if 90% are extract brewing. why the sudden rush to all grain ?

No i get that some guys want to make brewing into a hobby. I understood it when making the post. There isn't much hobby about extract brewing. But it seems like unless your all grain with elaborate setups and Blichmann conicals your looked down on. Happend to me when looking into a Home brewing club. "What method do you use ?" Oh your an extract brewer".....=0/ Even my LHBS asked me "So when are you going all grain ?" Good gods man i only have so much room in a NYC condo. Im an avid golfer and saltwater Kayak fisherman . My SWMBO would toss my glass carboy out the 10 story window if i bought more brew stuff lol.

When I started brewing I used extract only and I was really happy with the results. I moved to all grain because of cost and then I began to learn about how much more I could control with a mash involved. Either way you can make some great brew. The really nice about extract is the amount of time you can save on brew day.

BronxBrew said:

No i get that some guys want to make brewing into a hobby. I understood it when making the post. There isn't much hobby about extract brewing. But it seems like unless your all grain with elaborate setups and Blichmann conicals your looked down on. Happend to me when looking into a Home brewing club. "What method do you use ?" Oh your an extract brewer".....=0/ Even my LHBS asked me "So when are you going all grain ?" Good gods man i only have so much room in a NYC condo. Im an avid golfer and saltwater Kayak fisherman . My SWMBO would toss my glass carboy out the 10 story window if i bought more brew stuff lol.

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Geezus, you make it sound like you're a high school student being peer-pressured into doing drugs.

Just say no! :cross:

90% of me doesn't believe that 90% of brewers use extract

The fun in brewing beer, for me, is engaging in the FULL process... grain to glass. I prefer extracting my own sugars, using my own process, with my own recipes. Extract brewing became boring for me.

That said, I couldn't care less what others do. I've had some truly great extract beers. Fine.

BronxBrew said:

Thats really what my post was pointing at. It wasn't meant as a dig to AG or PM brewers. Its nice to see some "PRO" kits in extract form.

Was hanging out at my LHBS the other day. It seemed like almost everyone who came in that bought a brew kit. It was always extract. I expected this because of NYC. I wonder what the numbers are for the big 3 ? Northern ,Austin and Midwest ?

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I would imagine most kits bought are extract. I would assume that by the time people are brewing all grain they are making their own recipes in most cases.

I asked my LHBS (Seattle) this question and they said about 60% of their customers are extract brewers. Incidentally, 20% of their brewing customers are women.

BronxBrew said:

Thats really what my post was pointing at. It wasn't meant as a dig to AG or PM brewers. Its nice to see some "PRO" kits in extract form.

Was hanging out at my LHBS the other day. It seemed like almost everyone who came in that bought a brew kit. It was always extract. I expected this because of NYC. I wonder what the numbers are for the big 3 ? Northern ,Austin and Midwest ?

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I'm local to Northern and Midwest. Having spent a lot of time in the stores watching people shop it's kinda like a lot of things - those that spend the most time and get the deepest aren't necessarily the major economic driver.

Obviously there are people like me in the store often and spending reasonable amounts of money annually - but then there are huge numbers of people picking up kits or just starting out each year. They may not continue or they may only make a couple of batches a year - but they add up to a huge portion of the industry.

I'll ask next time I'm in the stores and see what they say. I bet they make more money off extract while spending more time on all grain (which from a businiess perspective means they should be pushing extract).

So I made one comment but here is another:

My MYLHBS owner,,, former professional brewer,,, brews almost only Extract brews...

Why did I make the leap?

I want to work in a brewery and I learn best by doing... The MATH and techniques I have read about are are only really coming together in my head as I do it....

I did two batches at the same time last weekend to "stretch" myself… when things go wrong I learn… The big thing I learned this weekend,,, something I am sure I knew but forgot was about DMS creation after the boil…..

I need that constant introduction and re-introduction to hammer some of this stuff into my little brain.

BronxBrew said:

No i get that some guys want to make brewing into a hobby. I understood it when making the post. There isn't much hobby about extract brewing. But it seems like unless your all grain with elaborate setups and Blichmann conicals your looked down on. Happend to me when looking into a Home brewing club. "What method do you use ?" Oh your an extract brewer".....=0/ Even my LHBS asked me "So when are you going all grain ?" Good gods man i only have so much room in a NYC condo. Im an avid golfer and saltwater Kayak fisherman . My SWMBO would toss my glass carboy out the 10 story window if i bought more brew stuff lol.

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Just for the record, you don't /have/ to use an elaborate setup full of expensive equipment to brew with grains. There's a picture somewhere on here I saw recently of Revvy's system, and it's a lot simpler than I would have guessed. And (correct me if I'm wrong here?) I think Yooper also uses a fairly simple system due to space limitations.

