How long for bulk aging brett'd saisons?

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stevehollx

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I'm thinking about doing a dark saison, and throwing some brett in with it.

How long do you folks normally age a saison with brett for? Is 6 months in a secondary sufficient, or do people typically go closer to a year out?
 
After 4 months I have good Brett flavor and only gets better later. If your not adding pedio 6 will be fine. It seems I have good flavor at 2-4 months but it continues to meld and get better up to a year then after it changes less
 
I age them as short as possible. I basically let it get down to a gravity where I'm comfortable bottling. Then prime for about a volume less than what I want the ber to end up. That allows me to get them into the bottle and the brett can take up the rest of the carbonation. This prevents having a 6 gal carboy or larger hanging out for six months or so. I've been doing it this way for two years now and I have to say that I won't do it any other way with saisons. Bulk aging is a waste of carboy space if you ask me for a beer like saisons. You have to consider that the famous saison producers don't hold their saison for six months and then release the beer. So in the time it takes you to bulk age a saison for six months you could have made 3-4 more batches and got them into bottles. Of course this all depends on the yeast strain.
 
I age them as short as possible. I basically let it get down to a gravity where I'm comfortable bottling. Then prime for about a volume less than what I want the ber to end up. That allows me to get them into the bottle and the brett can take up the rest of the carbonation. This prevents having a 6 gal carboy or larger hanging out for six months or so. I've been doing it this way for two years now and I have to say that I won't do it any other way with saisons. Bulk aging is a waste of carboy space if you ask me for a beer like saisons. You have to consider that the famous saison producers don't hold their saison for six months and then release the beer. So in the time it takes you to bulk age a saison for six months you could have made 3-4 more batches and got them into bottles. Of course this all depends on the yeast strain.

My plan exactly. I have a bunch of brett beers going, and bottled one after 3 months primary (I pitched brett with the sacc). I'm always needing more fermenters. I've also heard the beer really starts to develop when bottle conditioned, not so much when bulk aging with no pressure.
 
My brett saison gets bone dry and it's very slow to it, so I have to let it sit 6-9 months, otherwise I'll have overcarbonated bottles. Not really sure why my fellers are so slow but they are.
 
Bottle at stable gravity. I usually do 6-8 weeks because I'm lazy about taking samples. Then enjoy them as the flavor changes over time. Plus you gotta keep those fermenters turning.
 
Bulk vs. Bottle aging really just depends on gravity stability for me. I haven't noticed a big difference on flavor, but I haven't done a side by side. The nice thing about Saison is that the yeast can drop the gravity so low and you can bottle earlier without fear of over-carbing. I would not recommend this for other styles like Flanders Red because the gravity will continue to drop for so long. And if your Saison yeast is not dropping the gravity quick enough (relative to your space needs), add a highly attenuative yeast like Wyeast 3711. This shouldn't change the flavor profile much or at all and allow you to bottle sooner.
 
I meant to say that I don't think the flavor is any different for a beer that was aged in a carboy for 6 months vs. a bottle for 6 months. I agree the taste changes dramatically with time, but I don't think aging vessel matters.
 
My brett saison gets bone dry and it's very slow to it, so I have to let it sit 6-9 months, otherwise I'll have overcarbonated bottles. Not really sure why my fellers are so slow but they are.

What brett and saison yeast are you using? I've been using ECY03 and it can get my beer down to 1.003 rather quick. Maybe my blend is getting out of balance but I like where it's going.
 
What brett and saison yeast are you using? I've been using ECY03 and it can get my beer down to 1.003 rather quick. Maybe my blend is getting out of balance but I like where it's going.

I bottle cultured out of a bottle of Foret. Either there's brett in the bottle or I did a poor job of sanitation during culturing and ended up with some brett and I'm fortunate it tastes good. It's very interesting; it has a very clean yet still funky flavor (if that's possible). It doesn't taste very saison-y once the brett kicks in. I guess I should be a little more clear. It is stable enough to bottle after a few months but the flavor isn't as good and isn't as clean until after the 6 month mark but it continues to develop to about the 18 month mark. So I just let it ride in the fermenter until the flavor is where it's delicious. The first time I bottled it I bottled around three months old (I didn't realize it had brett and I just didn't have time to bottle beforehand) and it had good saison flavor but there was a terrible fecal-y backtaste of fermenting brett. So I'd rather just wait until brett is done making it delicious.
 
with just brett or just brett/sacc, they've moved slower for me, but i think 6 mos is more than enough. i did a belgian tripel that had brett tossed in when fermentation was just about done and it finished out in another month (maybe 2 total) - i have a 100% brett saison going now that is moving pretty slow - 2 mos already and it's still moving (which reminds me, i have to check it tonight).
 
jtakacs - what type of Brett and how big of a starter? My Brett Drie Bitter I did fermented out in 2 weeks with a healthy .5 gal starter in a 5 gal batch.

For Brett/Sacc beers I've found that the time really depends on the amount of sugar left for the Brett. My Saisons or dry Belgian beers that have no crystal malt and a lower mash temp can be ready to bottle in 1-2 months. While my maltier sours like a Flanders Red or Oud Bruin that have 10%+ crystal malt and 155+ mash temp will continue to ferment for at 6-9 months.
 
I did brett c and only a 1 liter starter but I used two white labs vials and got it humming after 3 days. it took off almost immediately in the fermenter.
 

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