What do you say when you taste a bad homebrew?

This is just for kicks. I have had tasted bad homebrew batches but I do not have the heart to tell the brewer it sucks.

Whats your story and what did you say to break the bad news?

I was at the monthy club meeting and was tasting an IPA. From all the IPA's I have tasted in the past. This one tasted more like a weak pale ale with stale hop aroma and flavor. I was able to avoid the brewer during the meeting but I really wanted to tell him is was nasty. I didn't want to start an arguement with a drunk dude I barely know. So I just kept my thoughts to myself.

Any one have a story and care to share the outcome?

Damn, this is beer.

Pick out what you can that is positive about the beer, then constructively address the problem.

So, in your case, you might note that the color is nice, and it has a clean fermentation character. Then, maybe ask a question about the hops used and point out delicately that you think there may be a issue with hop freshness.

KNOTSANE said:

Damn, this is beer.

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Lol, I'm going to need to remember that.


I just tell them that it tastes different from mine and we talk about what we did differently.

RandomBeerGuy said:

This is just for kicks. I have had tasted bad homebrew batches but I do not have the heart to tell the brewer it sucks.

Whats your story and what did you say to break the bad news?

I was at the monthy club meeting and was tasting an IPA. From all the IPA's I have tasted in the past. This one tasted more like a weak pale ale with stale hop aroma and flavor. I was able to avoid the brewer during the meeting but I really wanted to tell him is was nasty. I didn't want to start an arguement with a drunk dude I barely know. So I just kept my thoughts to myself.

Any one have a story and care to share the outcome?

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Positive, constructive, and knowledgable criticism will always be well received.

You gotta give them some good news with the bad. But, I'd be willing to bet that they would like to make better beer. Who doesn't? So, you gotta point out some flaws and offer some ideas about what the cause was and a few ways to try to remedy it.

No sense in avoiding him and stifling his growth as a homebrewer.....unless I guess if he is a drunk that just makes beer to drink, then perhaps avoidance is best (and ignorance is bliss?)

"Hmmm, it's interesting. Did you dry hop it? Seems like it could use a little more hop aroma, particularly for an IPA."

If people don't want to take objective, constructive criticism, they shouldn't be sharing their beer. You never have to be a dick, but you can always open up a line of conversation. If there are multiple issues (maybe it's a little sour as well), just talk about one thing, not everything.

But, you can open up a dialogue easily. If he says "Yeah, three ounces of Cascade!," it's easy to transition to a conversation about how fresh they were, or how he stores them, or things like that. Just keep it respectful, and most people will respond fine.

I absolutely HATE it when people won't say that my beer is off, when I know there's something not quite right. If you never hear anything bad about your bad beers, you never know when your good ones are good!

I say nothing unless feedback is solicited. If the brewer wants feedback, I give an honest critique.

Pointing our the positives and negatives of homebrew is pivotal part to all becoming better brewers. They way I see it is if your going to bring our beer to share with a room full of your peers, you should expect "feed back", both positive and negative.

I have similar experiences, and in talking to the brewer found that they had used a prepackaged kit or hops from one of our LHBS that does not take steps IMHO to insure their ingredients are as fresh as they could be. I try to keep in mind that a beer is only as good as it's ingredients, no matter how tight of a process the brewer follows.

I have had brewers get a little "testy" with constructive criticism. The way I have handled it is by backing off and suggest they try entering some into a competition. It can take some of the "ego" out of it when they get score sheets that have similar comments to the critiques they may have gotten from their peers.

Yuri_Rage said:

I say nothing unless feedback is solicited. If the brewer wants feedback, I give an honest critique.

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This. When a brewer gives me a beer, I'll often ask whether they want just a general opinion or if they want a detailed critique.

My general policy is that people shouldn't ask questions they don't want to know the answers to (or ask for my opinion if they're just looking for compliments). This has led to some awkward moments after going to friends' band gigs or stage plays.

I never offer criticism from a dickish place, and I always try to find something positive. I am also careful to understand the difference between things I don't care for just because of personal taste and preferences, and things that are actually "wrong" (for lack of a better word).

I've started developing the ability to sense when people are open to real feedback and when they just want a compliment. It isn't easy. I usually start with as honest a compliment as I can generate, then maybe ask a process question. The response usually is enough to let me know whether someone is open to constructive criticism or not.

