Wyeast Activator pack California Lager stall out??

Ok, I think this is ok to post a new thread... still considered a newbie to the fourm so here it goes....


Yesterday (Sunday) I smacked the pack of Cali Lager Yeast... at lets say around 3pm.....

As of 11pm still no real puff in the packed showing, so i left it alone overnight...

got up this morn (monday 2/9) checked the pack and sure enough, still no growth in the pack... the yeast must still be good as the date on er was packaged the last week of December 08....

So I decided to make a starter for it before i left for work...1/3 DME to just a hair over a pint of h2o... let er cool and opened the activator pack andemptied contents....gave it a good swirl and put celophane over the top with a rubber band to secure it...

got home today... checked the mason jar I have the starter going in and no foam.. no expansion in the celophane... no nothing... but there was a thin layer of sediment at the bottom...

So I gave it a swirl again at about 5 pm today and there it sits...

Am i missing something... is it on the right track... should i just leave it alone? I would like to brew tomm (tuesday night) with this but any advice would be great! I dont want to ruin a 5 gal batch using this if its not sounding good?

Has anyone else ever had this prob>? with this strain? Help me guys and gals! thanks in advance

It sounds ok, but that seems like a pretty "light" starter. I use 1/2 cup DME to 2 cups water, and get about 1.040. I think your wort fermented out already. If you're really wondering, you can check the SG of the starter.

Most of the time, starters don't show much (if any) activity, but there should be more yeast on the bottom than you started with. Swirl it up again, just to make sure it hasn't quit on you.

I've used that yeast frequently (have a California common I just kegged Saturday) and it seems to act like other yeast strains.

so that is what i am attempting the cali common... I did the 1/3 cup as per the fella at my lhbs? is it screwed up now >? should i add any more? or leave it since i plan on brewing tomm?

No, it'll probably be fine. I just mentioned that your starter was fairly low OG, so that it might have fermented out really quickly. I guess the only way to know for sure if the yeast is viable is to check the SG.

Usually starters don't show much life, but since your smack pack didn't swell either, I'm suspicious that maybe the yeast froze at one point. It doesn't seem quite right to have super fresh yeast like that, and have no swelling in the smack pack, and no signs of life in the starter. One or the other, sure. But both seems weird. Again, though, it might have just fermented that small starter in a few hours, and you missed it.

Usually starters don't show much life, but since your smack pack didn't swell either, I'm suspicious that maybe the yeast froze at one point. It doesn't seem quite right to have super fresh yeast like that, and have no swelling in the smack pack, and no signs of life in the starter. One or the other, sure. But both seems weird. Again, though, it might have just fermented that small starter in a few hours, and you missed it.[/QUOTE]


so with that being said... if the yest did freeze somehow... would this specific activator pack be ruined so to speak?


and taking a sg reading... just give it a swirl and take a reading just like wort and then disguard it? or can i put it back in?


thanks yoop for all this quick reply action!

jahdrummin said:

Usually starters don't show much life, but since your smack pack didn't swell either, I'm suspicious that maybe the yeast froze at one point. It doesn't seem quite right to have super fresh yeast like that, and have no swelling in the smack pack, and no signs of life in the starter. One or the other, sure. But both seems weird. Again, though, it might have just fermented that small starter in a few hours, and you missed it.

Click to expand...

so with that being said... if the yest did freeze somehow... would this specific activator pack be ruined so to speak?


and taking a sg reading... just give it a swirl and take a reading just like wort and then disguard it? or can i put it back in?


thanks yoop for all this quick reply action![/QUOTE]

I wouldn't swirl before the SG- you want the yeast to fall out. I'd not put the sample back in- too much risk of contamination. I'd take a sample, and see if the SG is below about 1.018 or so. I don't know what your OG would have been- somewhere in the 1.030-1.036 range, I'd guess. But if it's lower than about 1.022, you'd know that at least something is happening in there and that the yeast is viable. If it's above 1.026, I'd consider that yeast a goner. You can wait until tomorrow to check it, if you can get some more yeast before you brew.

Now, I don't usually get so worked up about a starter. In this case, though, I'm just wondering what happened to your yeast. It should have puffed up that smack pack, and it should have easily fermented your starter. I've had starters, though, that have shown NO activity and been fine. But I've had a fair amount of yeast on the bottom.

ok... will check gravity in morn... post an update in PM for ya and go from there... thanks again for everything!

Erik

Yoop...

Just checked the Gravity...

freekin 1.050... I used 1/3 cup (maybe a touch more) and a pint and a half of h2o... just checked my notes....

so what do you suggest with all the info i have given?

is it a no go? sediment around the bottom of the 1/2 gallon mason jar... cloudy at the bottom around the edges... but when i hold it up... there is clearly no realy sediment in the center of the jar (possibly due to a raise in the middle of the bottom of the jar?)

and if a no go cause of crappy yeast... do i bring the data with the starter to the LHBS and ask for a replacement?

thanks again!

jahdrummin said:

Yoop...

