Recipe Critique: Saison

I'm trying to plan out my next brew, which will be a saison. The late hopping was inspired by tips passed along by Dann Paquette of Pretty Things a while ago to someone trying to clone his saison (Jack D'or).

Grain Bill
Belgian Pilsen 7.5# 59.64%
White Wheat Malt 2.5# 20.98%
Rye Malt 1.75# 11.21%
Flaked Oats 1# 8.17%

Hops
Magnum 1oz@90 minutes
Nugget .5oz@20 minutes
Palisades .5oz@20 minutes
Nugget .5oz@0 minutes
Palisades .5oz@0 minutes
Nugget 1oz@dry hop
Palisades 1oz@dry hop

Wyeast 3724

Protein rest followed by 90 minutes at 147.

Any and all comments are welcome (I'm aware of 3724 vs 3711, but I've used 3724 before without problems and like the flavors it gave me).

I've never seen rye malt in a saison; not saying it is incorrect, just haven't seen it yet. I like saisons with either bitter or sweet orange peel added in the last 15 minutes of the boil. The yeast is good - I've used that in a saison already with good results. 3711 is, in my opinion, a better strain for saisons. As far as dry-hopping, I wouldn't do it in a saison.

And I'll have to go the other way from Avid. I much prefer saisons without spices or fruit or whatnot. The flavors that come from the yeast can shine through.

I don't do rye in mine either, but I know somoene did well with one in the HBT comp this year so I say go for it.

I'm not so sure about the dry hopping either, but it's your beer so I wouldn't talk you out of trying it.

As far as the rye goes, I've never brewed with it before, but in the commercial beers I've tried that use it I've always picked up a pleasant spiciness from the rye. I figure that could complement the more fruity flavors I got last time I used 3724.

A Rye Saison won Best of Show in the HBT contest this year. I would say rye works very well in a Saison

Tradionally saisons were brewed with basically any grain the farm could come up with (barley, wheat, rye, oats, spelt, etc.) so there really are no rules. I think a touch of spicy rye could be a great compliment to the yeast character.

I'm considering reworking my hops a little bit. Right now I'm at about 55 IBU (which I know is a bit high for the style, but is right in line with Jack D'or, a beer whose hop character I really dig). I'm considering dropping the Magnum for bittering, ordering another ounce each of Palisades and Nugget, and adding half of each at 90 minutes, and splitting the other half between the flameout and dryhop additions.

For those who have brewed with rye, is 11% of the grain bill enough to get the rye to shine through a little bit?

You can add anything to a Saison, but keep it simple. The flavors come from the yeast.

I hope you can keep ferment temps up in the 80s for that yeast. I don't think you will do it justice if you keep it around 70, and you will risk not fully attenuating.

Hops are not prominent in Saisons. IBUs come in around 30, and flavor and aroma are almost after thoughts. I would lay off the dry hops, but if that's what you want ........ anything goes in a Saison. Pretty much the yeast dictates the style, and you can add anything you like.