Imperial Belgian Wit

Thinking about brewing this tomorrow. Any suggestions/Feedback?

8lb White Wheat
3lb 2-Row
1.5lb Biscuit Malt
0.75lb Flaked Oats
0.5lb Crystal 10L


0.50 oz Warrior Pellet (17.2% Alpha) @ 15 Minutes
0.50 oz Warrior Pellet (17.2% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes
0.5oz zest from a Valencia orange @ 5 Minutes.


Mash at 152 for an hour, Boil for an hour.

Ferment using WLP 410 (if available) WLP 400 if not.

Any thoughts/feedback? Thanks!

Nobody has any feedback? I was hoping to brew today so I'm a little bummed to see 50 views and not a single response....

Well for the record, this beer was incredibly delicious. If I did it again I would add some corriander seed and a touch of cinnamon at flameout and I think it would be spectacular.

OK, how about some post-brewed feedback? I'd say that you don't need the crystal malt, the yeast will give some nice sweet notes. Also, I'd use pilsner malt instead of 2-row, just to keep with tradition and style. And then use a lower AA% flavor/aroma hop for a smoother softer hop flavor. I like styrian goldings or czech saaz for some nice spice. What did the biscuit malt do for the recipe? What was your OG and FG?

Looks good to me.

slarkin712 said:

OK, how about some post-brewed feedback? I'd say that you don't need the crystal malt, the yeast will give some nice sweet notes. Also, I'd use pilsner malt instead of 2-row, just to keep with tradition and style. And then use a lower AA% flavor/aroma hop for a smoother softer hop flavor. I like styrian goldings or czech saaz for some nice spice. What did the biscuit malt do for the recipe? What was your OG and FG?

Click to expand...

The biscuit malt is designed to give a little more maltiness to the overall grain bill since I'm shooting for imperial but the style is generally really light. It was basically intended to add some body and mouthfeel. Also I love a nice orange hue on a beer rather than pale yellow.

OG was about 1.075 and FG finished around 1.010. Trying to decide if I want to mash higher for a sweeter finish or not. I really liked the dry finish but the beer was maybe a touch tart. served with a slice of an orange it was absolutely perfect, but I'm shooting for a standalone beer that doesn't need fruit on the rim of the glass to be fully enjoyed.

Thanks for the reply. I really want to make something like this.
Disclaimer: not thread jacking intentionally
There's a brewery near St. Louis called Charleville Brewery. They make a beer called "Triple Wit" that might be considered a imperial wit. It has an ABV of 9% and has tons of citrus, coriander, and crystal malt sweetness(at least I think it's from crystal malt, maybe caravienne). The first time I tried it I thought it was great, but since I started brewing I noticed some flaws in the beer that I want to fix. Firstly, it needs to be much drier as it's almost cloyingly sweet. And the orange and coriander flavor need to be toned down a bit. What it does have is great wit yeast flavor and a nice full body without an alcoholic taste.
I think I'm going to brew your recipe with a few tweaks. I'll mash at 154F which will give more body, but not necessarily more sweetness. Then use caravienne instead of crystal 10L, and maybe up to 1 lb. I'll use more orange zest and also add in just enough coriander so it's noticeable. I'll probably use some flaked wheat in place of the wheat malt.

Something like:

4 lb white wheat malt
4 lb flaked wheat
3 lb pilsner malt
1.25 lb biscuit malt
.75 lb flaked oat
.75 lb caravienne

1.5 oz styrian goldings 60 min
1 oz czech saaz 20 min

1 oz orange zest 5 min
.5 oz coriander 5 min

mash at 154F
pitch at 63F and let rise to 68F over a week.

Whadayathink?

Sounds really good to me. I definitely agree about upping the zest as that was the most significant place this beer was lacking. I like the idea of dropping the biscuit a bit but I might drop an entire half pound off of it so you get a pound each of caravienne and biscuit.

The only thing I'd be worried about with your recipe is having that much flaked wheat might lead to poor conversion because as I understand it has very low diastatic power. Might make for a VERY nice witbier flavor though if done correctly.

And honestly, I like the low mash temperature on this beer because I think a Wit needs to have a nice dry finish. Keeping the FG low I think is very important for that nice clean taste. But you have a beer in mind and it sounds like you're on a good track for it!

