Saison How Rye I Am (Rye Saison) - 2011 - 1st Place Best of Show - HBT Comp

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
My girlfriend actually makes all of the candi syrups I use in my beers. She says it's quite easy and always does a wonderful job.
 
ickmund said:
Had the first glass(es) of this last night... yum! It has a sweetness to it thou that I can't figure out, with such a low SG and all. It's very tasty, I was just not expecting it and doesn't understand it...

Anyone with a better understanding able to explain it to me?
Click to expand...

The belgian yeasts can make very fruity esters that come off as sweet because whenever your taste buds sense something like apple or pear, it always comes with sugars. I've found your mind will add in the sweetness from the perception of fruity flavors. Some tripels are seemingly almost cloyingly sweet despite having a much lower FG than a sweet stout
 
m00ps said:
The belgian yeasts can make very fruity esters that come off as sweet because whenever your taste buds sense something like apple or pear, it always comes with sugars. I've found your mind will add in the sweetness from the perception of fruity flavors. Some tripels are seemingly almost cloyingly sweet despite having a much lower FG than a sweet stout
Click to expand...

Huh, interesting! I need to tackle another pint and really concentrate on the flavors I guess... tough work indeed.
 
toast26 said:
Brewing this (or a version of it anyway...) for the final round of a knockout competition. I ordered the D-90, but really wavered back and forth between that and the D-180. Candi Syrup.

Anyone have pics and some notes on either version? I know multiple people have used each, but there really hasn't been any follow up on the beers after they are fermented and carbed.

Should be a cool beer to brew. I don't do much rye, but this one sounds really intriguing.
Click to expand...

We used the D-180 in this saison. It just seems like a good pairing to have a rye and a very dark flavorful coffee-toffee pairing. It is exceptional.
 
CSI said:
I've seen this with a number of different Lovibond designations, (260, 275, 300L). It's basically sucrose with dye in it...and not a lot of color or flavor contribution. The liquid candi syrups or cassonades are a much better bet, (Amber or D-45, Dark or D-90, extra Dark or D-180).
Click to expand...

What exactly is cassonade?

This recipe is actually great with any kind of sugar. Honey at flameout makes an excellent saison as well. It's all about the yeast and rye combo here.
 
orangehero said:
What exactly is cassonade?

This recipe is actually great with any kind of sugar. Honey at flameout makes an excellent saison as well. It's all about the yeast and rye combo here.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Last rye saison I made I just used cane sugar and it was better than one I did with Candi syrup. Dries it out more. The pepperyness of the rye and the saison yeast is just astounding
 
So I jumped on and brewed this one up a week ago. It is summer here in Sydney so the fermenter has been sitting in my chest freezer dialed down to 22 degrees C (71 fahrenheit). So far it tastes amazing and it is now down to 1.006 after one week.

Now, my question, as this beer is taking up valuable cold space in my freezer, how long do you think I need to leave it in there? The air temp in my cellar is about 26C or 78F. Do you think after another week, once the bulk of the fermentation is complete, it would hurt to let it sit in the ambient for a few weeks?

Thanks in advance.
 
If you used the 3711, or just about any other saison yeast for that matter, you should pull it out and let the temp ramp up. 78 is a good temp and that should help the yeast finish and give some of the characteristic saison-y funk we love so much. From what I understand about the farmhouse style, warm fermentation temps are the norm. I have done this recipe twice, and both times, ramped temp to the high 70's with great results!
 
I ended up using the D-90 syrup. It made a really nice beer. Next time, I think I'll go either with the 180 or with straight sugar. This is a really solid recipe. Can't really go wrong with the sugar choice.
 
Has anyone done some late addition hops with this recipe (a la the Mad Fermentationist's Hoppy French Saison)? I brewed it last year and loved it. Was looking for a couple of tiny tweaks...
 
I'm down to my last few bottles of my orginal batch of this, which i brewed last summer so I'll be getting another batch on this week.

I switched the candi sugar for honey and added 200g crystal 60L for colour on that brew. This time round I've managed to get some flaked rye from a health food shop which I'm going to use instead of rye malt and I'm going with some lighter crystal malt plus some dark muscovado sugar.

I also have some Thiriez yeast which I've grown from dregs so I'll use that too. Should be a belter!
 
mclamb6 said:
Has anyone done some late addition hops with this recipe (a la the Mad Fermentationist's Hoppy French Saison)? I brewed it last year and loved it. Was looking for a couple of tiny tweaks...
Click to expand...

Yes. I did a light version of this (regular sugar in lieu of dark), used 3 lbs rye malt and 1 lb of flaked rye, and did sorachi ace for the late hop additions. I believe I added a steep of them as well. It was great! I did the original version as well, also great, but I think I preferred the lighter, sorachi ace hopped version. Its in my line up for spring brewing!
 
