Just finished my HERMS controller

First post here but I've been scouring these forums for information for the past month and figured it was finally time I showed my face (so to speak).

After just 2 all-grain batches, I knew I wanted to set up a HERMS, so the first step was to build a control box. Basic design considerations was to make it clean, simple and completely self-contained. I also wanted to have the outlets facing away from the mash tun and heat exchanger (the box will be set to the right of both).

Components:

Love TS13010
Project Box
Terminal Strip
Illuminated Rocker Switches
2 Duplex Receptacles (Split)
1 IEC Receptacle
Red, Black and Green 14 AWG solid wire

Started with a wiring diagram:



Once I found a sizable box (Radio Shack has a nice selection), I made all my cutouts using a router bit on my Dremel. Any round holes were done with a step bit. Then I mounted all the components and wired them:



Here is the top view. Love controller on top. The four rocker switches control power to the four outlets. Heater goes to the Heat Exchanger (A 1500W heater element mounted in a 2 Gallon cooler), Access is for any accessories (plug in my radio or whatever I may need in the future), Pump 1 is for the mash recirculation pump and Pump 2 is for the Heat Exchanger agitation pump. The wire coming out of the left side is for the temperature probe which will be mounted in a thermowell at the return point in the mash tun.



The front side shows the outlets for the two pumps:



The right side show the outlet for the Heater and Accessory:



The back side has the IEC receptacle for power in:



I plugged it in and nothing blew up! I tested switching each outlet on and off. I then programmed the Love Controller to heat a few degrees over room temperature. Grabbed the probe and it shut off the outlet once it got to temperature. Once the probe cooled down, it turned it on again. SUCCESS!

Hopefully I can get my brew stand and all the plumbing done for a first try tomorrow.

That is gorgeous! Ya did a fantastic job, very clean.

I think this is the next direction for me!

John

Thanks! I lost track of how many trips I made to Lowe's and Radio Shack trying to put the thing together. Every step required some new tool or component to get it done.

Hmmm... Looks like my images won't show inline because I'm a newbie. Anybody know how many posts it takes before they'll show?

Very nice! Some ideas that I may be able to incorporate into mine.

Lol, BobbyM had to show me about pictures, you have to use the " " thingy, in the posting window it is the little yellow box with a mountain in it or you can just add the IMG tags to your links.

Pintodave said:

Lol, BobbyM had to show me about pictures, you have to use the "

" thingy

Click to expand...

I did. It worked in preview so I have the code right. Reading through this thread (https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f23/why-does-pic-show-up-preview-post-but-not-actual-thread-124766/), it looks like newbies have some restrictions.

What element do you have and at what voltage?

Poobah58 said:

What element do you have and at what voltage?

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It's a 1500W @ 120V water heater element I picked up a Lowes for under $9. I know that's not enough to do a fast rise when step mashing but the primary purpose is to make small adjustments and maintain consistent temperatures.

It's mounted in the cooler with a Stainless Steel 1" Locknut from Bargain Fittings.

Wow, that is a clean looking!

It looks like you soldered the leads to your switches. You may want to consider using female crimp on quick disconnects instead. At high currents the wire could get hot enough for the solder to melt and then you have 110v hanging out in the breeze.

Cant wait to see the final system.

What do you estimate the cost was for everything to do with the control box?

CodeRage said:

It looks like you soldered the leads to your switches. You may want to consider using female crimp on quick disconnects instead. At high currents the wire could get hot enough for the solder to melt and then you have 110v hanging out in the breeze.

Click to expand...

I thought about the crimp disconnects but don't really trust them (I know, they're probably fine but I just haven't used them much). The leads to the switches were looped through the holes in the pins and crimped tightly with a pair of needle nose pliers. Kind of like this:



Since it's all solid core wire, the connections were very rigid and didn't budge, even before I soldered them into place.

Thanks for the heads up on the current melting the solder, though. I hadn't thought of that and will definitely inspect the joints after putting the system through some tests.

kronik said:

What do you estimate the cost was for everything to do with the control box?

