Extra Special British Malt?????

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Revvy

Revvy

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I have the beer 365 calender that Papazian put together, and on Sundays the include a recipe (usually extract with grains.)

I was reading the one for this weekend. Marston's ESB Clone.

It's ESB Malt.

And it has a grain I've never heard of...Searching here I found it listed on one recipe, but no discussions on it.
Using the google it turns out it's NOT Extra Special Bitter Malt, like I thought but evidently Extra Special BRITISH Malt.

The scant info I can find is;

Gambrinus Malting Corporation ESB pale malt: This "Extra Special British" pale malt is malted for brewers seeking the unique flavor imparted by well-modified British pale malt. Gambrinus modified its malting process to produce this distinct malt traditionally found only on the British Isles.
Click to expand...

Gambrinus "Extra Special British" pale malt has been produced for brewers seeking a domestic malt with the unique flavor imparted by British pale malt. Recommended up to 100% of grain bill. 3 - 4°L
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Anyone here use it?
Does anyone know a sub for it?
Is this just another version of Marris Otter (it's got such a low lovibond, I'm wondering if it's a base malt?
I have also seen a couple papa charlie ESB recipes that he used Aromatic Malt...is THAT a sub?

The recipe looks interesting...

4 oz Honey Malt
4 oz ESB Malt
1lb Med. Crystal
7lb Light LME
1 3/4 oz EKG's @ 60
1oz EKG @ 20
1oz fuggles @ 2

English Ale Yeast.

It sounds cool...I was thinking of converting this to AG, or PM and getting rid of the LME either way.

Thanks gang!!

:mug:
 
Anyone???? This thread is falling faster than the new President's approval ratings, or the dow...I know there's a lot of noob questions popping up already this morning...but can anyone help lil ole Revvy for once? :D
 
I wish I could be of more assistance, Revvy. I've never used this malt, nor do I know anyone who has.

At first blush, I can't see a distinct difference between "ESB Malt" and the Maris Otter being malted by Muntons et al., except that Gambrinus is making their malt from North American 2-row barley varieties, not true Maris Otter. In other words, Gambrinus is specifically tailoring their malting process to mimic the Mild Ale and Maris Otter pale malts coming into USA from UK maltsters.

Frankly, I don't think you'd go far amiss giving it a try. What have you got to lose?

Bob
 
So they are just kilning domestic 2 row to British Pale specifications?

It does say up to 100% of the grain bill Revvy. I imagine it's just a basemalt.

Biscuit or victory could be a sub.
 
I've never heard of Extra Special British Malt, and the ESB recipes I've seen over here have used Maris Otter as the base, plus regular grains like crystal. As other folks have said, it sounds like a slightly tweaked base malt of some kind. I've also never heard of Marstons doing an ESB, but they make some wonderful beers, so the recipe sounds well worth a go. As a slight change I'd be tempted to try using WLP-023 Burton yeast instead, as Burton is where Marstons are based, so it'd seem appropriate.

Let us know how you get on :mug:
 
Sounds very similar to Briess Pale Ale Malt.
You could probably sub that or an English Pale malt with only minor variations.

If my LHBS stops carrying Maris Otter at reasonable prices I will probably start using Briess Pale Ale Malt as my base malt as its description sounds like it has similar characteristics but is priced more like domestic 2-row.

Craig
 
I just noticed something...Papazian callis it Marston's ESB..but shows this label in the calendar.

burtonbitter.jpg


If I do something I may do it with victory or biscuit....

It's not a priority to brew...I just never came upon the malt before. I just used the Gambrinus honey malt in a small batch experimental Belgian I'm playing with.

Thanks all!!
 
CBBaron said:
Sounds very similar to Briess Pale Ale Malt.
You could probably sub that or an English Pale malt with only minor variations.

If my LHBS stops carrying Maris Otter at reasonable prices I will probably start using Briess Pale Ale Malt as my base malt as its description sounds like it has similar characteristics but is priced more like domestic 2-row.

Craig
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Craig, is there some risk that MO is gonna be in short supply or get priced jacked for some reason?? You hearing something from your lhbs?
 
ESB Malt also goes by the name "mild" malt. I've used it as a base in a stout, a porter and am about to brew an Amber with it. It is similar to Maris Otter, just not quite as malty and is a bit crisper (sorry, that is the best descriptive terms I can come up with now).
 
jharres said:
ESB Malt also goes by the name "mild" malt. I've used it as a base in a stout, a porter and am about to brew an Amber with it. It is similar to Maris Otter, just not quite as malty and is a bit crisper (sorry, that is the best descriptive terms I can come up with now).
Click to expand...

That helps a lot, because I have seen Mild malt...in fact iirc I've actually used it in a recipe once. Which means it is available locally.

:mug:

I just found some more info in BYO.

