Piney/citrusy hops for Christmas DIPA

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RonPopeil

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looking to do a holiday DIPA. over the holidays my parents always get tangerines. for me holiday flavors always include orangey citrus and pine from the tree in the living room. i'd like to replicate those flavors in a beer. here's a roughed out idea i came up with about a month ago.

14# 2 row pale
3# vienna
1# C10
1# C20

.5oz chinook @ 60
1 oz chinook @15
1.5 centennial @ 15
1.0 amarillo @ 15
.5 chinook @ 5
1.5 centennial @ 5

mash @ 145 15mins then 155 45mins, 4L starter cali ale.

OG 1.089
FG 1.018
IBU 81

I've been debating the hopping. was thinking of doing cascade instead of amarillo or possibly in addition. i also plan on adding some orange peel to the mix. some sort of spice would be nice as well like anise. just not sure how to set this up. please drop any input you can.

HELP!!
 
I'd avoid the anise, TBH. Not a great fit for an IPA. Maybe a spot of ginger instead?

And doing 0.5 amarillo/0.5 cascade @ 15 minutes and then dryhopping with cascade would be nice... IIRC Sierra Nevada's Celebration Ale uses a centennial/cascade combination and it's great.

Instead of orange peel, though, use orange zest. Way punchier, in the holiday way you're looking for. :)
 
I'd avoid the anise, TBH. Not a great fit for an IPA. Maybe a spot of ginger instead?

And doing 0.5 amarillo/0.5 cascade @ 15 minutes and then dryhopping with cascade would be nice... IIRC Sierra Nevada's Celebration Ale uses a centennial/cascade combination and it's great.

Instead of orange peel, though, use orange zest. Way punchier, in the holiday way you're looking for. :)
do i use the zest in the boil or secondary?
 
Great advice.

Be very careful with anise, its so strong and quite frankly gross in beer. I had to age a pilsner 4-5 months to get it drinkable. You'll need more chinook later if you want that piney aspect in your brew. And I always add zest at flameout, and sometimes in the secondary if I want it to shine.
 
Summit hops have a tangerine flavor and aroma, I would definitely add them to the recipe. They are one of my favorite hops and do great in IPAs
 
Summit hops have a tangerine flavor and aroma, I would definitely add them to the recipe. They are one of my favorite hops and do great in IPAs
do you think adding something like that late in the boil would be necessary to glue the orange zest flavor together or would i be alright with lots of centennial and cascade late in the boil?
 
Probably depends on your taste. Won't know until you try it, etc etc.

Though I'm sure either way it'll be tasty.
 
What's your intent with that mash schedule? With DIPAs I like to dry it out a little and not Ed up with a huge body. I'd extend that initial mash to an hour or even 90 mins and then finish up with a 15-20 min rest at 156. It's my understanding that beta doesn't work that fast so 15 mins is probably not enough.
 
What's your intent with that mash schedule? With DIPAs I like to dry it out a little and not Ed up with a huge body. I'd extend that initial mash to an hour or even 90 mins and then finish up with a 15-20 min rest at 156. It's my understanding that beta doesn't work that fast so 15 mins is probably not enough.
the idea was to dry it out some. more so as a precaution because of the huge OG. last high gravity brew i did with california ale finished pretty high. i've heard beta amylase is slower to function but i didn't want to completely dry this out like a tripel. it was either a short beta rest with a step mash or a single step mash at 150.
 
the original plan was to do this with all vienna base malt. is that a good platform for piney hops? i figured the toasty caramel flavor would go with fruity hops a bit more. would it be recommended to switch to vienna with a touch of munich 10 and drop the crystal grains all together?
 
alright, getting close to go time. i was reading the cigar city jai alai thread and caught fond of the idea of pitching enormous amounts of english yeast in an IPA. i'm doing an english bitter right now to get a yeast cake for this beer using whitbread dry/wlp007. recommended? or should i gather a good amount of something else?

here's the rest of the recipe.

6 gal batch

12# vienna
6# pils
.5# melanoiden

1.0oz Summit @ 60
0.5oz Summit @ 15
1.5oz Amarillo @ 15
2.0oz Chinook @ 5
1.5oz Summit @ 5
0.5oz Amarillo @ 5

OG 1.085
FG 1.013 (85%)
ABV 9.4
IBU 96.4
SRM 7.7
IBU/GU 1.13

most of my concern is the hopping. i'm shooting for pine dominance over a layer of citrus because i'm doing an ounce of orange peel in secondary for this. just gonna hit'm with the orange peel rather than boil it or add at whirlpool. from what i see this setup has tons of fruit and not much pine. if someone could guide me to the piney hops that would be ideal. i blasted it with chinook at the end but if arrogant bastard is any indicator i may need to add something else to get the idea through.

i was thinking of doing simcoe but i've only ever done it with amarillo and citra in equal proportions. i don't associate simcoe with pine which, from what i understand, is odd.

a thought that just occurred. i could boil all these fruity/citrusy hops and then blast the piney pack at FO/whirlpool or secondary.
 
WLP007 is a great yeast for american IPAs, I usually ferment with it around 66 to get a nice subtle english flavor, the colder you ferment the cleaner it will be. Its a very versatile yeast.

As for piney hops, you already talked about the only two I associate with being piney, chinook and less so simcoe, both will contribute a fruit too so those combined with summit and amarillo the pine probably wont dominate the aroma, but definitely still present.

If you can get a hold of some spruce tips, those will give great pine aroma.
 
Yeah. I've heard numbers like 1/3rd cake for a big beer, but the consensus seems to be that you should make a starter anyway to ensure a known quantity of yeast.
 
Ok. I haven't heard that yet. I was going to scoop a bit off and wash it before putting the IPA down but I didn't intend on reducing it by that much.
 
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