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Love TS-13010 (Dwyer): $65
8x6x3 Project enclosure (Radio Shack): $7
Illuminated 125V switches (Radio Shack): $4 x 4 = $16
Terminal Block (Lowe's): $6
Receptacles (Lowe's): $.50 x 2 = $1
#4 Machine Screws (Lowe's): $1
4MM flat washers (Lowe's): $1
14 AWG Solid Wire (Black) 10ft: $2
14 AWG Solid Wire (Red) 10ft: $2
14 AWG Solid Wire (Green) 10ft: $2
IEC Receptacle: Free (Harvested from an old PC power supply)
Solder: Free (I already had a roll)

Total cost: $103 plus tax and shipping for the Love controller.

Tools used:

Dremel with router bit
Drill with regular bit and step bit
File
Various size screw drivers
Wire strippers
Pliers
Lots of sweat and cursing

The hardest part was cutting the holes to mount the controller and the receptacles. If anyone has a better method for this than a dremel, let me know.

I think you will be all right. The panel shop at work uses crimped connectors all the time. It is important to use a crimping tool and the right sized crimp. After crimping we do tin them with solder but that is to protect them from corrosive gases.

For one; if you had that much heat to melt solder you have a problem with undersized wire or over amped protection for the wire gauge used. Your insulation will be melting off first. I bet the ranch it isn't THHN that's rated a maximum operating temperature of 90*C or 194*F. I bet it is TW which most solid (yuck who uses that solid wire crap?) TW with a maximum temperature rating of 60*C or 140*F. Far below solders melting point of 435 plus depending on the alloy mix.
Second; crimped fittings are for stranded wire not solid, many people use crimps anyway this causing a loose joint and a hot spot for a future failure given the high currents and time. Not one to start a flame war here just the facts. 30 year IBEW Union wireman here.

BrewBeemer said:

For one; if you had that much heat to melt solder you have a problem with undersized wire or over amped protection for the wire gauge used. Your insulation will be melting off first. I bet the ranch it isn't THHN that's rated a maximum operating temperature of 90*C or 194*F. I bet it is TW which most solid (yuck who uses that solid wire crap?) TW with a maximum temperature rating of 60*C or 140*F. Far below solders melting point of 435 plus depending on the alloy mix.
Second; crimped fittings are for stranded wire not solid, many people use crimps anyway this causing a loose joint and a hot spot for a future failure given the high currents and time. Not one to start a flame war here just the facts. 30 year IBEW Union wireman here.

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Nope, no offense taken. I didn't know it was solid core before he said so in his second post. If he said it previously I glossed over it. Your 30 years IBEW experience trumps my 10 years industrial controls.

I was always taught to use mechanical connections for using large amounts of power and that it is bad joo joo to use solder connections. Didn't consider the insulation smoldering off first though.

Not every one knows that breakers are meant to protect the wire and not devices. And, I hate solid core too...

CodeRage said:

Nope, no offense taken. I didn't know it was solid core before he said so in his second post. If he said it previously I glossed over it. Your 30 years IBEW experience trumps my 10 years industrial controls.

I was always taught to use mechanical connections for using large amounts of power and that it is bad joo joo to use solder connections. Didn't consider the insulation smoldering off first though.

Not every one knows that breakers are meant to protect the wire and not devices. And, I hate solid core too...

Click to expand...

Oops now i've done it, came across your number 4 or 5 EE's on this forum as well bull8240 (4082?) sorry bull, who was a past wireman also for 12 years before becoming a EE. I've knocked heads with them on job sites many times and will stand my ground when i'm right. We had a job where an EE insisted we energize a highrise and the main board's panels bowed out from the explosion. EE over me and my crew against this tactic and we won as he signed the papers first. That was a early go home for the crew to grab a horn and laugh it off.