British maltsters produce mild ale malt, which has slightly more color (3° to 4° Lovibond) than ale malt (2° to 3° Lovibond), with consequently more malt flavor. However, the mild ale malt doesn’t seem to be necessary for milds. Michael Jackson lists ingredients for some classic modern milds, all of which are brewed from ale malt, with additions of crystal and chocolate or black malt. H. Lloyd Hind’s British brewing text from the 1930s mentions the use of mild ale malt but suggests blends of pale malts, including but not limited to mild malts. He also notes the use of wheat, amber, and brown malts. It’s interesting to note that Hind’s text defines milds with original gravities ranging from 1.040 to 1.045, considerably higher than modern versions.
Click to expand...
 
Revvy said:
Craig, is there some risk that MO is gonna be in short supply or get priced jacked for some reason?? You hearing something from your lhbs?
Click to expand...

No my LHBS is primarily a wine and beer store with a small selection of home brew and home wine supplies. He usually has 1-3 bags of bulk grain in stock. Sometimes Maris Otter, sometimes just Munton's Pale Malt. it would not surprise me if he stopped carrying the bags of base malt, or decided to charge a bigger premium for them. At which point driving an hour to The Grape and Granary to pick up a couple bags of Pale Ale Malt makes good economic sense. As it currently stands I stop by the LHBS to pick up new beers to try and get a bag of Maris Otter when i run low and he has some available. Prices are better than what I can get Maris Otter delivered from online suppliers.

Craig
 
I actually forgot about this recipe....

Now I'm wondering what a smash of this malt with let say fuggles, would be like, or is there not enough Diastatic activity in this malt to work on it's own?
 
"Recommended up to 100% of grain bill. 3 - 4°L"

Didn't you answer that in the first post?

If you really want to melt your mellon, go look for "Blown Malt".
 
GilaMinumBeer said:
"Recommended up to 100% of grain bill. 3 - 4°L"

Didn't you answer that in the first post?

If you really want to melt your mellon, go look for "Blown Malt".
Click to expand...



I actually didn't re-read the first post...Like I said I totally forgot I did this thread....


Blown malt...that just sounds dirty. :D

Everything that I'm seeing for blown malt is coming up as cool old brewing books on google books....is it still being made? If not can we make it ourselves?
 
i have used a couple hundred #'s of Gambrinus ESB and it is my 'house' pale ale malt. much more character than NW 2row and a bit more delicate than the bag of Crisp MO i tried(which seemed to be about half gravel, don't know what was up with that). used mostly for ~1.050 OG pale ales with british style hopping. that said there are so m any high quality malts available now that part of the fun is trying them all out so you can pick a favorite even if there is no quantifiable reason to do so.
 
Breathing some life into this dead thread... hopefully

Gambrinus is the only british style base malt that I can get in bulk from my LHBS. It's from a small maltster in British Columbia, Canada. I've never used it (never brewed AG, actually), but I think I'll get a bag since it's CHEEP (40 bucks canadian for 55 pounds). Gambrinus also does a domestic 2-row, wheat malt, munich light, munich dark and munich honey.

Anyone used gambrinus ESB, or any other gambrinus malts? Are you happy?
 
IRmeterman said:
Breathing some life into this dead thread... hopefully

Gambrinus is the only british style base malt that I can get in bulk from my LHBS. It's from a small maltster in British Columbia, Canada. I've never used it (never brewed AG, actually), but I think I'll get a bag since it's CHEEP (40 bucks canadian for 55 pounds). Gambrinus also does a domestic 2-row, wheat malt, munich light, munich dark and munich honey.

Anyone used Gambians ESB, or any other gambrinus malts? Are you happy?
Click to expand...

gambrinus (I call it lugubrious) honey malt is pretty common. It's what people who really want a honey taste in their beer should be using for honey flavor and aroma ( real honey will just ferment out, leaving little actual honey flavor/aroma.) I used some in my belgian dark strong. It really did have a honey taste....good malt.
 
So I like the recipe but of course my LHBS doesn't carry ESB Malt. Is there a comparable steeping grain? I can get Munton's Mild but didn't know if that's just used as a base malt or if I could get flavor by steeping it. For medium Crystal I was thinking 60L.

Thanks
 
johnnyc said:
I'm gonna bump this since I want to brew tomorrow and plan to stop by the LHBS on the way home.
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What makes you think you'd have any better luck with this thread than I did? :D

The consensus was that you could use any pale or light malt, like Mild Ale or Maris Otter, victory or biscuit....but nothing really conclusive....
 
