Element Wiring

Serious brain cramp = seriously stupid question: If you were wiring a 5500W element directly to a 4-wire 220VAC dryer plug, how would you connect it? Hots to the posts, ground to the keggle, what about the neutral?

Also, can 2 separate 120VAC outlets safely power a 220VAC element? Both hots to a terminal, grounds to keggle, same problem with the neutral?

You don't use it. It is used for 120v. Also, two separate 120v outlets might still be on the same pole. It would still yield 120v. I would make sure that they were linked circuits for safety reasons. If one breaker trips and not the other, you might presume it is safe because the power level seems to have stopped. In reality you would still have 120v flowing and looking for a path. Don't be the path!

McCuckerson said:

Serious brain cramp = seriously stupid question: If you were wiring a 5500W element directly to a 4-wire 220VAC dryer plug, how would you connect it? Hots to the posts, ground to the keggle, what about the neutral?

Also, can 2 separate 120VAC outlets safely power a 220VAC element? Both hots to a terminal, grounds to keggle, same problem with the neutral?

Click to expand...

Neutral is not used for 220v.

Simple answer... NO, don't try to power a 220v element with 2, 120v outlets.

Ed

McCuckerson said:

Also, can 2 separate 120VAC outlets safely power a 220VAC element? Both hots to a terminal, grounds to keggle, same problem with the neutral?

Click to expand...

Safely? No. But possibily? It depends.. the hots would need to be coming from separate circuits that are each from one of the 2 bus bars in the main panel. They would also need to be of the same amperage. I don't recommend it.

The two 120 VAC outlets are probably driven from the same phase of the 220VAC feeding the house. The result would be 120VAC, not what you are looking for. Running a 220V source directly to a heating element of of a 30 or 50 Amp breaker without a disconnect, other than the plug in the outlet is just plain UNSAFE!

This is why there is a National Electric Code. Your boil kettle needs to be grounded (remember ground and Neutral are two different things). The Neutral is provided in the Dryer Circuit because most modern dryers utilize 120VAC controls.

Please, build a control panel, even a rudimentary one to do this.

Thanks guys! I will not try it.

Dunerunner said:

... Please, build a control panel, even a rudimentary one to do this.

Click to expand...

Do you guys recommend a disconnect in the control panel? I brew within 6 feet of the breaker panel in my garage and I thought I would use the breaker as the switch.

McCuckerson said:

Do you guys recommend a disconnect in the control panel? I brew within 6 feet of the breaker panel in my garage and I thought I would use the breaker as the switch.

Click to expand...

Only if it is a GFCI breaker. If it isn't you can replace it with one and you'll be fine. I prefer not to use the breaker to switch the panel on and off though because it wears out the breaker over time.

McCuckerson said:

Do you guys recommend a disconnect in the control panel? I brew within 6 feet of the breaker panel in my garage and I thought I would use the breaker as the switch.

Click to expand...

I use a spa disconnect panel for GFCI protection near the wall receptacle, but on my brew stove, which is some distance away, I have one of these (actually, mine is made by Square D, but is basically the same):
http://www.lowes.com/pd_12587-1318-...nect&pl=1&currentURL=/pl__0__s?Ntt=disconnect

This allows me to turn power on and off without wearing out a breaker, and also gives me an easy to reach emergency off switch.

Are your arms 6 feet long? If not I'd go with a disconnect/switch within reach of your brewing rig.

samc said:

Are your arms 6 feet long? If not I'd go with a disconnect/switch within reach of your brewing rig.

Click to expand...

No, but I am very quick Good point, would this go in the control box on the brew rig? Would it cut all power, or power to the element, BK etc....? I really shouldn't be messing with this should I?

Couple points here:
- Couple codes use "line of sight" or "visual" on the disconnect. So, since your panel is close by, that is good.
.....but....
- Garage is considered a "wet" location. Outlets protected by GFCI.
....but...
- Bottom line is replace that breaker with a GFCI breaker. Sure, it's gonna hurt ($$), but it adds that extra safety.

Now, if you really want to go gung-ho, add a knife blade (lever) disconnect next to the operation. Okay, just kidding, just swap out that breaker and replace with a GFCI breaker. Forget the disconnect in the control panel, BUT I would have an on/off switch. Many options on how to wire it.

Monster Mash said:

Only if it is a GFCI breaker. If it isn't you can replace it with one and you'll be fine. I prefer not to use the breaker to switch the panel on and off though because it wears out the breaker over time.

Click to expand...

Sorry if this is a hijack but, I was considering doing the same thing. Now, I'm not brewing within a few feet of the panel so, I wanted to put an inline switch. In order for me to 'replace' my breaker with a GFCI breaker, can I assume that I need to find one that is made to fit in the same spot as the one I'm replacing? Or, can I go with one somewhere else 'inline'?

Take a look at the make of the panel and match the breaker to it. So, GE panel gets GE GFCI breaker, etc.

Put your (brewing control) panel on a dedicated GFCI breaker (recommended over regular breaker). Then, you can run your whip from the point-of-entry to the panel. Your panelboard (control system) should have on/off switch. Could trigger a relay for the panel, etc. Many type of configurations. This way the circuit is protected by GFCI and you have an on/off or disconnect switch at your control panel.