I respect what your doing also, no belittling a fellow wireman were a big family with different specialties doing the same thing making magic called light. Let a turd farm jo down and how important your are in the dead of winter, the rest of the year called other names.
No worries bro, i've seen a lot as well you but the bare minimum in ding bat work for me. Mostly indistrial up to 12KV splicing certification, 12KV transfer switching and breakers. I was more afraid of the super cranes on the west coast around the high voltage DC when the hair pulls on your arms it gives you a strange feeling. Same with BART and their DC system. My real nitch was rigging and fab work before large and long 500 and 750 MCM pulls of 1,000' plus the 8 single pulls of 12KV runs of 4 conductor 2 gauge at 3,965' long each run. I was called off another job by the hall for that rigging job of 3 1/2 years in town. Learned off old splicers as an apprentice because I had welding certifications before the trade. 4" conduit bending was a natural for me until the back finally failed me. The system also has failed me as it took 5 1/2 years just get my SSD day in court then approved. The legal Award from them the next 45 days away. Hell the old Posey tunnel has 1921 12KV motor driven blade switch transfer gear, slow motion arching with a lot of ozone each time breaking 12KV. No Puffer Packs here, very old school design without upgrades. CalTrans ran out of money. Typical half-ass state engineering crap we had to deal with. I'll shut up as I have mentioned the dirty word before and ruffled some feathers by mentioning my "Bible" the NEC
book. later bro....Brew on.

Just brewed my first HERMS batch and the controller worked flawlessly. Once the temperature in the mash tun hit the target of 149 (I have a thermometer inside the tun) the controller kept it steady between 148.8 and 149.2 for an hour. I even let it do the rise for mash-out. It took took 10 minutes to go from 149 to 168 as measured at the mash return point. It took a total of 16 minutes for the temperature in the mash tun to hit 168. This was with 3.5 gallons of water in 11.5 pounds of grain. I have about 1.5 gallons in my heat exchanger. Not too shabby IMO and plenty fast for my needs.

Man, that didn't take long to test the fruits of your labor. Good to hear, sounds like everything worked better than expected!

CodeRage said:

Man, that didn't take long to test the fruits of your labor. Good to hear, sounds like everything worked better than expected!

Click to expand...

No kidding. I've been working non-stop on the HERMS for the past 3 days to get everything for today. It was either do it now, or wait 2 weeks before I could test it out.

I'm delighted with how well it all worked. The only snag I ran into was a loose ground wire in the Heat Exchanger. I'm very glad I took the advice in this forum and installed a GFCI outlet. The second I plugged in my HEX, the outlet popped. I traced it down to the loose ground wire, fixed it up and the rest was smooth sailing.

Next time I do a batch, I'll have Mrs. Gnome shoot some pictures of the whole setup and brewing process.

I was even able to use the controller and heat exchanger for additional wort chilling and whirlpooling in the kettle. The only failure of the day was that I ran out of ice and couldn't hit my pitching temp of 60 degrees (I bottomed out at 71). Oh, well. Live and learn. Next time I'll use tap water to bring the temps down a bit before doing the ice batch recirculation (tap water in AZ is about 85 degrees. I so envy people who live in areas with 40 degree tap water).

My tap water in the summer is up to 69 degrees the well water 62-63 degrees. I have no worries about the amount of well water used I run it by the hour at 8 gallons a minute watering the yard. Winter city down to 54 the well has hit 59-60, rather stable year round.
I can't believe these 85 degree water temps in the south a warm shower your using cold water only.

EvilGnome6 said:

Hmmm... Looks like my images won't show inline because I'm a newbie. Anybody know how many posts it takes before they'll show?

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Inline images are working now. :rockin:

Did the temp probe come with the love controller or did you already have that? I am looking to do something like this.

CNL said:

Did the temp probe come with the love controller or did you already have that? I am looking to do something like this.

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The TS series Love controllers include a temp probe and cost $65 from Dwyer. They can handle up to 16A.

The TS2 series don't include a probe and cost $52.50 at Dwyer. The TS-5 probe costs $6.00 which would bring the total up to $58.50. They can handle 15A.

Either of those would work just fine with a 1500 watt element (which draws 12.5A) but I opted for the TS just to give me that little extra bit of headroom.

Thanks Evil!

Just Finished! Thanks to your awesome wiring job I was able to just copy what you had posted in your pictures. Fired her up and worked great....except I forgot to take off the jumper on the hot side of the receptacle causing the switches to conflict, but after that it works great, and now off to my heating element. Thanks again Evil!!

Awesome! I'm glad my little write-up was helpful. After 8 months my controller is still working flawlessly. Good luck getting the heating element mounted.