For me, if I play a gig or perform in a show, I ultimately want some honest feedback so I can improve, but not right after the show. If I'm enjoying myself after I come off stage I'd rather have someone wait until a later time to have that conversation so as not to kill my buzz. It doesn't mean I'm delusional, it just means I'd like to enjoy the moment and the sense of accomplishment I've earned. But if I perform in a class or workshop, then I'd expect criticism right away.

I haven't attended a homebrew club meeting yet, but I imagine that some people share their beers to get criticism (probably people who have been at it for a while) and others just want to feel proud of having accomplished something (probably more of a beginner thing). So I think you just need to be able to develop a sense of what people are open to hearing.

Maybe homebrew club meetings should let members fill out a nametag, but instead of a name the member could write "Compliments" or "Honest Feedback" on it and wear it at the event to indicate what they're open to. Then everyone gets what they want and no one has to avoid anyone.

Yuri_Rage said:

I say nothing unless feedback is solicited. If the brewer wants feedback, I give an honest critique.

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Exactly, people aren't going to learn anything about improving their brews if you say their beers are good even if they suck. No need to be a dick about feedback...however sometimes they don't take it gracefully.

Maybe offer to join/assist them during a brew session?

I'm used to non-craft beer drinkers, non-beer drinkers, and just non-drinkers in general, saying that they don't like the taste of my beer or that it's too bitter. I would prefer that another homebrewer would at least extend the courtesy of giving me an honest opinion, so that I have something to go from. I know a lot of people will sigh at my CraigTube reference, but I like the way he does it. He says that if he's given a beer to review on-air and it's bad, he won't embarrass the homebrewer by airing the take...he'll just shoot them an email. To me, that's an honest and respectful way to approach it.

i was discussing this at our last club meeting. i just keep hearing a monotone "it's good" even when i ask for negative feedback. I'M TRYING TO IMPROVE. the consensus was that you probably aren't going to get any really negative feedback. pay attention to their initial reacion while drinking it. and if its an over the top positive they either don't know what they are tasting, or they are lying, either way, ignore what they say.

As mentioned before I wholeheartedly agree with the admonition that if feedback is not requested then it should not be given (unless, of course, said comestable is likely to cause food poisoning or other negative physical reaction).

With that said, as is true for any creative endeavour I prefer to have positive comments along with the negative comments so that in refining my process I can fix what's wrong and leave what's right alone.

I know I make some good beer. I also know that not every batch is pure awesomeness. I want ideas from people as to what they think needs tweaked in a recipe or process.

Truth is most people don't want to seem rude, so they're afraid to say anything that isn't positive.

The worst is when people say they want honest feedback, and then get cranky that you are honest.

It's definitely awkward, and there are some great suggestions in this thread.

I often hand out samples to co-workers and friends, and one idea I'm toying with is including a card with every bottle I hand out. I'll ask what flavors they detect, etc., and give them a list to tick off, and also what the would change about it. I'll gladly keep handing out the beer if they'll fill out and return the card.

Granted this doesn't address the face to face tasting, but I'm hoping the somewhat generic card might help people be more honest.

Criticism is a tough road for many people. Both giving and getting. According to my wife, I'm not one of those people.

I have no problem with someone saying one of my brews tastes like hobo testicles (saw hobo testicles as a taste description in another thread and laughed my ass off) , but follow it up with a possible way to resolve it.

I will say that I'll only take criticism from another home brewer, or at least a craft brew drinker. The average BMC drinker has no place critiquing a home brew IMO, as they won't like most home brews weather they are perfect to style or really bad.

If asked, I will usually say it's just not to my liking, and if pressed for a reason I'll try to pin point what I feel is the off taste.

Tell a guy his bad beer is great and you will taste more bad beer.

Be honest. Seriously.

I'm my own biggest critic. If if taste like ****, I know way before I let someone else try it. I've had one group of of home brewers love one and another group hate it. It's all about what style people like. Most home brewers or craft drinkers will tell you ahead that they really don't like that style. I'm the same way.

I have learned to just lay out what tastes off. Keep it impartial without any judgement statements

If they have made other beers you've tried, point out that beer. Then ask them if they have tried anything new or if they have heard about flame put additions of hops and how it could make the beer really stand out. Just my opinion but there's a lot of techniques out there and getting more info about them is usually pretty helpful.