I think my first few AG batches were nothing more than a simple turkey fry bucket, a 5 gallon cooler, and a paint strainer bag.

There's no need for people to get high-and-mighty about the fact that they choose grain over extract though. After all, we are all still just making beer...

brycelarson said:

I'll ask next time I'm in the stores and see what they say. I bet they make more money off extract while spending more time on all grain (which from a businiess perspective means they should be pushing extract).

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Maybe they do, but I wouldn't bet on that.

I'm going to Northern Brewer in about a month, and I'll buy probably 4 sacks of grain, two wine kits, lots of yeast, and maybe some more kegerator supplies. I don't go in often (maybe twice a year?) but I stock up when I go in person. I also order a LOT of stuff online. I'd have to guess, but I'd say that I easily spend $750/year at Northern Brewer, and have yet to buy extract (or hops) from them. Actually, maybe I did buy some extract 6 years ago and I think I bought some hops from them last summer. But otherwise, it's "bigger" stuff like kegging gear, sacks of grain, even beer line. The last time I was there, I bought 50 feet of beer line.

neosapien said:

Just for the record, you don't /have/ to use an elaborate setup full of expensive equipment to brew with grains. There's a picture somewhere on here I saw recently of Revvy's system, and it's a lot simpler than I would have guessed. And (correct me if I'm wrong here?) I think Yooper also uses a fairly simple system due to space limitations.

I think my first few AG batches were nothing more than a simple turkey fry bucket, a 5 gallon cooler, and a paint strainer bag.

There's no need for people to get high-and-mighty about the fact that they choose grain over extract though. After all, we are all still just making beer...

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Revvy's is basic, Yooper's is not. She brews on a 10g electric system.

Yep, they all make fine beer if you pay attention to the principles. Conversely, you can make some shat beer on the bling-blingiest stainless steel system.

There's no doubt that you can improve consistency and convenience and speed by spending money on equipment.

[woops, there she is... ]

passedpawn said:

Revvy's is basic, Yooper's is not. She brews on a 10g electric system.

Yep, they all make fine beer if you pay attention to the principles. Conversely, you can make some shat beer on the bling-blingiest stainless steel system.

There's no doubt that you can improve consistency and convenience and speed by spending money on equipment.

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LOL. Yeah, that is most definitely not a simple system.

+1 to paying attention to the principles and being able to make blinged-out crap beer by ignoring them.

For me, I like to do extract brewing with specialty grains. I order all my kits from Midwest Supplies because of the freshness of the extracts. Personally I can knock out a 5 gallon batch in roughly 3 hours. For me I stick with extract for consistancy and ease. I will eventually try all grain but its only if I stumble upon cheap equipment. I have yet to taste an all grain brew and say i could never do that with extract. In fact, most all grain brewers i know talk alot of high tech nonsense and produce a beer that taste like teriyaki sauce. I kid you not. Supposed to be a coconut porter/ stout and it tasted like teriyaki sauce. Everyone else was fawning over the tech nonsense and saying how good it was. Most of them were just being introduced to home brew and specialty beers so i think they just said it was good becuase of what it was and not really how it tasted.

bobbrews said:

The majority of brewers are brewing via all grain.

The majority of beginners are brewing via extract.

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I think it's comments like this that that the OP was probably referring to, according to bobbrews if someone uses extracts then they are looked down upon as not a brewer - merely a beginner.

I think OP does not have facts to back up his claims.

The question should not be "Why the push to all-grain?" but "Why are 90% extract brewing when there are so many benefits to all-grain brewing?"

passedpawn said:

Revvy's is basic, Yooper's is not. She brews on a 10g electric system.

Yep, they all make fine beer if you pay attention to the principles. Conversely, you can make some shat beer on the bling-blingiest stainless steel system.

There's no doubt that you can improve consistency and convenience and speed by spending money on equipment.

[woops, there she is... ]

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Oh, my system is totally bling-bling now! But I started with a an old canning pot and extract brewing (doing partial mashes in my bottling bucket.) Then I went to AG, with the same old canning pot, a turkey fryer pot, and a MLT- all done on top of my stove.

There are photos of this on my profile, as proof!

But here's the thing- it's certainly more convenient for me to brew on my brewstand, instead of hauling stuff from the basement. And the pumps are nice, so I don't have as much heavy lifting. But the beer isn't any better than it was then. The equipment makes the brewing easier in many ways, but it does NOT improve the beer!

I happen to have done about 30 extract brews, never managed to make the all-grain jump. I've moved between countries a few times and every time I had to dump and rebuy all my gear except for my precious wort chiller, so it would have been pretty hard to part with AG gear over and over. Someday when I'm settled and have the space I'll dive all the way into AG. Go big or go home as I see it.

