct me if I'm doing this wrong, but what you do is convert to gravity points, which are given by (volume)x(SG-1).

So you had (5 gal)x(30 GU) = 150 from your boil. Your addition was (0.75 gal)x(160 GU) = 120. You ended up with 270 gravity points in 5.75 gal of wort. 270/5.75 = 47 GU, which corresponds to an OG of 1.047. Since it finished at 1.008, that gives you a 5% ABV beer. Sounds good to me!

That's where the math gets fuzzy for me. I'm actually pretty good at math but I'm not positive if the above method is the correct way to calculate the total gravity from two different worts that are combined. I'm not saying you are wrong...just that I don't know for certain. That's what I'm here to discover.

My instinct is to use the same equation I used before which came from Mr. Palmer. That again is:

OG = (amount of DME or grains) x (gravity points) / (boil volume)

If that is correct then I started with (3) x (40) / (5 gallons) = 24 or 1.024. I'm certain my reading was not at 60*F which is where the hydro likes to be. It was more like 78*F so I'm not surprised that my reading (1.030) doesn't precisely match the math on that one.

The second mini-wort was (3) x (40) / (.75 gallons) = 160 or 1.160. I'm fairly certain I can count on that one but I didn't take a reading, I'm going purely on the math here.

So the big question is how to combine the two? If I add the two and then divide by the total volume like you did in your example, I'll get [(.030) + (.160)] / 5.75 = 0.033 or 1.033.

If that holds true then my gravity still dropped but my ABV is closer to 3.25% than 5%. I made beer so I'm not concerned at all. But I am seeking knowledge so If there is a mighty guru out there who knows for certain how to work the math on combining worts of two different gravities then please enlighten us all!

-Tripod

What you have to remember is that specific gravity is a measure of density. You're trying to figure out your average density of your combined mixture. But you can't just add densities and expect the result to come out right. Take the way you tried to combine them:
0.75gal of 1.160 added to 5gal of 1.030
You tried (160 + 30) / (5+0.75). But using that approach, you would get the exact same result if you tried adding 5gal of 1.160 to 0.75gal of 1.030.

In physics, when you want to figure out the average density of a material, you add up the total mass of it and then divide by volume. In the case of specific gravity, you want total gravity units divided by volume.
0.75gal of 1.160 has 160x0.75 = 120GU.
5gal of 1.030 has 30x5 = 150GU.
So your total gravity units (think of it as total amount of sugar content) in your wort is 120+150 = 270GU.
To go to specific gravity, just divide the "mass" by the volume: 270/5.75 = 47. So you have an OG of 1.047.

DocBrown said:

What you have to remember is that specific gravity is a measure of density. You're trying to figure out your average density of your combined mixture. But you can't just add densities and expect the result to come out right. Take the way you tried to combine them:
0.75gal of 1.160 added to 5gal of 1.030
You tried (160 + 30) / (5+0.75). But using that approach, you would get the exact same result if you tried adding 5gal of 1.160 to 0.75gal of 1.030.

In physics, when you want to figure out the average density of a material, you add up the total mass of it and then divide by volume. In the case of specific gravity, you want total gravity units divided by volume.
0.75gal of 1.160 has 160x0.75 = 120GU.
5gal of 1.030 has 30x5 = 150GU.
So your total gravity units (think of it as total amount of sugar content) in your wort is 120+150 = 270GU.
To go to specific gravity, just divide the "mass" by the volume: 270/5.75 = 47. So you have an OG of 1.047.

Click to expand...

Excellent info! So your original calculation makes more sense the way you stated it here. Also, I was misreading gravity units as gravity points in your other post so it threw me for a loop. It wouldn't be the first time!

Gravity Units = (volume)x(SG-1)

So where did you come accross the equation for that? Or is that common knowledge that I've somehow overlooked?

I believe that came from Ray Daniel's book "Designing Great Beers." It's an excellent book to have on the shelf, especially if you're trying to formulate recipes.

I'll definitely add that book to my ever expanding library. Thanks for the tip!

I did a little more digging on the subject of blending and came across this site on "Blending and the art of salvage". I was hoping to find some equations but the author describes in detail how he adds a portion of a botched raspberry brown ale that came out too acidic with another wort of contrasting attributes with the idea of blending the two into a salvaged final beer. Sound familiar?

Although the exact equations are not listed, he does reveal the amounts and SG of both volumes to be blended and gives the balanced outcome. I ran those numbers though the equations above (thank you DocBrown!) and they are spot on.

So the technique is:

[1] Use GU = (volume)x(sg-1) to get the GU of the first wort.
[2] Use GU = (volume)x(sg-1) again to get the GU of the second wort.
[3] Use GU1 + GU2 to get a Total GU.
[4] Divide Total GU by the Total Volume to get a new Equivalent SG.

In my example:

[1] GU = (5)(30) = 150
[2] GU = (.75)(160) = 120
[3] 120 + 150 = 270
[4] 270 / 5.75 = 47 or 1.047

So we've proven mathmatically that the gravity increased by my salvage attempt of adding the missing 3 lbs. of DME after the fact. As expected, it did not come up to the 1.055 or so I originally planned for. But an increase of 17 points was definitely worth the effort.

I think it is safe to call this salvage attempt a success! And I learned something out of the process, too so I am effectively a better brewer now.



Thank you DocBrown and thank you HBT! I'll post some photos of the final product on bottling day...

-Tripod