Great write up Evil,

I saw the pics of your element mounted in the cooler, but did not see a copper grounding washer like some others have installed. Am I missing this, or is the copper grounding point unneccessary?

thanks

bringing back an old thread.. Can I do this with a Ranco instead of the Love Controller? This fits my bill perfectly only I have a Ranco.

CoalCracker said:

bringing back an old thread.. Can I do this with a Ranco instead of the Love Controller? This fits my bill perfectly only I have a Ranco.

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Well, you might not be able to fit the Ranco in such a compact enclosure but it'll work just fine. As far as I know they can handle 16A.

Yea I'll be using a larger size project box from lowes that I'll mount the Ranco to. Guess I just have to figure out which outputs do what. Guess I have some research to do. Thanks

Ok, i am in a very similar situation. I like this build and am doing something very similar. I am actually putting 2 love controllers in the box. from there it will go to a toggle switch then to some sort of connection/receptacle.

A couple questions. Do I have to use a toggle switch with a neutral line? Or can I use a SPST? Also, I am confused a bit, can I have 2 love's control each of the slots on 1 receptacle? Or do I have to use separate outlet/receptacles?

The neutral line is just to make the lighted rocker switch work. You can do without that if you want.

Receptacles can be split by breaking off the tabs connecting the two outlets. Once that is done they can be controlled independently.

so are you controlling the pump or the heater with the love? where is your temp probe, in the mash or in the herms bucket?

just curious if you're managing the herms water or the MLT and how you compensate for the other...

The heater is controlled by the Love. The pump is manually switched. The temperature probe is in the return line from the heat exchanger to the mash tun.

so you're setting the bucket to your target mash temp, you're running the pump non stop and you're taking the temp of the wort as it exits the heat exchanger.

have you given any thought to monitoring the temp of the mash instead? or perhaps before it runs through the hex? i'd think i'd be more worried about the gallons of wort and grain being the right temp instead of just what's coming out of the hex.

slakwhere said:

so you're setting the bucket to your target mash temp, you're running the pump non stop and you're taking the temp of the wort as it exits the heat exchanger.

Click to expand...

Correct.

have you given any thought to monitoring the temp of the mash instead? or perhaps before it runs through the hex? i'd think i'd be more worried about the gallons of wort and grain being the right temp instead of just what's coming out of the hex.

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Of course I've thought of monitoring the temp of the mash. I have a separate thermometer with the probe inside the mash tun. That doesn't mean it's the right place to control the heat exchanger. If you did, you'd constantly be overshooting your temps. Think about it.

Very nice build and thanks for taking us along.

I'm thinking of automating my HERMS and I'm wondering why you went with the Love controller as opposed to an Auber PID?

dunleav1 said:

I'm thinking of automating my HERMS and I'm wondering why you went with the Love controller as opposed to an Auber PID?

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The Love controller can handle 16A, which is enough for the 1500W heater element I'm using. I think the PID would need an SSR, plus a little more know-how to configure. I don't think either would be the wrong choice, but I opted for price and simplicity.

EvilGnome6 said:

The Love controller can handle 16A, which is enough for the 1500W heater element I'm using. I think the PID would need an SSR, plus a little more know-how to configure. I don't think either would be the wrong choice, but I opted for price and simplicity.

Click to expand...

I have three Love's on the cold side of my brewery so I'm familiar with them.
My panel on my stand is pretty small, so the Love's size would work well for me.

Right now with my stand I can direct gas fire RIMS or direct gas fire HERMS.
I'm building an electric HEX tube with a 1500W element that I can use to either RIMS or HERMS and so I can automate regulating my Mash tun temperature.

I don't understand the worry about big temperature fluctuations. If your probe is on the output side of your HERMS or RIMS you can never overshoot your temperature target for your mash. I understand the PID gives less or more heat but does it really matter if you are measuring the temperature in the right place?

dunleav1 said:

I don't understand the worry about big temperature fluctuations. If your probe is on the output side of your HERMS or RIMS you can never overshoot your temperature target for your mash. I understand the PID gives less or more heat but does it really matter if you are measuring the temperature in the right place?

Click to expand...

The output side of the HERMS or RIMS is the best place to put the temperature probe. Placing it in the mash tun or the mash exit would lead to overshooting.