Does the D180 add any flavor? Seems like most of the posts lean towards it mainly being used for color? If it's just providing color then why not use a malt that mainly provides color, like Dehusked Carafa I or II? Seems like a much cheaper approach. If you're just getting a small amount of dark fruit then you could also throw in a combo of crystal malts and Special B.

Another thing I've been reading about is adding the syrup earlier in the boil, either at 60 min or 45 to get some maillard reaction. Some are saying this is giving more flavor that adding late boil or in secondary, but I haven't found much that's conclusive on this front.

I also thought adding a small amount, maybe 4oz, of roasted barley would be good to give it a slight amount of roast in the finish, this could also be done by using Black Prinz or Midnight Wheat which would also provide the color if the answer to my first question is the syrup being used mainly for color.
 
The d180 definitely gives a nice toffee/rasininy flavor that is best preserved if you add it cold side.

I've made a few black saisons and I've experimented around with different dark malts. I've found 1lb of midnight wheat can get just about anything pitch black. It's my go-to for black IPAs, swartzbiers, etc. My last black saison used 0.5 midnight wheat and 1lb of d180 and turned out nice
 
I made a 3 gallon batch of this and added about 2.5 lbs of cranberries to it. Came out really tasty. I may start using this as a base Saison recipe for experimenting with!
 
I am brewing this today with a few changes. I am subbing out the candy sugar for Honey and added some late additions of Sorachi Ace and Nelson Sauvin. I'm excited!
 
Sorry, if anyone has posted a partial mash recipe already...I made it to about page 24 before I gave up and clicked to "last." I'm trying to stick to OP's recipe as close as possible, only subbing dark candi sugar for lighter, turbinado sugar as a lot of the first people to brew this in 2011 seemed to have done.

Here's my partial recipe:

5 Gallons

5 lbs Pilsner DME 66.7%
2 lbs Rye Malt 26.7%
0.5 lb Turbinado Sugar 6.7%

1.5 oz Styrian Goldings @ 60 mins

WYeast 3711 French Saison (1L starter)

Mash rye malts @ 152 for 60 mins, 1.8qt/lb

I use BIAB for mashing, so no need for rice hulls. What does everyone think?
 
This recipe is excellent! This is the first time I've used rye in a Saison and it is delicious. A little bit of rye bite to accent the crisp dry finish is perfect.
Thanks for sharing this!
 
I did my second batch of this yesterday and gave Dupont yeast a first try, hopefully I'll not have any stalling.

I lowered the ABV a little to 5.5% as I want something a bit less heavy than all the others I've made lately and I've increased the bitterness a little to around 30 IBU. For a 23 litre batch I used

3kg pilsner
1kg pale rye malt
500g flaked rye

20g bobek (6.3% AA)
20g celeia (4.8% AA)

350g dark candi sugar

The first batch was great but I subbed the candi sugar for honey and added a little crystal malt. I'm expecting this one to be better.
 
Brewed it up earlier today, 5 gal batch. Forgot to add the candi sugar, haven't pitched yeast yet. My OG was high anyways though, should I add it anyways or skip it? 2/3 Lb is only going to add about 4 gravity points and I'm at 1.061 already.
 
pricelessbrewing said:
Brewed it up earlier today, 5 gal batch. Forgot to add the candi sugar, haven't pitched yeast yet. My OG was high anyways though, should I add it anyways or skip it? 2/3 Lb is only going to add about 4 gravity points and I'm at 1.061 already.
Click to expand...

OP said he added candi sugar for the color mostly, so I'd say it's up to how you want it to look. If it's already at target gravity, I'd personally let it go to ensure it reaches the very dry FG that helps make that "saison" crispness.
 
Thanks. One more question, I ran it through BS2 and brewers friend recipe calculator and both of them show an expected FG of 1.010-1.011. I know that's not really true, as it's a popular recipe and saisons always finish much lower than that but is it just because the "estimated attenuation" shows 80% and not what it actually is?
 
Yea. Most Saisons yeasts in my experience get closer to 90-95% if you give them enough time and the right temps.
 
When using the Candi sugar, was this boiled, or used at high Krausen?
 
Fermentation seems to have slowed down, there's still yeast rafts. OG was 1.061, did not use the sugar, as my efficiency was rather high. FG is around 1.007-1.006. Should I warm it up, or let cold crash it and keg?
 
Thanks for the recipe. My first time brewing Saison. Funny as the first time I tried a Saison a year or so back I did NOT like it (too funky and sour). Now I love it.

I used White Labs French Saison yeast, WLP590. Otherwise stuck to the recipe pretty much. Even used Dark Candi Sugar (mostly for color) even though I am sure regular sugar would work just fine.