Oh and it's also worth mentioning; I'm not sure if you've brewed with WLP 400 or 410 before but temperature control basically doesn't exist. I've NEVER seen a beer ferment as hard as WLP400 on the last batch of this beer. I had my beer stored at a steady 65 degrees and it was easily 90 inside the carboy, it was literally hot to the touch they were cranking along so hard. I had 8" of headspace in my carboy and lost almost a half gallon to the blowoff tube as well. This yeast CRANKS.

So anyhow, thought that might be worth mentioning.

Good point about the amount of flaked wheat, and even wheat in general. I went and looked at my last belgian wit that I brewed, and it had more pilsner and less flaked wheat. I've never usedd WLP400 or 410, but I've used Wyeast 3944. The 3944 had a kraussen for two weeks, and I had to keep the blowoff tube on almost that whole time. Good to use a bucket on that yeast so that you can harvest the yeast off the top. Here's the latest version of the recipe:
5.5 gallons
OG:1.078
IBU: 25
5 lb white wheat
2.5lb flaked wheat
5 lb pilsner
1 lb biscuit
1 lb caraviene
.5lb flaked oats

1 oz Czech Saaz 3.2% 60 min
.75 oz Styrian Golding 4.3% 60 min
.5 oz Styrian Golding 4.3% 20 min

1 oz orange zest 1 min
.75 oz coriander 1 min

I'm sure I'll change this again before I brew it next Saturday. Can't wait for this to be ready.

Well regular wheat malt has fantastic diastatic power so it's not an issue, but flaked wheat is unmalted so it has basically none. Hence the reason my original recipe had so much more wheat than 2-Row. It's because wheat malt can easily convert itself so I felt the need for much less 2-row (or in your case, pilsner malt) so as to give it that hearty wheat flavor.

I'm brewing again tomorrow actually with a friend and they wanted to try my witbier recipe. I think I'm going to roll out something like this and see how it lands;

STATS:
Original Gravity: 1.070
Final Gravity: 1.018
ABV (standard): 6.8%
IBU (tinseth): 19.75
SRM (morey): 7.76

FERMENTABLES:
6 lb - White Wheat (43.6%)
3 lb - Pilsner (21.8%)
1 lb - Biscuit (7.3%)
0.75 lb - Flaked Oats (5.5%)
1 lb - Caramel / Crystal 10L (7.3%)
2 lb - Flaked Wheat (14.5%)

HOPS:
1 oz - Saaz (AA 3.5) for 60 min, Type: Leaf/Whole, Use: Boil
1 oz - Styrian Goldings (AA 5.5) for 15 min, Type: Leaf/Whole, Use: Boil
0.5 oz - Saaz (AA 3.5) for 5 min, Type: Leaf/Whole, Use: Boil

1.5oz Orange Zest 5 min.
.5oz Corriander 5 min.

Mash @ 152 for an hour, boil for an hour.

Also considering "Dry hopping" some more orange zest. Might keep reading before I decide to do that.....

BudzAndSudz said:

Also considering "Dry hopping" some more orange zest. Might keep reading before I decide to do that.....

Click to expand...

works great, but be sure that you have no pith with your zest. with a little time the white stuff will bitter your beer like no one's business.

What's your recommendation then for a beer like this? 1.5oz during the last 5 minutes and .5oz during dry hopping or should I go with an even ounce for both additions? How's the flavor differ from adding in the boil vs. secondary? Any issues with sterilization for adding the zest into the carboy?

i'd do 1 & 1. i'd even consider 1 & 2 if i had it on hand.

if you're getting your zest from a real orange, wash & disinfect it before scrapping then skin... and don't worry about it too much after that. the high alcohol content of your imperial will take care of what little is left there.

i'd be weary of using store-bought zest. most of what i've seen for sale has too much pith.

Ok, so this beer smelled AMAZING yesterday before going into the fermenter. Can't wait to see how it tastes after fermentation!

Next random thought; What about switching out the yeast a bit? I'm wondering how this exact same recipe would come out with a hefeweizen yeast. Or even get weirder than that and go with a WLP001 in a similar style as Blue Moon (I heard they use an ale yeast in a witbier recipe....)