I can't believe the beer masses have been stumped, or at least this isn't interesting enough to get any attention. Maybe you should change the thread title to nekkid womens and see what gets us. :D In any case I'll see what strikes me and give it a whirl. From what I gather not many of the stuff listed will contribute much in such a small quantity though. I'll let you know how it comes out.
 
johnnyc said:
I can't believe the beer masses have been stumped, or at least this isn't interesting enough to get any attention. Maybe you should change the thread title to nekkid womens and see what gets us. :D In any case I'll see what strikes me and give it a whirl. From what I gather not many of the stuff listed will contribute much in such a small quantity though. I'll let you know how it comes out.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it must be one of those rare or hard to find malts that few use...

But I thought the same thing when I wrote the last answer, that if it's a small quantity, then I wouldn't sweat it. Though it would be interesting to do a beer where that was the dominant malt...

Keep me posted...'cause I guess only you or I really care. :D
 
Well I think I'm going with Mild Ale for the ESB thanks to Revvy and BYO.

Original:
4 oz Honey Malt
4 oz ESB Malt
1lb Med. Crystal
7lb Light LME
1 3/4 oz EKG's @ 60
1oz EKG @ 20
1oz fuggles @ 2

Mine:
4 oz Honey Malt
4 oz Mild Ale Malt
1lb Crystal 60L
7lb Light DME
2 oz EKG's @ 60
1oz EKG @ 20
1oz Fuggle @ 2
WLP-023 with starter

Revvy, I'll let you know in about a month.
 
Brew went off without a hitch Saturday night. 2 qt starter on Friday was rip roaring ready to go by the time I pitched around midnight Saturday. With all the cold break material in the wine thief my OG was 1070 @ 75º but I think its closer to 1060.

Good start at 8am and it was going nuts later that night. Lately I've been adding a single drop of olive oil to my primary. I've read several articles on it and thought it was worth a try. Don't know if it helps but I've needed a blow off tube in a 6.5g carboy on every brew since I started doing it.

I waited til 9pm on Saturday night and it was still freakin' hot outside! Damn Durty South heat!
 
johnnyc said:
Brew went off without a hitch Saturday night. 2 qt starter on Friday was rip roaring ready to go by the time I pitched around midnight Saturday. With all the cold break material in the wine thief my OG was 1070 @ 75º but I think its closer to 1060.

Good start at 8am and it was going nuts later that night. Lately I've been adding a single drop of olive oil to my primary. I've read several articles on it and thought it was worth a try. Don't know if it helps but I've needed a blow off tube in a 6.5g carboy on every brew since I started doing it.

I waited til 9pm on Saturday night and it was still freakin' hot outside! Damn Durty South heat!
Click to expand...

If you've read the articles carefully, and the discussions on here, you will find that a single drop of oil is usually used in HUUGE amounts of beer that the amount for a 5 gallon batch is nearly impossible to measure...and some people have actually put way to much and ended up with oily beer....and the whole olvie oil ogygentation idea has pretty much been shot down....

Also I'm not too sure of the long term viability of having even the smallest amount of oil in beer....I know from experience (having been confirmed by one of the researchers of the medical school I work at) that olive and other oils, can become rancid over time.[/] I sure as heck wouldn't want the tiniest molecule of something that could go rancid in my beer.

So lurkers, once again when this topic (olive oil aeration) rears it's ugly head...Please realize that most of the discussions online were conjecture, and most of it was by experienced brewers, not you on your first batch...Please do not attempt this on your first few batches, at least til you actually understand the brewing process...

All the traditional methods, shaking, rocking, o2 bottle and stone, aquarium pump, and the diy aeration wand found on this site...Have ALL been proven effective, while the Olive oil method had a brief flurry of popularity and was pretty much shot down..only to be re-surfaced by new brewers on occasion.

Sorry but after last year when an overzealous first time brewer thought "gee if one pico-drop is good, an entire bottle must be better then started an "is my beer ruined thread" And it was one of the few that actually was ruined.

Back to our regularly schedule discussion of ESB malt. :D
 
Revvy said:
If you've read the articles carefully, and the discussions on here, you will find that a single drop of oil is usually used in HUUGE amounts of beer that the amount for a 5 gallon batch is nearly impossible to measure...and some people have actually put way to much and ended up with oily beer....and the whole olvie oil ogygentation idea has pretty much been shot down....

Also I'm not too sure of the long term viability of having even the smallest amount of oil in beer....I know from experience (having been confirmed by one of the researchers of the medical school I work at) that olive and other oils, can become rancid over time.[/] I sure as heck wouldn't want the tiniest molecule of something that could go rancid in my beer.

So lurkers, once again when this topic (olive oil aeration) rears it's ugly head...Please realize that most of the discussions online were conjecture, and most of it was by experienced brewers, not you on your first batch...Please do not attempt this on your first few batches, at least til you actually understand the brewing process...

