12oz vs Bombers

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EdgeBrewer

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So a friend of mine and a successful local home brewer suggested I use bombers the next time I bottle for myriad reasons. Mostly because in his experience it carbed better and overall produced a better beer. Oh and it's about half the work on bottling day. Anyone care to way in?
 
Half the bottles to fill. Half the work. Half the bottle cleaning. Bottling is the only part of brewing that feels like work to me. Thats why i would suggest using 22oz bottles.
 
So a friend of mine and a successful local home brewer suggested I use bombers the next time I bottle for myriad reasons. Mostly because in his experience it carbed better and overall produced a better beer. Anyone care to way in?
 
For me the main reason is less bottles. I have been kegging exclusively lately and feel I need to start bottling some again (easier to give away). I have been in a dilemma myself though as to whether people really want to drink 22 oz of beer at a time. I guess what I am getting at is whether or not fewer bottles or larger volume of consumption are on your mind. I have not noticed any major difference in quality between the same beer in 12 or 22 oz bottles though.
 
I started out kegging, but lately have been using 750ml flip tops, my LHBS has them for $25/dozen. The flip-tops reduce the bottling by one step (no capping), which is nice, but I have to keep an inventory of who's got my bottles, which sucks. As for the volume, I feel like if you're going to drink one beer, you might as well have 2. Also, the size is great for sharing.

Clark
 
It depends on how many beer grubbing friends you have. If I'm making a brew to share or give away as presents then I use the 12oz'ers, or also if its a pretty heavy beer. 22oz is pretty much just easier on bottling day and requires fewer trips to the fridge to refill your glass.
 
I like 12oz bottles because I like to pour out of a bottle once if possible. I can do that with 12oz, plus they're easy to source from friends, they fit six packs, and you need to use 12oz if you submit to competitions.

As for the "it makes better beer", I'm not sure about why. I have never noticed a difference between my 12oz, 16oz flip tops, and 750ml bottles. I have bottled in all shapes and sizes on various batches and never noticed a difference. I have just got a 3L champagne bottle and am trying to get a 6L champagne bottle. So what I plan on doing is bottle a decent sized batch in all the sizes I have available in champagne bottles. I will have 375ml, 750ml, 1.5L, 3L, and hopefully a 6L. Then when I have a party I'll open then and see if there's a difference! Hows that for a size difference from 375ml to 6L?
 
When I started brewing last year I bought 24 bomber bottles with my starter kit. I used them on my first batch. Once I started collecting enough 12 oz bottles I found I like them better despite a little more work on bottling day. I don't get pissed if someone fails to return one and I have more flexibility in how much I drink. I now use the bombers for Apfelwein
 
I keg the majority of my brews but I have been slowly saving up bombers. To me the advantages are:
1. Less time to bottle a batch
2. They are better looking than 12 oz. When I want to gift some brew to someone it feels awkward giving them one or two 12oz, but a bomber ‘feels’ like a good gift.
3. The people I give them to are more likely to actually return a bomber bottle as compared to a 12 oz (same goes with ½ liter fliptops). It’s not like it’s hard to clean and delabel bottles, but I’d rather not have to do it more than I need to.
4. “Honey just one more” is actually “Honey Im drinking the equivalent of two more”
5. They are just cooler!

There is a pet peeve I have about bombers – when commercial breweries charge out the @$$ for them when compared to 12 oz. It’s insane to pay 8 dollars for a bomber when you can get a six pack for 12. The only commercial bombers I buy are when they are actually comparable priced to 12 oz or if it’s the only way a beer is released.
 
I bottle my more sessionable beers in bombers, and only for the fact it's less bottles to clean and fill. I don't exactly want to be stuck with 22 oz of an 11% abv RIS all for myself (or do I?).

I can't really ever say I've noticed any difference in taste or carbonation between the two though.
 
Let me throw out another option... How about the 16oz bottles?

I have been thinking about starting to use 16oz bottles. I brew 3 galling due to apartment restrictions and have been using 12oz bottles typically. I hesitate using the 22oz bottles because I would just get angry at the small amount of bottles i would have after all of that work. So.... That's why I'm thinking about trying the 16oz bottles. A little larger, but not too big.
 