I have about 5 home-brews in bottles now and Saison is my hands-down favorite!
Mashed at 152F. 75F-78F temperatures during fermentation, deliberately trying to keep it warm.
Starting gravity is 1.060, ended pretty dry at 1.004 in two weeks.

Amazing aroma and taste. Down to my last case and need to brew it again, soon.
 
TheOrlandoGuy said:
Here's my partial recipe:

5 Gallons

5 lbs Pilsner DME 66.7%
2 lbs Rye Malt 26.7%
0.5 lb Turbinado Sugar 6.7%

1.5 oz Styrian Goldings @ 60 mins

WYeast 3711 French Saison (1L starter)

Mash rye malts @ 152 for 60 mins, 1.8qt/lb

I use BIAB for mashing, so no need for rice hulls. What does everyone think?
Click to expand...

Just saying thanks again to OP for posting this recipe! I tried this yesterday for the first time, and I am blown away! Perfectly balanced Saison with a great amount Rye spiciness and "Saison" funk. Love it.

For any other partial mashers out there, the modified PM recipe I used above worked very well for me.
 
I brewed a 3 Gallon AG batch of this last night.
I was hoping for an OG of 1.056 but ended up with 1.046 I have a feeling the crush is to blame for this since I ordered crushed grains from a new supplier. So instead of a 7% ABV this will most likely be more of a session ale. Also, next time I think I'll use Dark Candi Sugar for a darker color. Mine turned out pretty light and has a greenish tint because of the hops.

Thanks!

3 Gallon All Grain Recipe:

6 lbs Belgian Pilsner Malt
2 lbs Rye Malt
1/3 lb of Rice Hulls
.5 oz Clover Honey at 15 mins
1 oz Styrian Goldings at 60 mins
Wyeast 3711 (1 Liter Starter)
Fermenting @ 71 degrees F
 
I'm looking to brew this recipe up this weekend with a few changes to help clean out some hops that I have left in the freezer from this past winter's hop buy.

1) Without having to read through all 40 pages, does anyone have a 5 Gallon AG recipe available for this?

2) Would East Kent Golding's be an acceptable substitute for the hop bill here? Possibly thinking of even using an ounce of Nelson Sauvin to dry hop the batch as i've had very good luck using Nelson with Saison's and 3711 Yeast.
 
Adirondack47 said:
I'm looking to brew this recipe up this weekend with a few changes to help clean out some hops that I have left in the freezer from this past winter's hop buy.

1) Without having to read through all 40 pages, does anyone have a 5 Gallon AG recipe available for this?

2) Would East Kent Golding's be an acceptable substitute for the hop bill here? Possibly thinking of even using an ounce of Nelson Sauvin to dry hop the batch as i've had very good luck using Nelson with Saison's and 3711 Yeast.
Click to expand...

What I did:

12 lbs of Belgian Pilsner
3 lbs Rye Malt
1 lbs Candi Sugar
2 oz Fugle (60min)
1 oz Centennial at flameout.
French Saison WLP590 (French Saison Ale Yeast, 73-80% attenuation, 69-75F Fermentation, 5-10% Alc. Tolerance)
Mashed at 152F for 90min

EKG is probably ok substitute for Fugles as bittering hop. I see some charts say Fuggle can be substituted for EKG, so vice versa must be ok too.
 
I just racked mine to the Keg last night. My OG was lower than I wanted at 1.048 but FG went all the way down to 1.002 - dang that Wyeast 3711 did its job. Should be ready to drink in about a week.

:rockin:
 
Just made this and it finished at 1.003. It is delicious but more of a Belgian Pale than a Saison. Lots of bubblegum Belgian ester notes. Anyone else find this?
 
RussPDX said:
Just made this and it finished at 1.003. It is delicious but more of a Belgian Pale than a Saison. Lots of bubblegum Belgian ester notes. Anyone else find this?
Click to expand...

From 3711? Thats odd. Ive gotten a lot of bubblegum flavors from WLP566 and WY3726, but never 3711. What temp did you ferment it at?
 
Chamber was set at 20.4 C. Stc controller so just ambient control.
 

Similar threads

TBC
12 Beers of Christmas 2022 Edition
6 7 8
Replies
281
Views
18K
wetmk
wetmk
Pappers_
Our Gin Barrel Biere de Garde
Replies
0
Views
590
Pappers_
Pappers_
T
HUGE 65 gallon BIAB
2
Replies
62
Views
20K
Mashinations
M
Z
Cottage House Saison extract recipe? (And: dumping Edwort's Apfelwein on yeast cake?)
Replies
0
Views
1K
zonkman
Z
K
  • Article
6 Beginner Beer Recipes and Styles
Replies
30
Views
22K
Gert
G

Latest posts

Back
Top