New lager brewer: German Pilsner Recipe

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

Johnnyboy1012

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
161
Reaction score
4
Location
Hackensack
Hey guys,
I want to brew a German Pilsner and I heard the Wyeast Bohemian Lager Yeast 2124 does well at higher temps. I plan on fermenting in my closet which is consistently 58-60 plus I plan on putting the carboy in a shallow tub with 3 inches of water covered with a t-shirt and have a small fan blowing on the carboy to really keep it cold. With all that being said, I would like to get some feed back on my recipe and process because this is my first lager.

Grist is for 5.5 gallons:
10# 9oz Weyermann Pilsner
.5# Weyermann Carafoam

Hops:
1.10oz Perle 33.8 IBUs at 60 mins
.5oz Hallertauer 2 IBUs at 15 mins
.5oz Hallertauer 1.3 IBUs at 1 min

Estimated OG is 1.049
IBUs = 37
SRM = 3.2
Estimated ABV = 5.2%
I plan to make a starter and with the Wyeast Bohemian Lager Yeast 2124 and aerating my wort with a diffusion stone.

I will most likely brew with distilled water and add gypsum and calcium chloride to get my Ca to at least 50ppm. Most likely adding more gypsum then calcium chloride to emphasize the hops. I plan on leaving in my closet in the primary for a month, then kegging and moving to my kegerator to lager for another month. Thoughts?

How does my recipe look? Any suggestions for a first time lager brewer? (besides get a fridge!) I moved to an apartment and the ambient temp of my closet has inspired me to brew a lager. Thanks guys! Cheers!

JH
 
Sounds good to me, but I'd have some frozen 2L bottles handy in case ferm temp gets a little warm. I like to ferment lagers right at 50 deg, then perform a diacetyl rest when fermentation winds down.

With your planned set up with the tub of water adding ice should get you to 50 deg rather easily.

Good luck!

Edit: just noticed you plan on 3 inches of water, I would suggest more. I have a plastic tote that I use sometimes for temp control and I put water halfway up the fermentor. It was about $4 at a home improvement store, if you don't have one already.
 
Looks like a good recipe. I'm not sure about the expected ABV of 5.2% though..it seems a bit dry coming from an OG of 1.049. How are you going to mash it? I brewed a similar beer with this yeast and a double decoction mash, and I'm still waiting on it to get to 1.014 (OG 1.050)!
 
Ill be sure to keep some frozen water bottles around for sure. I plan on mashing at 147 for 90 minutes single infusion. Hopefully that will help dry it out and create a bunch of fermentables. Thanks for the help!
 
Looks like a good recipe. I'm not sure about the expected ABV of 5.2% though..it seems a bit dry coming from an OG of 1.049. How are you going to mash it? I brewed a similar beer with this yeast and a double decoction mash, and I'm still waiting on it to get to 1.014 (OG 1.050)!

How long has it been fermenting?
 
You could ferment it in your keg in the kegorator. That would save you a lot of trouble keeping the temp steady. Use the tap as an airlock.
 
tonybrewer said:
You could ferment it in your keg in the kegorator. That would save you a lot of trouble keeping the temp steady. Use the tap as an airlock.

Gas line not the tap
 
How long has it been fermenting?

For several weeks. I only have a 6 gallon BB carboy for lagering, so instead of finishing fermentation and then transferring after the d-rest like normal, I transferred first before the d-rest, hoping that the left over 25% of fermentation would generate enough CO2 to fill the headspace in the carboy and prevent oxidation on the large surface area of the beer exposed to air. I didn't think that taking it off the yeast cake would make it finish so slowly, but I was wrong. Last I measured it was at 1.018 last week, but is still bubbling ever so slowly though it has dropped bright. It's supposed to finish at 1.014. I'm going to take another reading today and if it hasn't finished I'm going to pitch some dry lager yeast to help it finish up before lagering.

