When to Transfer from Primary to Secondary?

Hey guys - just recently joined the forum but have already got some great advice on my first home brew. I had read some other threads to try and find an answer, but my situation is a bit different so I thought I'd start my own thread. I'm brewing a Baron's Pale Ale kit that I started last Friday May 6. It's been fermenting for 4 days now. The kid suggests transferring to a secondary between 3-6 days, but I was going to do it on the 7th day. I've been reading that most people wait much longer (usually 2-3 weeks?), but I'm not sure if this is the right decision for me for a few reasons.

- Unfortunately I don't have a hydrometer, so I don't have any readings to go off. I will definitely be investing in one for my next batch
- I'm not sure how great the seal is on my primary fermenting bucket. It is a food grade ~40 L bucket, with a lid and a tiny hole in the middle for an airlock (which fits quite tight), but not big enough for a bung. I'm seeing no activity in the airlock, and the seal around the edges seems a bit loose to me, so I'm just a bit worried it's not quite as safe and sealed as it should be.

My two questions would be...

1) What is the advantage of waiting an extra week or two as far as the beer goes?

2) Given my situation with my primary fermentation bucket, should I wait it out or rack it within the next couple of days to prevent possible harm to the beer? Or is it already too late?

Thanks, looking forward to your responses.

1) the yeast will finish the fermentation process AND clean up the by-products of that process after doing so.

2) I would wait at least 3 weeks total. If you really want to move it to a 'secondary' vessel after that, knock yourself out.

3) To Worry is against the rules.

4) Throw those kit instructions away.

BendBrewer said:

1) the yeast will finish the fermentation process AND clean up the by-products of that process after doing so.

2) I would wait at least 3 weeks total. If you really want to move it to a 'secondary' vessel after that, knock yourself out.

3) To Worry is against the rules.

4) Throw those kit instructions away.

Click to expand...

This is what I do, too. Three weeks in the primary then it goes to bottle or keg. Secondary is useful for oaking, adding fruit or dry hopping, stuff like that though.

I wouldn't worry about the bucket either; many people do completely open fermentations and never have any problems. Plus, by now any damage that would have been done probably would have happened (if it was going to, which is very unlikely IMO). + 1 to letting it sit in the bucket for three or four weeks and then bottling. Also, you should get a hydrometer as soon as you can, it will be your best guide for when to move to secondary and/or bottle. Welcome to the addiction!

I look for the krausen layer to sink into the beer and all active signs of fermentation to go away to determine when my primary fermentation has completed. When I see that this has happened I'll gently rock my fermenters from side to side several times to rouse the yeast back into suspension, this usually causes more krausen to form over the next few days and is an indication that the fermentation was not completely finished before rousing.

Of course another way to tell if the primary fermentation is complete is to use a hydrometer to check if you've hit your targeted final gravity. If you have the same reading for 2 days or more and you hit the final gravity you're done. If the final gravity is still too high try rousing the yeast to see if sparks more fermentation.

BendBrewer said:

1) the yeast will finish the fermentation process AND clean up the by-products of that process after doing so.

2) I would wait at least 3 weeks total. If you really want to move it to a 'secondary' vessel after that, knock yourself out.

3) To Worry is against the rules.

4) Throw those kit instructions away.

Click to expand...

what he said

When in doubt give it another week.

Acoma said:

When in doubt give it another week.

Click to expand...

Agreed, and walking away from the beer and forgetting about it gets easier after a few batches, at least it has for me.

zepolmot said:

Agreed, and walking away from the beer and forgetting about it gets easier after a few batches, at least it has for me.

Click to expand...

Start another 'hobby' that takes even longer and waiting for your beer to finish is nothing.........

BendBrewer said:

Start another 'hobby' that takes even longer and waiting for your beer to finish is nothing.........

Click to expand...

like mead making.

One caveat regarding kit instructions, they are very helpful up to the point where you add the yeast, after that most kit instructions regarding fermentation times and techniques are garbage. IMO

Try not to worry too much about the airlock seal. The CO2 layer is on top of the beer still, not the outside "air", so it's sort of like a cap on top of the liquid anyway. Should be fine.

I'd taste it when I bottled to make sure it doesn't seem terribly sweet. Ever taste the wort before you add the yeast? It's like a sickly sweet weird tea. If you taste that, it's probably not done yet.

tvtoms said:

Try not to worry too much about the airlock seal. The CO2 layer is on top of the beer still, not the outside "air", so it's sort of like a cap on top of the liquid anyway. Should be fine.