All the traditional methods, shaking, rocking, o2 bottle and stone, aquarium pump, and the diy aeration wand found on this site...Have ALL been proven effective, while the Olive oil method had a brief flurry of popularity and was pretty much shot down..only to be re-surfaced by new brewers on occasion.

Sorry but after last year when an overzealous first time brewer thought "gee if one pico-drop is good, an entire bottle must be better then started an "is my beer ruined thread" And it was one of the few that actually was ruined.

Back to our regularly schedule discussion of ESB malt. :D
Click to expand...


Oh I've read the ratio articles and when I say a drop of oil I dipped a straight pin into the bottle and let the smallest amount drip off the end. I haven't lost any head retention from it and get great lacing as well.

Now the rancid part is a viable concern but the over time part is the question. Particularly if kept refrigerated. I typically ferment in the mid 60's and after bottling the beer hasn't lasted longer than a few months in the bottle. I know I have olive oil in my pantry that's a couple months old and it tastes fine. As I'm going to kegging, this week in fact :rockin:, I don't see any of my beer being at room temp longer than a couple months. Based on your advice I may omit this in cases of long aging/slow maturing beer. In any case with the great tradition that is home brewing its to each his own. :)

And as you said back to the ESB. :cross: I'll keep you posted on how the Mild Ale went.
 
Just posted a recipe that uses Gambrinus ESB Malt in it. In my recipes, look for Batch 65 - Britam Dark Amber Ale.

It used almost 30% of it. It was brewed 9 years ago, so can't recall it really well. From what I recall, and what my notes indicate, the resulting beer was very malty with a great mouthfeel. It was a really hoppy beer but that malt combination and the mash temp, etc, gave it a great malt profile and a lot of complexity.
 
MattHollingsworth said:
Just posted a recipe that uses Gambrinus ESB Malt in it. In my recipes, look for Batch 65 - Britam Dark Amber Ale.

It used almost 30% of it. It was brewed 9 years ago, so can't recall it really well. From what I recall, and what my notes indicate, the resulting beer was very malty with a great mouthfeel. It was a really hoppy beer but that malt combination and the mash temp, etc, gave it a great malt profile and a lot of complexity.
Click to expand...

SOunds great Matt...if only I could find the malt..

If I do, I'll give your recipe a try. :mug:
 
The beer has been kegged for about a week and I'm pretty happy with how it came out. Very malty with a clean finish. If I make it again I'll up the 60 minute addition to balance it out a little better. I am curious if the taste will change much as it carbs up.


johnnyc said:
Well I think I'm going with Mild Ale for the ESB thanks to Revvy and BYO.

Original:
4 oz Honey Malt
4 oz ESB Malt
1lb Med. Crystal
7lb Light LME
1 3/4 oz EKG's @ 60
1oz EKG @ 20
1oz fuggles @ 2

Mine:
4 oz Honey Malt
4 oz Mild Ale Malt
1lb Crystal 60L
7lb Light DME
2 oz EKG's @ 60
1oz EKG @ 20
1oz Fuggle @ 2
WLP-023 with starter

Revvy, I'll let you know in about a month.
Click to expand...
 
Storm Brewing here in Vancouver currently uses Gambrinus ESB as the only malt in their Hurricane IPA. I've never used Maris Otter, but I understand that the above hypotheses are more or less correct: it's an NA-grown approximation of a British 2-row. Storm IPA is a tasty, if inconsistent, brew, with a nice crisp toastiness in the malt profile. I just brewed a clone of this beer (using, basically, the same ingredients as the brewery, since my LHBS Dan's Homebrewing gets his supplies off the same shipping pallette. Here it is:

Recipe Type: All-grain
Yeast: Wyeast London ESB, #1968
Yeast Starter: Yes
Batch size: 6 gal (calculated to 75% eff)
Original Gravity: 1.071
Final Gravity: 1.13
IBU: 53
Boiling time: 60mins
Colour (SRM): 6.6
Primary Fermentation: 7 days @ 68F
Secondary Fermentation: 10 days @68F

15lbs Gambrinus ESB Pale
Single Infusion Mash 60 mins @154F

1.2 oz Zeus 15%AA Boil 60 mins
.375 oz Cascade 7%AA 15 mins
.375 oz Willamette 4.8%AA 15 mins
.375 oz Cascade 7%AA 5 mins
.375 oz Willamette 4.8%AA 5 mins

Dry hop 1 oz Cascade Pellets, 5.4%AA (10 days for me)


It's currently dry-hopping, but tastes lovely. The commercial brew is a very quaffable, moderately hopped IPA. According to Dan, Storm Brewing switched from NA 2-row to ESB Malt to get a more "authentic" English flavour. Take that as you will.
 
I just stumbled across this thread. Thanks for the recipes I ended up with a one lb bag of Gambrinus and one of aromatic malt so I will be trying these out on small one gallon batches.
 

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