Brewed on 12/14, after 1 week at 53 degrees, gravity dropped to 1.023, transferred to carboy and allowed temperature to reach 70. After another week gravity was only at 1.020. Another week later it was 1.018. It has been doing a diacetyl 'hibernation' ever since.

EDIT: After the 1.020 reading, I tossed in a little bit of the washed yeast from the primary bucket to help it get going as well.
 
For several weeks. I only have a 6 gallon BB carboy for lagering, so instead of finishing fermentation and then transferring after the d-rest like normal, I transferred first before the d-rest, hoping that the left over 25% of fermentation would generate enough CO2 to fill the headspace in the carboy and prevent oxidation on the large surface area of the beer exposed to air. I didn't think that taking it off the yeast cake would make it finish so slowly, but I was wrong. Last I measured it was at 1.018 last week, but is still bubbling ever so slowly though it has dropped bright. It's supposed to finish at 1.014. I'm going to take another reading today and if it hasn't finished I'm going to pitch some dry lager yeast to help it finish up before lagering.

Brewed on 12/14, after 1 week at 53 degrees, gravity dropped to 1.023, transferred to carboy and allowed temperature to reach 70. After another week gravity was only at 1.020. Another week later it was 1.018. It has been doing a diacetyl 'hibernation' ever since.
I understand your reasoning to try and prevent oxidation but I will say that I will learn from your mistake. Tanks for the heads up. I was planning on keeping the beer in the primary for 3-4 weeks. Thoughts on that?
 
I do have a Beer Meister kegerator that I can ferment in, but the highest temp it goes is 43 degrees and the lowest temp Wyeast lists on their site for their Bohemian Lager Yeast 2124 is 45. I would also say that when it kicks on, it is probably blows cold air that is below 43 degrees. Anyone think 43 would be too low?
 
I understand your reasoning to try and prevent oxidation but I will say that I will learn from your mistake. Tanks for the heads up. I was planning on keeping the beer in the primary for 3-4 weeks. Thoughts on that?

That should be totally fine. I wouldn't go any longer than 3 weeks though just because it already takes so long to enjoy the fruits of your labor for lagers. I would start the lagering as soon as it is ready. :mug:
 
I would go with the kegerator. Fermentation creates its own heat, so if you wrap the carboy in some bubble insulation it will probably be close to 50. In the upper 40s at least. That's what I do. Worst thing that will happen is it may take a little longer.
 
For my 1st and only lager, which was fantastic, I did ferment at 50ish until a few pts above predicted final grav (about 5 days). Brought it up to around 70 for d-rest for 3 days. Lagered in same better bottle for 6 weeks, force carb'd for a week. WOWZA. Only problem is I don't have any left. Good luck.
 
I would go with the kegerator. Fermentation creates its own heat, so if you wrap the carboy in some bubble insulation it will probably be close to 50. In the upper 40s at least. That's what I do. Worst thing that will happen is it may take a little longer.

Good thinking. I can wrap the carboy in a winter jacket or something like that. Sounds cheesy but whatever works right?? How long would you suggest leaving it on the kegerator? Until it slows then put it at room temp for d-rest? How long to d-rest? Once d-rest is over should I transfer to keg to lager or keep in primary for about 3 weeks total? Sry for the questions! Just a noob lager brewer that wants to get it right! Thanks for the help
 
From the threads here and noonans lager book, d-rest is meant to clean up the end of fermentation and help make sure you reach full attenuation. Generally people d-rest for about 2-3 days. I personally would just leave it in the primary, and lager in it also. Just for ease, until you are ready to force keg or bottle, etc. Either way, if you aren't up for the challenge, I'm in NJ and will take your wort!! JK, it will be great. I just wouldn't rush it since its not worth saving a few days/week or so if you can just get it perfect.

John
 
From the threads here and noonans lager book, d-rest is meant to clean up the end of fermentation and help make sure you reach full attenuation. Generally people d-rest for about 2-3 days. I personally would just leave it in the primary, and lager in it also. Just for ease, until you are ready to force keg or bottle, etc. Either way, if you aren't up for the challenge, I'm in NJ and will take your wort!! JK, it will be great. I just wouldn't rush it since its not worth saving a few days/week or so if you can just get it perfect.

