German Pils Gavin's Glorious German Pilsner

Williams 728
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Gavin C said:
Hope it turns out great for you. Keep us posted.

The data I include in the recipe is from Beersmith.

Differing boil-times and alpha acid content will impact the estimated IBU's the software calculates. My numbers are correct (insofar as they are an estimate based on data available to me)

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I wonder why there is so much of difference? I used the same ingredients.. except i didnt use the Saaz hops as I only had the Hals.
 
wyowolf said:
I wonder why there is so much of difference? I used the same ingredients.. except i didnt use the Saaz hops as I only had the Hals.
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Are the AA% for the hops the same?
Are the boil times the same?
Is the gravity of the wort similar?

The type of hop is a non-issue WRT raw calculations of IBU.
 
Boil times same yes, the AA i believe were 4.4? or 4.3... they are US hals not german. My gravity was lower about 1.044, my new eBIAB system has consistently given me low numbers :(

going to go home and play around with the numbers.. I dont see why that should be so much different in my case since I am using virtually the same ingredients and procedures...
 
wyowolf said:
Boil times same yes, the AA i believe were 4.4? or 4.3... they are US hals not german. My gravity was lower about 1.044, my new eBIAB system has consistently given me low numbers :(

going to go home and play around with the numbers.. I dont see why that should be so much different in my case since I am using virtually the same ingredients and procedures...
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That's the reason. Your hops are much higher in AA. 50+% higher
 
yes, going back home and checking I can see yours are about half. But when I look them up in Beersmith I get

US Hal 4.5
Ger Hal 4.8

why are yours different? sorry not trying to be difficult, just curious. Before I would have just entered all this into BS and not checked, but when it came back so much different I was confused.
 
wyowolf said:
yes, going back home and checking I can see yours are about half. But when I look them up in Beersmith I get

US Hal 4.5
Ger Hal 4.8

why are yours different? sorry not trying to be difficult, just curious. Before I would have just entered all this into BS and not checked, but when it came back so much different I was confused.
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No worries at all. Not difficult whatsoever.

The hops can be any number AA%. The two you give are just two default values that the software creator decided to include. The numbers bear no relation to the true AA% of your hops. The writer may just as easily have assigned a different value.

You can and should add/edit any hop in the software to match reality.

Year to year, crop to crop, alpha acid content will vary. Every hop you buy will have an AA% on the pack. That's the number to use, not a default value in a program.

Every recipe out there can and should be tweaked to meet the specifications of your hops if you want to match the IBU of the recipe.

There are a lot of default values in beersmith; not just in the ingredient section, that seem to confuse people. They are rarely useful.
 
Thank you very much, I didn't realize that. I just plug in the values and assume they are correct.

I noticed the style of MH calls for 16 to 22 IBU, but yours seems much higher?
mine are at 20.


Gavin C said:
No worries at all. Not difficult whatsoever.

The hops can be any number AA%. The two you give are just two default values that the software creator decided to include. The numbers bear no relation to the true AA% of your hops. The writer may just as easily have assigned a different value.

You can and should add/edit any hop in the software to match reality.

Year to year, crop to crop, alpha acid content will vary. Every hop you buy will have an AA% on the pack. That's the number to use, not a default value in a program.

Every recipe out there can and should be tweaked to meet the specifications of your hops if you want to match the IBU of the recipe.

There are a lot of default values in beersmith; not just in the ingredient section, that seem to confuse people. They are rarely useful.
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wyowolf said:
Thank you very much, I didn't realize that. I just plug in the values and assume they are correct.

I noticed the style of MH calls for 16 to 22 IBU, but yours seems much higher?
mine are at 20.
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If I understand you to mean MH=Munich Helles that does sound right for the IBU level. This is a Pilsner recipe though.

I do have a Munich Helles recipe in the forum too if that's what you're describing. Sorry if I have the wrong end of the stick.
 
Gavin C said:
If I understand you to mean MH=Munich Helles that does sound right for the IBU level. This is a Pilsner recipe though.

