3711 & Brett

I'm planning on doing a saison this next weekend, but have a question about when to add the Brett. My initial plan Eas to mash high (153-155), primary with 3711, transfer to secondary when fermentation is 2/3 finished and hit with Brett. But now I'm wondering if I might be better pitching both in the primary (smack pack of 3711 and big starter of Brett).

I know 3711 is a beast and just want to make sure the Brett has enough to feed on...

Thanks in advance.

I'm not sure on the exact process, but I heard the head brewer at Avery talking about adding sugar with Brett to secondary so that there's something for them to eat in addition to the long-chain, less-fermentable sugars left by 3711.

Makes sense...boil the sugar, honey?

I'd mash higher yet like 158 and pitch the brett with the 3711. You might have a fighting chance to get some brett flavor that way.

I have a saison going now (4 weeks) that I pitched 3711/5112(brett b) together. It seems ok to me. I'd say just pitch them together. If you like the beer, it's a lot easier to repeat that process. It dropped to 1.004 after about 5 days, and now is at 1.002, and will probably be ready to bottle in a week or two when I have the time. (It started at 1.054).

Don't make a big starter with the Brett. A lot of the traditional Brett flavor is the result of anaerobic reproduction of the stressed yeast. If you make a big starter and pitch it up-front, you will get aerobic reproduction giving you different flavors. You may prefer the result as you will probably get more fruity flavors that way.

The amount you get in a vial/pack is all you need to pitch. You can pitch it with the primary yeast too if you want, it probably will not make much difference as the Brett will be slower starting, and the 3711 will probably have finished by the time the Brett really gets going.

3711 is a madman and is going to finish out your beer quickly and thoroughly. If you want to add brett to the secondary, you can boil up some malto-dextrine and add that so the bugs have something to feed on. 4-8 oz. More malto-dextrine will give you more brett character.

Now I'll have to check, but I primed a batch of saison with MD and brett. The non-MD part of the batch with out the brett was much lower carbed. The MD part of the batch was higher carbonated. It's been close to a year since I bottled it and I have a few bottles left, but they're 100 miles away right now. Next time I'm visiting my family I'll grab some and give it a shot. Anyway long story short the last time I drank some there was very little brett character even after six months. The 3711 just doesn't leave anything for the brett to use.

I brewed a Saison on 10/15/11 with 75% 3724, 15% 3711 and 10% Brett B, all pitched at once at .83 Million cells/mL/ºP. Did the traditional Saison Dupont mash regime, 113F to mashout ramp, .5ºF per minute.
1.0545 OG, pitched at 66F. Held there for 24 hrs and ramped to 85F. Checked the gravity after 2 weeks and it was down to 1.007. After another week 1.005. Let naturally cool to 70F and after another week was 1.004. Bottled to 4 volumes. Just last week, a noticeable amount of Brett is coming through. Really turned out nice, I could drink it all right now but want to save it for the spring and summer. If the Brett flavor continues to increase over the next few weeks, I'll chill all the bottles.