Ding ding ding we have a winner! 16 oz bottles are the shiz! I got two cases of Straub 16oz returnables filled with pumpkin ale right now. The boxes are real nice too! Its just unfortunate that the 16 oz bottle is not as prominant as it used to be. A good buddy drinks Straub and I kick him a few homebrews every now and then to convince him to buy the pounders and give them to me (empty of course)!
 
I started with only 22 ounce bottles. Now I use 12 oz bottles whenever possible.

I have noticed no difference in quality of carbonation or otherwise between different sized bottles.

I typically brew beers that are 7.5-10.5% ABV. And I like to have 2 or 3 different brews in a night. So, with 12 ounce bottles, I'm not lying passed-out on the floor after three different beers.
 
So a friend of mine and a successful local home brewer suggested I use bombers the next time I bottle for myriad reasons. Mostly because in his experience it carbed better and overall produced a better beer. Oh and it's about half the work on bottling day. Anyone care to way in?

WHat??? That's the silliest thing I've ever heard. There's no difference in carbing in a 12 ounce as opposed to a 22 ouncers except maybe that it takes longer to carb and condition in a bomber than a 12 ouncer.

But the only difference is that with a larger bottle you have less to fill, but it also means you have less bottles of beer to drink.....But with filling, if you have a good bottling process it shouldn't matter what size bottle you're filling. Or how many you have to fill. With a good process it should be no effort at all to bottle regardless of how many you have to fill.
 
Let me throw out another option... How about the 16oz bottles?

Thats what I use...I am going to get some bombers for gifts (as the previous poster pointed out, they feel more like a gift) but I started out with 16oz flip-tops from my first batch and I can never see myself going to anything else, except maybe kegging.
 
I use bombers for my ipa and lighter ales. My favorites are the 24oz SNPA bottles. I use 16oz flip tops for the bigger brews. Each batch I bottle I will bottle up 6-8 12oz bottles and keep these on hand for those who want to take a bottle home or want a gift to sample. 12oz bottles only cost me a dime and are easier to obtain than the larger bottles.
 
I use a wide variety of bottles and all work well.

I tend to use 12 ozers only for competition brews.

I also use growlers with the metal screw tops that have the rubber adhered to the inside. Caps with paper inserts or those plastic tops don't hold carbonation for me.

Folks say growlers are risky. I agree with this until brewers have their sanitation practices down. Once you've achieved consistent clean beer it works very well.

And I tend to undercarbonate my brews anyway (milds and bitters to 1.75 vol CO2; stouts and porters to 2 vol CO2, pales and ipas to 2.25 vol CO2). I use Palmer's How to Brew nomograph for bottling sugar calculations and it works like a charm (a thermometer strip taped to the outside of the carboy just prior to racking works well for me).

When I package higher carb'ed beer I stick with bottles (witbiers and random Belgians, pilsners, steam beers).

If your sanitation is very good, growlers are great (9-10 bottles per batch).

Hope this is helpful.
 
Sanitization has nothing to do with why growlers are a risk. They're NOT MADE TO HOLD CABONATING BEER. Carbonating beer and carbonated beer are not the same.

This is direct from northern brewer website:
Standard issue 64 oz liquid libation transport vessel for the Civilian Brewing Division. This growler features a blank white space for adding in details on the beer inside and date bottled; using a dry-erase marker allows you to change it at any time. Takes a #6 stopper or a 38 mm screw cap. Pressure capable to 2.4 volumes of co2, not recommended for highly carbonated beers. Avoid bottle carbonating or priming with these growlers, as an unintentionally high level of carbonation could cause the glass to break.
Civilian Brewing Division Growler : Northern Brewer

I would hate to see you have a mess.

There's always a few who say they have no problem, but folks also have sex without condoms- Or still smoke, despite knowing its risks.

To carb a beer whether or not is is done naturally or with co2 you are forcing the gas into the solution. The pressure builds up, then there's a point where either the bottle fails or the co2, seeking the path of least resistance, forces itself into solution. You could call it a peak point, where there is a lot of pressure in the bottle, both already in solution and in the headspace trying to go into the solution, eventually it balances out and the beer is carbed.

Beer bottles, champagne bottles and kegs are rated with a higher psi/volume of co2 than wine bottles and growlers.