John

Haha! So if I got this right I would ferment for 4-6 days until it starts to slow, then raise temp for d-rest for 2-3 days until fermentation is complete. Then I would just go right into lagering after only about 8-9 days of fermenting?
 
Thats the idea, depending on the amount of yeast pitched, the beer, the temp. etc. fermentation will take probably 5-14 days. I think its a good idea to probably leave it around ferm. temp for a few weeks for the yeast to finish, and clean up everything nicely, before lagering. More experienced brewers can chime in on why. I would primary for min. of 2 weeks before lagering, but I do what Yooper does which is always min. 3 week on primary.
 
Update on mine, just got a gravity reading of 1.014 so into the fridge it goes! The sample tastes really great, too.
 
Thats the idea, depending on the amount of yeast pitched, the beer, the temp. etc. fermentation will take probably 5-14 days. I think its a good idea to probably leave it around ferm. temp for a few weeks for the yeast to finish, and clean up everything nicely, before lagering. More experienced brewers can chime in on why. I would primary for min. of 2 weeks before lagering, but I do what Yooper does which is always min. 3 week on primary.

What about the d-rest? What I wanted to do was ferment around 50 degrees, then when I see primary starting to slow down warm it up a few degrees for d-rest. Then I'm unclear what I should do after the d-rest. Can I keep it at 60 degrees for the remaining time of the 3 weeks? Or can I leave it at 60 for the rest of primary?

Essentially, can I ferment at 50 for a week then raise it to 60 for d-rest, then leave it at 60 for the remaining two weeks?
 
Ideally I prefer to slowly ramp down my temps after d-rest about 1-2 degrees per day until I reach lagering temps in the mid 30s, then transfer to a corny and lager for 4 weeks minimum. Without strict temp control however that is obviously very difficult. You should be fine keeping it in primary at 60 until you're ready to lager, because fermentation is done and the yeast are just cleaning up. You might consider moving the primary back to your swamp cooler and lower the temp that way until you're ready to transfer.
 
Essentially, can I ferment at 50 for a week then raise it to 60 for d-rest, then leave it at 60 for the remaining two weeks?

That's pretty much what I did because it took so long to finish fermenting. It probably isn't the 'best' thing to do, but my hydrometer sample tasted great even though the beer had been between 65 and 70 for over 2 weeks.
 
I think what I decided to do is put the carboy in my kegerator that is set to 43 degrees. I will wrap it with a sweatshirt and my winter coat. I emailed Wyeast about Bohemian Lager Yeast 2124 to see if the yeast will still work at this temp because their site says 45 degrees and they said yes it will still ferment but it will just talk longer. So I plan on making a huge starter with 2 packs of yeast. I figure the temp of the kegerator is more stable then the temp of my closet. How long do you think it will take before I would need to complete a d-rest at this cold temperature?
 
Not a lot of experience with lagers on my side, but to the OP, I think you'll really love the Perle/Hallertauer mix. Yooper's Fizzy Yellow beer is a faux lager (maybe an "alegar"?) that I keep on tap for my BMC friends. I ferment it with US05 at 66-68F then cold crash it in one keg before racking to another for clarity. The Perle/Hallertauer blend on that beer really has it tasting lager-ish. And my light beer drinking friends love it.
 
I think what I decided to do is put the carboy in my kegerator that is set to 43 degrees. I will wrap it with a sweatshirt and my winter coat. I emailed Wyeast about Bohemian Lager Yeast 2124 to see if the yeast will still work at this temp because their site says 45 degrees and they said yes it will still ferment but it will just talk longer. So I plan on making a huge starter with 2 packs of yeast. I figure the temp of the kegerator is more stable then the temp of my closet. How long do you think it will take before I would need to complete a d-rest at this cold temperature?