I do have a Munich Helles recipe in the forum too if that's what you're describing. Sorry if I have the wrong end of the stick.
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Damn, now I'm an idiot. you're right. For some reason i was thinking this was a MH...

well , I made something :) other that the Saaz hops i followed everything else pretty much exactly.

now i remember, i was reading your MH thread and got the two confused for some reason.
 
wyowolf said:
Damn, now I'm an idiot. you're right. For some reason i was thinking this was a MH...

well , I made something :) other that the Saaz hops i followed everything else pretty much exactly.

now i remember, i was reading your MH thread and got the two confused for some reason.
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No worries mate. Easy mistake to make. Not a biggie. Sounds like you'll have a nice crisp tasty Pils on your hands. Let me know if there are any other wrinkles in either of the recipes you'd like me to iron out. Happy to help out if I can. Best of luck.
 
NTexBrewer said:
Yes

Entered a
German Pils (Firestone Walker Pivo Pils Clone)
American Premium Lager
Euro Amber Lager
Belgian Wit
English Dark Mild
Lawnmower Beer

Had a huge office pool party a few weeks ago and having family reunion this weekend so I brewed a lot of easy drinking beers for those events and I figured I might as well enter them.
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> Tipsy.....I am looking for a recipe for Pivo Pils...care to give yours? Thanks
 
Brewed up another variant batch of this Pils this morning.

Slightly altered hop schedule owing to different AA% of the hops.

Changed up the yeast too

Hot Break

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Cold Break

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Hops

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OG as planned 1.047

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Yeast

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Fun brew all in all.

24 hours post pitching at 48°F

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1481494472.381233.jpgView attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1481494652.355009.jpg

3 weeks later
FG 1.008

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1482783257.378156.jpg
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Harvested Slurry form FV at Kegging (~3 pints)
View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1482784138.443090.jpg
 
Just a vote for this one, it's a hell of a recipe. Crisp as you like it. I will say, having made it twice, I seriously recommend WLP 830/833 over Saflager 34/70... the latter just doesn't deliver that up-front crisp lager character.
 
I have a few questions on my first Lager attempt.
If I changed the pilsner to 2 row and used 34/70 yeast leaving everything else the same would that give me more of an American Pilsner/lager. It seems the hops would still work.

How do I know if I need the acid malt? I attached my mostly useless water report I waited 2 weeks for.

Would this work for a fast lager method?

5 days at 50 deg (or whatever you would recommend)
free rise to room temp 65 deg and leave for a week
Crash to 32 for 7 days
Keg carb drink.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=599980
 
I just made 11 gallons of this myself only I cut down on the recipe by a lb of pils because of my efficiencies and I still hit 1.046 into the fermenter... I also used up an abundance of 34/70 I had in the fridge (5 packages was needed according to beersmith..)
 
augiedoggy said:
I just made 11 gallons of this myself only I cut down on the recipe by a lb of pils because of my efficiencies and I still hit 1.046 into the fermenter... I also used up an abundance of 34/70 I had in the fridge (5 packages was needed according to beersmith..)
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Hope it turns out well for you Augiedoggy.
 
Did a 10g batch today everything seemed to go well and numbers were hit.

Splitting the batch between a fresh WLP800 starter and WLP940 slurry from an international amber.

The batch with the Mexican Lager slurry is going to get .5 to 1 pound of Cascade Blood orange and tangerine candy sugar a few days into fermentation. I found it on sale and it sounded interesting.

nice pile of Saaz and Hallertau:
img_68291-68033.jpg


Obligatory HBT sideways picture...
img_68101-68031.jpg
 
Planning to make a 10g batch in the next week. I don't have melanoiden malt but I do have aromatic malt. From what I've gathered, they are interchangeable.

But I'm curious, at 1.4% of it, how much of it does it impart in this recipe?
 
hio3791 said:
Planning to make a 10g batch in the next week. I don't have melanoiden malt but I do have aromatic malt. From what I've gathered, they are interchangeable.

But I'm curious, at 1.4% of it, how much of it does it impart in this recipe?
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Melanoiden mimics the mouthfeel and flavor of the decoction process to a degree.

Aromatic is similar but with more of an emphasis on aroma.

Im nt entirely sure that they are a 1 for 1 substitute in this recipe but I think you would be ok doing that.
 
hio3791 said:
Planning to make a 10g batch in the next week. I don't have melanoiden malt but I do have aromatic malt. From what I've gathered, they are interchangeable.

But I'm curious, at 1.4% of it, how much of it does it impart in this recipe?
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Probably not a whole lot. Pilsner is typically 100% Pils in many cases. There is not a whole lot to a Pils recipe. It's more in the tweaks and process that can perhaps make one better.

