My FULL-ON electric build thread

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well... i use a much cheaper... say ghetto way to do this... i use two heating elements for my boil kettle (240 volts) with a dimmer switch for lights on each leg of 120. works ok for temp control for mashing. Though I just use straight connections for my boil kettle due to the fact that these dimmer switches cant really handle the wattage for that.

You lost me... ...a dimmer switch or do you mean a variac or maybe an infinite control thingamabob?
 
Though I just use straight connections for my boil kettle due to the fact that these dimmer switches cant really handle the wattage for that.

Does the dimmer work for you? Does it get hot? Most are not able to handle much more than 300-1000W, I think. I would think the triac inside would get mighty toasty with these higher powered heating elements.
 
The dimmer switch that is used for lighting in residential applications basically cuts voltage to the lights by rapidly shutting the voltage on and off and off at whatever speed you choose... i use these for the mashing tun to keep a relatively constant temperature.. though these dimmer switches cant handle high wattage so under 600 watts per leg of power is max.
 
The dimmer switch that is used for lighting in residential applications basically cuts voltage to the lights by rapidly shutting the voltage on and off and off at whatever speed you choose... i use these for the mashing tun to keep a relatively constant temperature.. though these dimmer switches cant handle high wattage so under 600 watts per leg of power is max.

Still a bit confused... ...so if you turn them up too much then the dimmer switches melt or make pretty fireworks? Or they just don't work?
 
like i was saying just maintaining the temperature an not for heating. otherwise i think they might melt. But i closely monitor it myself and only turn it on when the temp begins to drops because i have not built any kind of thermostat for it yet.
 
they wont allow passage of enough electricity really to work past a certain point in my experience wont allow it to fully heat... though i am not 100 percent sure on the specfics of how this works... only a jack of all trades... but master of none.
 
Looks good, but where's the picture of that "Sweet Wort" being boiled? ;)

Here you go, fresh pictures from my brew currently in progress:

Steeping the grains.

ElectricBrewTwoSteep.jpg


And the boil rolling along. Built a $0.99 hop filter since this beer has quite a few ounces added. The 4500W element is kept at about 60-70% to maintain a nice rolling boil.

ElectricBrewTwo.jpg
 
Here you go, fresh pictures from my brew currently in progress:

Steeping the grains.

ElectricBrewTwoSteep.jpg


And the boil rolling along. Built a $0.99 hop filter since this beer has quite a few ounces added. The 4500W element is kept at about 60-70% to maintain a nice rolling boil.

ElectricBrewTwo.jpg

That's better. :rockin:
 
@TheFlyingBeer - Q on your element design ... i just built mine up over the weekend and had some issues sealing the element-to-box cover transition tight enough to not leak without squishing out the silicon o-rings. Right now I've got one o-ring on the element, then thru the cover plate and another o-ring before screwing into the tri-FPT collar.

I'm wondering what you did ... I've seen a few different solutions - one used large washers to keep the o-rings in snug, another used hi-temp silicone sealant - which kinda defeats the purpose of the o-rings.

Tonight I may try not using the o-ring between the coupler and the box cover and see what happens. One caveat to using two o-rings ... the element housing is completely isolated, meaning ground does pass thru to the vessel which I discovered during ground test checkout.
 
I love it when engineers post their brew designs (I'm an EE student)! Nothing like a little CAD to brighten your day!

I'm a little confused about how you'll use the system for sparging. Will V1, V3, and V4 be open with the rest closed so that P1 moves water from the HLT to the MLT and P2 from the MLT through the CFC to the BK? My personal preference (although I have zero practical experience, only lots of forum lurking) would be to plumb an additional line from P2 to the BK so you can bypass the CFC. Why did you choose this particular design?
 
I'm wondering what you did ... I've seen a few different solutions - one used large washers to keep the o-rings in snug, another used hi-temp silicone sealant - which kinda defeats the purpose of the o-rings.

I'm on travel for a month so I can't share any pictures on how I sealed me element for the brews a couple weeks ago. I wasn't completely happy with my setup but it work... I used a o-ring on each side of the junction box and then applied a thin layer of 100% silicone sealant around the hex head of the element inside the junction box just to be safe. I also applied a bit of silicone to the threads before I inserted them into the locknut. Going to be looking for some larger rubber/silicone flat washers/gaskets to replace to o-rings.

I love it when engineers post their brew designs (I'm an EE student)! Nothing like a little CAD to brighten your day!

I'm a little confused about how you'll use the system for sparging. Will V1, V3, and V4 be open with the rest closed so that P1 moves water from the HLT to the MLT and P2 from the MLT through the CFC to the BK? My personal preference (although I have zero practical experience, only lots of forum lurking) would be to plumb an additional line from P2 to the BK so you can bypass the CFC. Why did you choose this particular design?