Well, for me it took about 6-7 days to ferment about 75% of the expected amount (at 53 degrees), which is time for the d-rest. If I were doing it at 43, I would probably take a gravity reading at 10 days, and if it was around 1.020-1.025 then I would start my d-rest. If I had to guess I would say maybe around day 12? Someone with more lager experience than me would probably have a better guess.
 
Buy a wine/beer thief (less than $10 from most shops). Sanitize the thief and your hydrometer. The one I have is large enough for my hydrometer to slide in. Take a sample and read the hydrometer at the same time.

Empty the approximately 2 oz of beer into a small glass. If you are approx. 70-75% of the way to your FG, ramp your temp up for a D rest.

Final step ....

Drink your 2 ounce sample.
 
Good thinking. I can wrap the carboy in a winter jacket or something like that. Sounds cheesy but whatever works right?? How long would you suggest leaving it on the kegerator? Until it slows then put it at room temp for d-rest? How long to d-rest? Once d-rest is over should I transfer to keg to lager or keep in primary for about 3 weeks total? Sry for the questions! Just a noob lager brewer that wants to get it right! Thanks for the help

I usually leave it in the insulated primary for 3-4 weeks in the kegerator at 46. Then I do a d-rest for 7-10 days. I usually just take the carboy out of the kegerator and bring it in the house. My d-rest is probably in the mid to upper 60s. I then rack to a corny keg, and it goes back in the kegerator but this time in the low 30s to lager for 30 days or so.

I can fit 1 corny keg and a 5.5 gallon carboy or 2 corny kegs in my kegerator at the same time. My lager technique is just what works for my equipment.
 
Update: So my German Pils has been in the fridge at 48-50 degrees for 5 days now and I see that things are starting to slow down so I took a gravity reading because I've been reading that at about 1.020 you should do a diacetyl rest for a few days. I've been reading a ton of forums on diacetyl rests and people have many different opinions on the matter but from what I've gathered it wouldn't hurt to do one.

Like I said, I just took a gravity reading and it is 1.024. My question is, when I take it out of the fridge for a d-rest tomorrow, how long do I keep it at 60-65 degrees? Two, three days? How do I know it is done at that point? Would it hurt to keep out of the fridge for 7 days just to make sure it is done? I pitched at 44-45 degrees so I'm not sure yet if I need a d-rest but I'd rather be safe then sorry. Listening to Jamil, it didn't sound like he does a d-rest when he pitches at 44 degrees, but like I said, I'd rather be on the safe side. Any thoughts or suggestions on what I should do? I still have my sample I took for the gravity reading so I'll heat half the sample up to 140 and smell it for diacetyl. As of 5 minutes ago, the sample I took did not smell of any popcorn butter.

Sorry for all the questions, this is my first lager and of course I want to get it right!
 
Just do the d-rest for as long as it takes for your beer to finish fermenting. And do the smell test when it finishes. I'm excited to bottle mine..just a couple more weeks of lagering.
 
So do you think I should take it out of the fridge now? or Leave it until the morning? it was at 1.024-1.022. Today is only the 5th day into fermentation. Is it normal that my lager would be done so quickly at 48 degrees? I read some people say to just leave it in the fridge at fermentation temps for at least 3-4 weeks. I don't want to miss out on a d-rest though incase I need one. Thoughts?
 
I think that the d-rest will be quicker if you do it while they are still active. If you left it for 3-4 weeks, then I'm guessing they would probably take longer to clean up the diacetyl, since they had probably already settled to the bottom and started going dormant. I would go ahead and take it out of the fridge now.
 
I took it out of the fridge this morning and it is sitting at 58, and there is still a good amount of movement going on the in the carboy. Would a long primary (3-4 weeks) clean up diacetly without the need for a diacetyl rest?
 
I'm not sure actually. It is possible that long primaries at lager temps would clean it up, but the problem with that is the wait. You already have to lager the beer for so long, why drag it out even longer? Might as well just let it do the d-rest at room temperature so you can start lagering it.
 
Back
Top