Just checked the Gravity...

freekin 1.050... I used 1/3 cup (maybe a touch more) and a pint and a half of h2o... just checked my notes....

so what do you suggest with all the info i have given?

is it a no go? sediment around the bottom of the 1/2 gallon mason jar... cloudy at the bottom around the edges... but when i hold it up... there is clearly no realy sediment in the center of the jar (possibly due to a raise in the middle of the bottom of the jar?)

and if a no go cause of crappy yeast... do i bring the data with the starter to the LHBS and ask for a replacement?

thanks again!

Click to expand...

That sucks. You can swirl it alot tonight, and see if anything happens by morning. But, yeah, if nothing happens, contact the LHBS and see if they are willing to help you out. I mean, if the yeast is fresh, it was obviously mishandled. Whether it was prior to reaching them, or at the store, there is no way to know.

bummer... starter is fine at room temp right>? I have never had this happen before? what do you think could have been the problem to cause this? freezing during shipments or what?

jahdrummin said:

bummer... starter is fine at room temp right>? I have never had this happen before? what do you think could have been the problem to cause this? freezing during shipments or what?

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yes, room temperature is fine.

I couldn't tell you why- it could be because of freezing. But not necessarily. I live up north, and I don't even try to order liquid yeast in the winter. The online stores have it, of course, but last week it as -25 here. It would freeze in the truck, or on my porch, or in the warehouse.

Even if it froze, though, there may still be a few yeast cells alive, so don't give up quite yet! It may take off by tomorrow morning. Swirl it up and keep it at room temperature, and see what happens.

will do and will update tomm... thanks again..

hoping for the best
erik

I brewed 2 seperate batches of lager with 2112, and the activator pack swelled like any other yeast. I'd say from your postings, your going to need some new yeast. Sorry.

Get new yeast. I ruined a batch of Cal Common trying to coddle a bad smack pack. $7 yeast is a lot better than wasting a $40 batch.

And check the yeast pitching calculator on Mr. Malty - Cal Commons need big starters.

so i am at 1.050 still with the starter... more of a yeasty smell this evening.. and if i swirl the mason jar... the celophane now rises a bit? but still not change in the specific gravity reading since it is still a 1.050? looks like i have to go and ask the LHBS for a new pack! do they usually give new ones for problems like this?

jahdrummin said:

so i am at 1.050 still with the starter... more of a yeasty smell this evening.. and if i swirl the mason jar... the celophane now rises a bit? but still not change in the specific gravity reading since it is still a 1.050? looks like i have to go and ask the LHBS for a new pack! do they usually give new ones for problems like this?

Click to expand...

It sounds like it's "fixing" to get to work now. It should be good in a day or so.

Each LHBS is different- mine would tell me to get lost, while others would give you a new pack.

Did you brew today? Or do you have some more time before having to use the yeast?

i did not brew today... kinda holding out... thinking about waiting till tomm or what do you think?

Another thought .. last night i took a sample to test the gravity... and then tonight i took a sample to test the gravity... so there is that ammount out of the starter mason jar... should that be replenished or no worries? and then just wait for the SG to get to 1.018 or lower and then go ahead and brew?

thanks again yoop!

No worries. The yeast sounds like it's getting ready finally. Something slowed it down. Whether it was hot, cold, mishandling, etc, I couldn't say. But it sounds like it's finally going to take off for you.

I had two wyeast pack in a row not swell, pitched the first time, returned the second one. I came home to chuck the beer down the drain, and 4 days later full head of krausen and bubbling like crazy. So I kept it. I finally dumped the last bottles 4 months after brew day. After all that the beer got infected. The longer that beer sits without the yeast going to work the better chance of an infection. Now this was August, hot and humid. It sat 3 days without viable yeast, and the nasties took over.
Moral of the story: I have had two smack packs not swell, and both of them were bad.

so ... a layer of "foam" on the top of my starter... definate "yeasty" smell and when i swirl the celophane immediately bubbles upward... I checked the Gravity and i am now at 1.030 ... not bad since it was 1.050... Yoop... I am still to wait till it gets down to the 1.020 range to pitch right?

Let me know your thoughts... seems It is on the right track and going to work out fine?

hey all... i brewed a cali common recently ...
used wyeast activator cali lager yeast #2122 ...
finally got my starter going after a non existant expansion of the activator pack...
took 3 days to get the gravity of the starter from 1.050 to recommended 1.018...
all great at pitch on the 13th ... it is now the 22nd...I still have approx 45 seconds to 1 min. between airlock co2 expulsions... I have had the primary in the temp range of 62-66.
1) Never brewing with this strain, does this activity i am having described above consistant with the yeast and type of brew I have going?
2) Do I rack to the secondary when i see no more activity in the airlock what so ever?
3) A thing i read about the Diacteyl (SP?) Rest... for fear of this in the brew... do i still wait 3-5 days after no activity in the airlock and then rack to secondary?

thanks again for all your help

Yoop chyme in please since you have helped throughout this?

Hey jahdrummin, how did this turn out?

After all the trouble you had with the starter, and the significant amount of time you had to stuff about with it, I was thinking maybe you ended up with wild yeast in the starter vessel.

Did the california common turn out ok?