I'd taste it when I bottled to make sure it doesn't seem terribly sweet. Ever taste the wort before you add the yeast? It's like a sickly sweet weird tea. If you taste that, it's probably not done yet.

Click to expand...

haha, if you taste that it's probably been in the refrigerator the whole time.

Yeah true! If you taste that it's not only not done, it may not be started!

It's hard to wait "weeks" when you're dying to try your beer from the first batch. But it's better to just get a cheap case of something in the meantime and just think every day longer means your beer will be better. I need to get a cheap case myself because I have no homebrews ready!

Thanks for all the responses! Thankfully I have plenty of beer in the fridge, so need not worry.

Talking to friends who brew and reading a bit online, the suggestion was made that leaving the beer in the primary for over a week could lead to possible bacteria issues. What are the odds of this happening? Does the "CO2 Layer" prevent this from happening?

Probably not bacteria, but autolisis. Some say get it out of primary as soon as you can. Others say a couple weeks help the flavors, not hurt.

Here's some advice I got when I was asking a similar questions:

Revvy said:

This should give you an idea....This is my yeastcake for my Sri Lankin Stout that sat in primary for 5 weeks. Notice how tight the yeast cake is? None of that got racked over to my bottling bucket. And the beer is extremely clear. It compresses as it sits.

That little bit of beer to the right is all of the 5 gallons that DIDN'T get vaccumed off the surface of the tight trub. Note how clear it is, there's little if any floaties in there.

When I put 5 gallons in my fermenter, I tend to get 5 gallons into bottles. The cake itself is like cement, it's about an inch thick and very, very dense, you can't just tilt your bucket and have it fall out. I had to use water pressure to get it to come out.

This is the last little bit of the same beer in the bottling bucket, this is the only sediment that made it though and that was done on purpose, when I rack I always make sure to rub the autosiphon across the bottom of the primary to make sure there's plenty of yeast in suspension to carb the beer, but my bottles are all crystal clear and have little sediment in them.

Half the time I forget to use moss, and you can't tell the difference in clarity.

I get the barest hint of sediment in my bottles....just enough for the yeast to have done the job of carbonating the beer.

So the answer is no...it will do what it needs to do in your primary.

Click to expand...

Alright - so assuming I'm going to do two weeks in the primary (the recipe called for less that half that), should I still do two more weeks in the secondary or cut that down to 1 week?

I think you could easily do 2 weeks, then 1 in secondary if you want. Be super sanitary and it should be cool.

I bet if it were me though, I'd do 3 in the primary and bottle it without the second racking. If you're not flavoring it or something, I don't see a reason to.

Any bacteria that tried to get in there would be eaten by the yeast I think. They are micro thugs! lol Not much is going to survive when they are around.

I've left beers in the primary for up to 7 weeks with out any noticeable signs of infection, oxidation or autolysis, and are generally quite clear.

One that was in an Ale Pail for 4-5 weeks for primary won a ribbon in a BJCP sanctioned event.

FWIW

redline said:

Alright - so assuming I'm going to do two weeks in the primary (the recipe called for less that half that), should I still do two more weeks in the secondary or cut that down to 1 week?

Click to expand...

Seriously, follow the forum recommendations with 3 weeks in primary and skip secondary altogether, and you'll make great beer. It's much easier, less risk, and works great. What do you have to lose?

Newb to the forum here. Been reading that it's best to leave in primary for an extended period of time as it couldn't hurt the beer (a lot of ppl are saying leaching flavors from the yeast doesn't happen.)

The consensus on this forum is that secondary isn't necessary. Yet if i have a carboy that's ready to be bottled, how can you minimize the sediment in the transfer process? I leave my carboy's on the floor of the closet during fermentation. When i pick them up to set them on the table in order to get the gravity height, it inevitably stirs up sediment that will get transferred. Any tips on reducing this stirred up sediment if i don't move to secondary? (if you stick it in the fridge to drawn down the sediment you'll still have to pick it up to move it out, and stir up sediment. Is gelatin the only way?)

Good question. For starters, in MY opinion you should generally always rack to another bucket pre-bottling. You have to add priming sugar and that necessitates stirring up your beer without introducing oxygen to ensure the sugar is adequately distributed and dissolved. If you're kegging, this is not a concern.

You can always reduce sedimentation by moving your fermentation vessel to the table the night before. Even a couple hours before should be adequate. Always make sure you are carefu to disturb the sediment as little as possible and always suspend your racking cane a couple inches above the surface of the trub.