I've brewed this recipe with and without the Melanoiden malt. I used a decoction mash when I went without and used a different yeast and hop so I have no clue what difference if any were attributable to the deletion of Melanoiden.

Leave it out completely or sub in what you have. It will be a different Pils but probably a very delicious one nonetheless.

The hop combination of Saaz and Hallertau is one I keep coming back to. The WLP833 in the recipe is a good choice. Probably my favorite. In the grand scheme of things the melanoiden malt use or its omission is small potatoes.
 
Thanks Jekeane and Galvin. I knew melanoiden is used to emulate the flavor and mouth feel of decoction but my question was specifically to the amount used in the recipe, it just seems small but maybe that's all is needed. Your palate might be more sophisticated than mine too!

I might go with half a pound of aromatic in 10g. I've used aromatic before and it does impact quite a bit of aroma and flavor.

Thanks!
 
hio3791 said:
Thanks Jekeane and Galvin. I knew melanoiden is used to emulate the flavor and mouth feel of decoction but my question was specifically to the amount used in the recipe, it just seems small but maybe that's all is needed. Your palate might be more sophisticated than mine too!

I might go with half a pound of aromatic in 10g. I've used aromatic before and it does impact quite a bit of aroma and flavor.

Thanks!
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No worries hio. Sounds like an interesting idea. The only beer I've used aromatic malt in was my Alt. I reckon 8oz in a 10g batch o' Pils will be pretty subtle. Could work quite nicely to bring something new to the Pils-table.

Best of luck with your brew.
 
Thanks for the detailed recipe, I'm going to try this one for sure. If I'm using 100% RO water, would 1/2 tsp of calcium chloride per 5 gallons be enough minerals? Should I add anything else? I'm a noob trying to wade through the "Brewing Water Chemistry Primer" thread.
 
Just finished making a 10g batch. Ended at 1.052. Looking forward to enjoying in a few weeks.

And just started a second 10g batch of Centennial Blonde Ale. Back to back batches baby! Taking advantage of the cool temps and cold ground water which speeds up chilling.

Building the pipeline in time for summer!
 
If I were to use 34/70 dry lager yeast for my 5.5 gallon batch would two packages (11.5 grams each) be sufficient?
 
oscarjets said:
If I were to use 34/70 dry lager yeast for my 5.5 gallon batch would two packages (11.5 grams each) be sufficient?
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34/70 is a beast. After reading the Brulosophy fermentation temp experiments with this strain I was inspired to play around with it myself. I've now brewed 2 pilsners with this yeast fermented at 19C (66F) using 2 packets each. Both came out perfectly.

I've actually got this exact recipe going into a keg tonight. I used 1 packet of 34/70 fermented at 15.5C (60F) for this one to see how it turns out. The sample out of the hydrometer was delicious so I've got pretty high hopes for it.

Tl:dr - 2 packets of 34/70 is lots. I have a sneaking suspicion that 1 packet would be enough.
 
Thanks, I was getting caught up with these yeast calculators (which I have never used before) that were telling me I needed roughly 5 packages. That didn't seem right at all.
 
The yeast calculators are over stated. I've used a single vial of 1+ year old yeast in a yeast starter with a store plate and had fully attenuated beers (fully fermented). I think 5-pacers must be good for 20+ gallons of beer.
 
Kaze said:
Thanks for the detailed recipe, I'm going to try this one for sure. If I'm using 100% RO water, would 1/2 tsp of calcium chloride per 5 gallons be enough minerals? Should I add anything else? I'm a noob trying to wade through the "Brewing Water Chemistry Primer" thread.
Click to expand...

Answered my own question. About 1.3 tsp (6.5g) of gypsum got the water profile pretty close when using 8 gallons RO water full volume mash. Got it even closer with some more tweaking.


.

water.JPG
 
Had a few bumps in the road on this batch, not much experience with lagers. Left the brewpot valve open at beginning of sparging losing the first quart or two of wort. Made it up with 2/3 # dme.(doh!) Using dry yeast, hope it's as beautiful as some of the other examples on this thread. 12 more days at 53` and then lagering. I'll report back in a month or so!
 
Sunbeam my guess is it will turn out great. If you pitched enough healthy yeast and are following a fermentation schedule I would rest easy. I just brewed another one myself on 8/19. This is such a great beer. Cheers!
 

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