I've never used a kit and done most of my batches from converted AG recipes. Sometimes its a PM recipe, but most of the time its a steeped grains and plain light DME sugar base, with hop additions in the boil. I wouldn't liken it to cake mix, unless you only are starting with only half the mix...its not that far off from BIAB really. I've made good enough beer from extract that friends in Ireland were buying a lot bottles off of me when I lived there, and not because it was cheaper.

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So far this year I've done a hopped up Coopers IPA can, several steeping/extract batches, a PM or two and a whole bunch of all grain. Yep, still doing a little bit of everything...still learning from each experience...still not too concerned about how I'm "supposed" to be brewing!

I'll add my experience to the mix.

I started my habit when I received a Mr. Beer kit for X-mas a few years back. I tried it, I enjoyed the hobby, but after 4 batches, I found I spent more time waiting for beer than drinking it.

So I jumped into my first full batch of extract. Bought some cheap 5gal food-grade buckets and split a 6 gal batch into 2 3gals (one dry hopped). They turned out OK, but the Mr. Beer batches tasted better.

So I thought, lets try going to AG. I converted a free cooler to a mash tun, got a turkey-fryer and an extra (bigger) pot. Made myself a wort chiller, and picked up a bigger fermenting bucket.

I picked up the grains to try some Centennial Blonde Ale, and mashed away. Best beer I had made yet! The next few brews, i tweaked the recipe around to increase the ABV.

I'm on my 4th batch of All Grain: 3 variations of Centennial Blonde, and my first shot at Oktoberfest, and they have all come out terrific despite all my efforts in screwing up various steps

For those wanting to move to AG, it really isn't that expensive. I made the jump for under $150 (could have done it for around $100 if I didn't splurge for an extra pot and fermenting bucket).

I've calculated my total expenditures at $419 (started kegging recently) , while my savings of not buying commercial beers has reached $200. Had I not started Kegging, I'd have made my money back already, but then again, I didn't get into it to save money

I do it all, keg, bottle, extract, and all grain. I love brewing all grain outside, but it does take more time and effort. My system is simple extract kits when I have 3 hours on a weekday to keep the pipeline flowing, and then when I can spend a weekend day outside I brew a unique all grain recipe that I make from scratch. To me it's the best of both worlds!

Ug. How do these Extract vs. All Grain brewer debates keep getting started? I am sure its been said like hundred times already by others; who cares how you brew your beer, so long as delicious beer is the end result.

I don't see myself doing an extract brew again, but I would be lying if I said I have not been tempted. A 90 minute brew day would be great sometimes. I noted a few posters saying that all grain was twice the work for only marginally better beer, but I would argue its not that much extra work. Warming up some water, putting grain in it and ignoring it for an hour is hardly difficult. It is definitely more work no doubt, but not twice the work.

And I haven't used my Extract Vs. All grain picture for a while...

Bradinator said:

And I haven't used my Extract Vs. All grain picture for a while...

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Love it! (...and, stolen!)

Ive been brewing for over 20 years. My first beer was an Original Brew in a bag. The BREWKING from Kirkliston Scotland.This was a bag that contained some sort of DME and yeast. You poured boiled and cooled water into a spout and capped it off and let it sit for two weeks as the bag swelled up. It was next to imposable to gag the stuff down, and I never tried it again, but it started me down the road to brewing. I did extract exclusively for about 16 years happily, without knowing the all grain world existed. I used ingredients sent through the mail. No internet then, you had to call the suppler on the phone and work out a recipe. But most importantly, I made great beer! I learned the process, worried over fermentation temps, sanitation, secondaries, fruit additions, various priming methods, the whole lot. Then about 7 years ago I started listening to Basic Brewing Radio Podcast, and started learning about a world of brewing that was so beyond what I had been doing. My universe expanded and my brewing became more complex. But the beer was still great. My brew day was longer, more complicated, and the cleanup was also expanded, but the beer was still great. Perhaps better, certainly more diverse, but great none the less. Then I heard Jamil Z. say that he didn't care about giving away his award winning recipes, because it was not the recipe that won the award, but the brewer. It was the skill of the brewer that made great beer. Extract, AG, PM, BIAB, it doesn't matter in the long run. Pay attention to the process, maintain fermentation temps, change one detail at a time to fine tune a recipe, and RDWHAHB! Extract continues to be a great way to make great beer. After all, that is why most of us do this, because we wanted something more than the swill the BMC super factory's were churning out. If you come to a beer tasting with me, please, talk about extract brewing and your system. Im sure your beer is better than the BREWKING could ever be. And don't feel belittled in any way. Have patience with us nerds as we cant help ourselves. This "hobby" can be an all consuming thing. 'Nuf said.