I'm a EE by education, employed as a systems eng. The plumbing on page 1 was one of my initial designs and was made with the goal of reducing the number of valves I needed as they were one of the more expensive components in my brewery. Since then I have updated my design and I ordered an extra valve to accommodate. Below is a newer drawing of what I plan to implement:

HERMSv0.8.jpg


This will leave the plate chiller out of the equation until it comes time to actually chill.
 
Looks sweet man. I was lucky enough to snag a slc500 from work and start going at it.

DSC00249.jpg


DSC00250.jpg


Heres just a rough mock up of the HMI
HMI.jpg
 
I have by no means abandoned this effort... My time spent on work travel has exceeded the originally expected duration. In the mean time I have been able to slowly develop some of the micro controller and the LabVIEW code. The HMI motherboard, CPU, memory, and accessories have been ordered and should arrive before I return home.

As soon as I return home the stainless table and sink will be ordered. The final touches to my new brewing room should only take a couple weeks to complete, then the real fun begins.
 
Finally an update.

UPS brought me a bunch of big and shiny things today:

Large stainless sink with drainboard with a lever operated drain and a jointed swivel faucet. Going to be adding a 5-6' hose and nozzle to the top of the faucet.
new_sink.jpg


The two work tables that will serve as my stand and control/power panel mounts.
brewery_mockup1.jpg


I hope to finish the plumbing this weekend and get that sink up and running. The drywall and other finishing is nearly ready to go as well.

While waiting for the sink and tables I have been working on parts of the mcu code and HMI. Below is a shot of the PC and touchscreen running.
brewery_pc1.jpg
 
Where did you get that sink at? Just wondering as I shop for mine. I would love a drain shelf to the left...

Sink is from eBay. There are a number of sellers that carry the same sinks in a ton of different possible combinations. I ordered a sink with the drain shelf on the left but they shipped me the wrong model. It actually works out a little better for me so I am not too angry.

They come in 15x15, 18x18, and 24x24 bowl sizes. Mine is the 18x18, it can fit a whole sanke.
 
Nice! I'm also an EE by training (tho I've spent my entire career in software), and this is very similar to the setup I wish to build. Tho I hadn't considered LabView - mostly because I don't have access to it!
 
Tho I hadn't considered LabView - mostly because I don't have access to it!

Luckily I can build executables that run without a full LV installation on the brewery PC.

... how do drain the sink ? Is that a sump pump ?

I actually changed a lot of the plumbing around in my basement because: 1. needed to run a drain and a couple water lines to the brewing room, 2. old plumbing was not that great. Tomorrow I will be finishing up the plumbing to the sink. I was lucky the storage room I am turning into the brewing room was near both my laundry room and my main electrical panel.
sinkplumbing.jpg


That is actually a picture of my old sump pump which was in drastic need of replacement. Yesterday I installed a new fully submerged pump and cover.
new_sump1.jpg


I don't plan on using the sump as a drain unless I am washing the floor or have any major spills.
 
What does that slc500 usually cost?

It all depends, you usually can get the rack and power supply under 100$. The processor depending on the version can be 50-100+. Your regular input output cards are cheap, anything analog will drastically jump up. The biggest expense will be the program for the plc, logix 500. RSLogix 500 starter is around 500$ and RSLogix Standard is around 1200$ and Professional is 2000+.
 
Yea, but ebay can be your friend.

You can find the software there and pretty much anything you need to get going.
 
As far as the control system (my main push right now) I plan to use a PC running LabVIEW or custom SW to perform all of the top level control. I have a 15" touchscreen LCD that will be used as the operator interface. The PC will communicate with a microcontroller board I am building to provide all of the low-level system interfaces such as switch inputs, SSR PWM, sensor reading, etc.

tell me more about this microcontroller board you mentioned. I am trying to get away from allen bradley equipment and move to cheap computers and java.
:mug:
 
tell me more about this microcontroller board you mentioned. I am trying to get away from allen bradley equipment and move to cheap computers and java.
:mug:

http://arduino.cc/en/Main/ArduinoBoardSerialSingleSided3

You can build your own microcontroller pretty cheap, Im not sure what the OP is doing, but arduino is a nice and cheap platform to go with. I believe the programming language is C++(not sure that site should let you know, they might have their own).
 
tell me more about this microcontroller board you mentioned. I am trying to get away from allen bradley equipment and move to cheap computers and java.
:mug:

For this project I decided to try out a newer development kit that uses an Arm Cortex-M3 32bit mcu
lpcxpresso
. I purchased the LPC1768 version for around $25. Shortly after the purchase NXP had a contest and a survey to fill out which netted me two free LPC1114 Cortex-M0 boards:rockin: Might use one of those for a keezer/fermentation temp controller. These are overkill for what I need them to do but it is always fun to learn something new.

