Starsan

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badnaam

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I noticed bubbles of StarSan and perhaps very small residue in the bottles while I was bottling it, will it result in off taste/bad beer later? Am I supposed to let it compeletely dry?

Thanks
 
People who've used it a long time will swear that even large amounts (like a quart in your 5-gal batch) will not have any effect.

I've just switched to it in the last two weeks (and thus don't have any finished product to test this theory), but I'm hoping they're right!

In short, a few bubbles won;t make a difference. RDWHAHB :D
 
I love this stuff. I have not noticed any off flavors. Just have to get over the fact you are pouring beer into bubbles.
 
Ryanh1801 said:
I love this stuff. I have not noticed any off flavors. Just have to get over the fact you are pouring beer into bubbles.

It's a psychological thing for me, I just can't do it. I still meticulously rinse all my equipment after a StarSan bath. After reading Palmer's style (started with Papazian's book) I guess I should be more careful with tap water on sanitized equipment...
 
FlyGuy said:
No off flavours. No worries. Love the foam!

Interesting, yesterday was my first time using starsan and I was pretty freaked out by the bubbles. I guess next time I won't rinse with hot water. Dang.
 
Thalon said:
It's a psychological thing for me, I just can't do it. I still meticulously rinse all my equipment after a StarSan bath. After reading Palmer's style (started with Papazian's book) I guess I should be more careful with tap water on sanitized equipment...

Definitely. If you're rinsing after using StarSan, you're just wasting your money by undoing the sanitization and adding back waterborne bacteria.

badnaam, listen to this interview The Brewing Network did with Charley Talley of Five Star Chemical (makers of StarSan), it'll answer a lot of your questions and give you some confidence in its use.

DON'T FEAR THE FOAM! ;) :mug:
 
yeah seriously - don't rinse the starsan off!
My keg is usually FULL of starsan bubbles when I am racking to it... In a dozen batches never noticed any off flavors.
 
brrman said:
yeah seriously - don't rinse the starsan off!
My keg is usually FULL of starsan bubbles when I am racking to it... In a dozen batches never noticed any off flavors.

Easier said than done. When you have 8-12" of foam at the bottom of a 5 gallon carboy, what happens when you rack 5 gallons of beer on top of it? It foams everywhere, coming out of the top like a volcano.
 
I was a little concerned when Charlie said the reason that pvc tubing becomes 'slimey' is the detergents in StarSan are attracted to it so presumably if you transfer with tubing soaked in StarSan that has attracted the detergent from a few liters of the stuff a significant dose of the detergent will rinse off into your beer.
Personally I prefer iodophor, it's cheap and equally as no rinse and doesn't leave any foam.
Any staining can be removed (for example in a fermenter) by pouring a kettle of boiling water over the effected area although you can leave it in contact for a lot longer than it requires to sanitise before you get any staining.
 
DAAB said:
I was a little concerned when Charlie said the reason that pvc tubing becomes 'slimey' is the detergents in StarSan are attracted to it so presumably if you transfer with tubing soaked in StarSan that has attracted the detergent from a few liters of the stuff a significant dose of the detergent will rinse off into your beer.
Personally I prefer iodophor, it's cheap and equally as no rinse and doesn't leave any foam.
Not to worry -- the detergent is very mild, and breaks down quickly in your fermenter (into yeast nutrients, apparently). Iodophor is very good, too -- although if you are worried about introducing off flavours in your beer, it is MUCH easier to do it with iodophor than StarSan.
 
DAAB said:
Not at a no rinse concentration:D Besides it's so cheap.
Yes, correct. But to make a fair comparison, you can exceed no-rinse concentrations of StarSan and not get off flavours. Plus, StarSan lasts for months if made with RO water, and it can be reused -- so it is FAR cheaper.

Sorry -- didn't mean to start an online argument here -- but there are a lot of misconceptions about StarSan that get repeated. Sort of a pet peeve of mine! :) :)
 
This wasn't so much a misconception it was just something that occurred to me after hearing the interview.

I have heard it mentioned that StarSan contains substances that can be consumed as a yeast nutrient but never imagined that it would be detergent. What is there in detergent that the yeast use as a nutrient?

Plus, StarSan lasts for months if made with RO water, and it can be reused -- so it is FAR cheaper.

are you factoring in the cost of and RO water filter and ph test strips when you make this claim?
 
DAAB said:
This wasn't so much a misconception it was just something that occurred to me after hearing the interview.
Hey DAAB -- sorry man -- didn't mean to imply that you had misconceptions. I just meant that some might interpret your opinion in the wrong way, and I wanted to clarify. :mug:

I have heard it mentioned that StarSan contains substances that can be consumed as a yeast nutrient but never imagined that it would be detergent. What is there in detergent that the yeast use as a nutrient?

I looked up the MSDS sheets for Star San and couldn't find any info on the detergent in Star San. But I suspect it contains phosphates and/or sulphates. Both are common in detergents, and both are nutrients that yeast will metabolize. But I admit that this is just an educated guess.

are you factoring in the cost of and RO water filter and ph test strips when you make this claim?
Yes, fair point -- touche! I get 5 gal RO refills at a LHBS for about $.40 - $.50/gal. So that is a significant cost. But a gallon of Star San lasts a long time -- a couple months for sure.

I have used pH strips to test the strength of old Star San solution, and found that the clarity/cloudiness of the solution is a reliable indicator. I don't bother with pH strips anymore unless it is a really old solution (few months old).

Cheers mate! :mug:
 
I'll be putting some on by next order ;)...

but for the bulk of my sanitising duties I will still be using my favoured sanitiser...bleach :eek:

(if my tap water is good enough for top-up water it's good enough for rinsing :) )
 
Some bacteria can build a resistance to most sanitisers, but not bleach/chlorine (not sure of the full details) so an occasional full soak in bleach is always good practice imo.

Unless I am in a hurry I give everything a 20 min soak in a thin bleach solution (either during the mash or during the boil), rinse then give everything a spray with a no rinse iodophor solution 5 mins before use then shake it off or let drip dry etc. I may just replace the iodophor with Star San.
 
Actually, bleach looses its effectiveness over time, so a gallon of bleach may well last years, but if you keep it around too long it won't actually sanitize anything. As long as using whatever sanitizer you use works for you and you get consistent beers, I say use it. I personally use Star San and it works fine for me.

Here is the MSDS for Star San: http://www.fivestarchemicals.com/msds/starsan.pdf

And the chemical dodecylbenzenesulfonic acid is the surfactant. I have no idea if or how yeast would metabolize it. The phosphoric acid (pH buffer) is definitely the yeast nutrient in Star San.
 
Are there any health risks from consuming starsan? I would assume that the MSDS they have on the website is refering to large quantities when it says ingestion can cause burning to the throat and stomach, but its still got me a little worried.
 
ArroganceFan said:
Are there any health risks from consuming starsan? I would assume that the MSDS they have on the website is refering to large quantities when it says ingestion can cause burning to the throat and stomach, but its still got me a little worried.

according to the interview, no, its non-toxic to drink. Charlie states he's drank an 8oz glass of normal concentration, and compared it to really strong Coca-Cola.

As to detergents in star san...many detergents out there use some kind of phosphate compound. I'm guessing these break down into more simple phosphorus, and who knows what else. Phosphorus is usable by yeast.

That's really vague, i know, but its what I think is probably going on.
 
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