Already carbed and kegged beer is at a stable volume of co2 which is below the volume that growlers and winebottles are rated at. The FORCING of the co2 already happened. Why do you think kegs are made of metal and very very strong? To handle the pressure.

Our Buddy Rukus

This is because during carbing, the pressure can go above 30 or 40 PSI. I have a thread in the cider forum where I did several tests bottle carbing sweet hard cider. There is allot of data there if your interested.

I have a bottle with a pressure gauge on it. I recorded pressures during the carbing process. This is how the data was generated. I also recorded pressures while pasteurizing the cider.

I recently bottled some lager I made. I also filled my gauge bottle and my lower pressure gauge bottle pegged at 35 PSI as that was the limit of the gauge. It probably ended up in the 40's, but no way to tell for sure.


When we bottle condition beer, we are really simulating force carbing like the keg folks do. We cause a ferment by adding sugar. This creates a high pressure in the bottle. CO2 doesn't like to dissolve in a warm liquid. We then put some bottles in the fridge. The temperature of the liquid drops and the CO2 then begins to dissolve in the liquid.

It seems to take several days at fridge temperatures for the CO2 to fully saturate the liquid for a maximum saturation for that liquid temperature.

While the CO2 is moving into the liquid, the pressure slowly drops. I've monitored this process as well with the pressure gauge.

Pressures go way higher than folks think while bottle conditioning. In the following data, I carbed sweet hard cider and stopped the carbing and then pasteurized the cider when the bottle was at 22 PSI. My Lager went above 35 PSI. The data doesn't show the extremes the pressure rises with beer as I stopped the cider at 22 PSI, but it would have continued if i hadn't stopped it.

The gauge bottle has a nice side effect, it tells you when your bottles are conditioned as the pressure rise stops. I then throw them in the Fridge to cold condition for several days before I open. The gauge also tells you when they are carbed as the pressure drop stops. Pretty basic really.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f32/bottle-carbing-idea-final-data-review-205862/

PressureTest-1.jpg

No, when you bottle condition, the slight fermentation we cause by adding priming sugar just builds pressure up in the bottle. The pressures seem to go up into the 30's and 40's PSI from what I've seen.

The CO2 doesn't really move into the liquid until the temperature drops. Some CO2 may, but not the majority of it. CO2 doesn't dissolve into solution until a lower temperature.

This is really what we do when we force carb in a keg. We raise the pressure up when the beer is cold. The CO2 moves into the solution. The tap pressure is lowered for proper delivery and the beer either sets for cold aging, or it is consumed at that time.

What you would see with the pressure gauge (if you use one bigger than my first bottle had. Should use a 100 PSI Gauge) is that the pressure climbs over time and will level off.

Once the pressure levels off, that means all of the priming sugar has been used up by the yeast. Next, you put them into the fridge. You will see the pressure drop over several days. Eventually, it also will level off. I like to let them sit for a few more days after that, but really if the pressure stops dropping, all of the CO2 that can be dissolved at that temperature has been achieved.
.

I think it goes down to this.....is it worth playing Russian Roulette with your money and the time you spent bringing your brew along from grain to bottling day???

For every guy that says they do it, we have 2-3 guys who posts threads like "Growler goes Boom"
 
I've found that the time difference between 12oz and 22oz bottles is only about 15 minutes per batch. I prefer 12oz for serving size so I usually bottle 3 or 4 24oz botlles and the rest in 12oz. YMMV. Cheers!
 
I was leaning towards bombers when I started for all the pros mentioned. But, a fellow seasoned homebrewer talked me out of it. 12oz'ers are just more readily available, more standard for 6-pack holders, crates, shelves in the fridge, etc...and easier to acquire. I also give them away and don't worry if I get them back.

I have about 2 batches worth of Grolsh bottles that I like, but only put long-agers in those. I'm glad I went with 12oz.
 
I got you, that would be the deposit price I am guessing. I was thinking new for .10, that would be fabulous.
 
I got you, that would be the deposit price I am guessing. I was thinking new for .10, that would be fabulous.

You are correct. That is the deposit price. I have several stores near me that will allow me to take their returnables for the price of the deposit + a bottle of homebrew. Sure beats $12+ a case for new bottles.
 
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