The demo board has two halves, the first is a JTAG debugger/programmer the second is the "target" or microcontroller. It is programmed in C with all the software needed to create basic programs included.
xpr_lpc1768_350.jpg


I will be creating my own base circuit board that the LPCXpresso board will mount to inside my HMI. The base board will break out any peripherals or signals I need and mate them to proper connectors.

I already have the code in place for three channel PWM control of my SSRs after reading in a value from the front panel potentiometers while in manual or hand mode. Last week I finally got the 1-wire master code working so I can read in temperatures from my DS18B20 digital temp sensors. Still a lot more work to be done with this.
 

ok... maybe i missed this but are you doing gravity feed or how do you pump water from your HLT to you your MLT then to the BK? the only pump is after the BK

If you have found a way to do this with valving i would be very interested... could save me a pump!

PS: great build!!! make my plans of a 100A 4 element build seem like cake.:mug:
 
jtsims21: I think close valve2, open valve1, turn on pump1. But how difficult will priming the lines be?

My biggest question is how do you sterilize the path from boil kettle to the fermenter?

do you during the boil recirculate through v5 and v6 for a while and then through v5 and v7?
If so, how is from v4 to where v5 connects sterilized?

Its probably just how im looking at the diagram, im not the best at reading them!

Looks awesome btw, really peaking my interest in starting a full electric build myself!
 
the only pump is after the BK

There are two pumps in my plan. P1 is between the HLT and the HERMS tank.

jtsims21: I think close valve2, open valve1, turn on pump1. But how difficult will priming the lines be?
I am have some very rough designs put together for a homemade peristaltic pump I plan to build... soon as I figure out how to build it. I really like the idea of determining how much has pumped and peristaltic make that super easy.
My biggest question is how do you sterilize the path from boil kettle to the fermenter?
V4, V5, and P2 connect together with a small 3/4" Triclamp Tee. I currently just plan to circulate/whirlpool through V5 and P2 before the end of the boil the tee should be pretty good after that. If I need to I could pump boiling water from the HLT through V4 to the drain but I doubt it is needed.

So progress is very slow... who knew tying the knot would consume so much time and effort.

The brewing room itself is 90% finished with the electrical and plumbing installed. Exhaust fan and hood is in place and works great. Floor is epoxied and walls are painted. I must say, the big ol' sink was one of the best purchases I have made. Cleanup is much more enjoyable than I can ever remember.
2011-08-0100.33.14.jpg

2011-08-0120.29.22.jpg

2011-08-0120.29.52.jpg

Recovering from the honeymoon so I am working on the free part of the brewery: code/design. Below is an idea of the labview controls and indicators I have built for the HLT. I still have an enormous amount of work left ahead but I didn't expect this to be quick or easy.

HLT_Control.png


Trying to put off finalizing the lower level details of the HMI control board(s) until i have everything worked out, I don't want to make two revisions if possible.
 
The GUI mockups are rolling along so I thought I would post the current progress to get some feedback. I have implemented several of the controls and indicators in LabVIEW and they work well on the touchscreen.

I am trying to do this piecewise so most of the automated process control code will be added later but the GUI elements will reflect those abilities even if they aren't available.

Here's the current state of the design:

BreweryGUI-Overview1.PNG


The layout is pretty busy but there are lots of things that need to display status or be controlled. Thoughts/suggestions??
 
This looks incredible. I'm very excited to see how it all comes together! What type of control algorithm are you planning to implement for the pumps, elements, and valves?
 
This looks incredible. I'm very excited to see how it all comes together! What type of control algorithm are you planning to implement for the pumps, elements, and valves?

The ball valves are getting their own embedded control boards that handle the motor control and position feedback, I will send them a 0-100% command.
The pumps are still a major TBD part of the brewery, soon as I figure out the torque/power required to run them the motor selection can begin. I am hoping to use some large stepper motors as they are relatively easy to control and monitor position.
When the elements are in Hand or Auto mode they will be run by a SW controlled PID loop. In PWR mode they are run with a manually selected PWM duty cycle using a potentiometer on the front panel.

I'm SO incredibly jealous of your brewing room! Nice!

Thanks!
 
Nice build!

This might be a dumb question but how are you planning on tuning your PID loop? I was thinking about doing something similar but I couldn't decide if it would be worth the time to write some auto-tuning code or if I should just manually tune the loop. Just looking for other opinions.
 
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