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Dkidwell83

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I have been thinking about this quite a bit lately and have talked with a couple people in my area about the question. Could a small scale brewery survive that was a "batch by batch brewery" that made each batch by hand instead of withy machines and sold the beer under the idea that the proof of making it by hand was in the fact that although each batch is very similar in flavor, there are slight nuances that can be detected but that this is where the enjoyment in drinking it comes from.
 
I think if you can manage distribution, and whatever production schedule you need for that - sure you could survive. I mean you aren't going to run a successful micro with a bunch of 5gal carboys in shelfs.

Getting into the business requires funds, and/or time. Time because it takes time to accumulate all the equipment you will need for large scale production without breaking the bank. A loan may help you out in this regards..

I'm quite interested in this thread..
 
I believe this is the concept behind single malt scotches and single barrel bourbons. Each batch allows a slightly different flavor profile to come through to the consumer and will always be unique.

They stay in business through low supply and high demand which of course allows them to charge a super premium price. Plus, some of that stuff is decades old too.

I like the idea of applying this to small scale brewing. Wait, that's what I'm already doing! :rockin:
 
I believe most small breweries already do this. Unless you're talking brewing in carboys for really small batches. I don't think anyone brewing on a 7-10 bbl system is using machines to mix in the ingredients.

The brewery I work at has very subtle differences between batches. We have a ten bbl system. The OG's fluctuate up to a whole degree plato, attenuation varies, we add more dry hops to the pale ales going to competition.

Then there's the oops variations. A couple months ago, Travis (our head brewer) accidentally crash cooled our golden ale after only a week. We had to slowly step up temperatures to get the yeast rocking again, then lagered it for another month before we kegged. And last week I mis-counted the grain bags when I was milling so we ended up with a higher percentage of wheat in the grist, and undershot the OG.

It is a brewpub business, so 95% of what we make goes straight out the taps on the other side of the glass. We don't bottle. But we make consistently good beer on every batch.

In regards to your question, I think it would depend on your business model. At a brewpub or microbrewery with just a tasting room, you could probably run it successfully never repeating a recipe, but people are always going to want to have that beer that they had last month, and you won't have any more.

If you're looking to bottle, you're going to need a good consistent product that isn't going to change and has a good shelf life.

We have four flagship beers that will always be on tap. A gold, wheat, amber, and a pale ale.

Then we usually have 4-5 seasonals that vary quite a bit. It may be a recipe that we've made before, or it might be something brand new. We're planning a Baltic Porter and a Raspberry Amber right now.

wow, that was a long response and I'm not sure if I answered your question at all.
 
MTpilot said:
we add more dry hops to the pale ales going to competition.
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Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying here, but if you're entering a beer under a name that you market and you're changing the recipe to alter/improve it, I think that's underhanded and dishonest. The consumer would be buying what they think is an award winning brew and instead they're getting something that's deliberately less than what was judged.
 
Fingers said:
Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying here, but if you're entering a beer under a name that you market and you're changing the recipe to alter/improve it, I think that's underhanded and dishonest. The consumer would be buying what they think is an award winning brew and instead they're getting something that's deliberately less than what was judged.
Click to expand...


I disagree. It's the same beer. If you added 15% more dry hops to a recipe and didn't change anything else, do you think it's a whole new beer?

Also, everyone is tweaking there hops due to the price increases. At least all four breweries here are. And I guarantee that no one is going to change the name of the beer just because their using simcoes instead of cascades.

The only way you would have been able to detect the increased hops in that beer would be a side by side comparison.
 
MTpilot said:
I disagree. It's the same beer. If you added 15% more dry hops to a recipe and didn't change anything else, do you think it's a whole new beer?

Also, everyone is tweaking there hops due to the price increases. At least all four breweries here are. And I guarantee that no one is going to change the name of the beer just because their using simcoes instead of cascades.

The only way you would have been able to detect the increased hops in that beer would be a side by side comparison.
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[OK, I just want you to read this...I am NOT angry with you or your organization...I am only stating facts (as I know them), so please don't get angry back...that is not my intent].

How many times have you witnessed someone say "This doesn't taste the same as I remember it." ? ? ?

I have to disagree with you - yes, it's entirely another beer!

It is not the same beer the customer has been drinking and the customer should be told about the change in the recipe along with WHY the changes were made. If you don't then that's an old bait and switch technique called fraud.

IMO, changing recipes is underhanded, immoral and proof that all companies care about is the bottom line and not the product or their customers.

Even Coke and Pepsi changed the names of their products when they changed their recipes. Maybe their lawyers know something....

Of course, this doesn't apply to you, right? ;)

[Are we still friends? :D ]
 
MTpilot said:
If you added 15% more dry hops to a recipe and didn't change anything else, do you think it's a whole new beer?
Click to expand...

Actually, yes I do. It may be quite similar to the one you sell, but it's certainly not the same and if it's marketed as the same, that's not right, IMO. The whole point of these competitions are to get the experts to judge the beer that is being sold. An award winning beer with 15% less hops is not an award winning beer any longer.
 
homebrewer_99 said:
[OK, I just want you to read this...I am NOT angry with you or your organization...I am only stating facts (as I know them), so please don't get angry back...that is not my intent].[\QUOTE]

No anger here. This is a discussion and an interesting one at that in the ethics of commercial brewing

homebrewer_99 said:
[
How many times have you witnessed someone say "This doesn't taste the same as I remember it." ? ? ? ][\QUOTE]

I have seen this quite a bit. And the reason the same beer taste a little different from the last time could be that the recipe got tweaked, the beer got warm in transport, it got lightstruck, the asst. brewer mistakenly tweaked the grain bill, the brewer was trying something new to make the beer better, the keg wasn't cleaned properly, the lines weren't clean,...

homebrewer_99 said:
[
I have to disagree with you - yes, it's entirely another beer! ][\QUOTE]

no two batches are ever the same, but the same base recipe, tweaked a little bit are still going to get marketed and sold the same (at least at the small level of commercial brewing)

homebrewer_99 said:
[
It is not the same beer the customer has been drinking and the customer should be told about the change in the recipe along with WHY the changes were made. ][\QUOTE]

I also wait tables and bartend at the brewpub. I told everyone that liked that beer that this was a special batch, with extra hops, for a competition. They were very appreciative. I never had anybody ask, "well why don't you brew it like this all the time?"

homebrewer_99 said:
[
If you don't then that's an old bait and switch technique called fraud.
IMO, changing recipes is underhanded, immoral and proof that all companies care about is the bottom line and not the product or their customers. ][\QUOTE]

I don't feel it was anywhere near fraud, nor immoral. The bottom line is definitely why it is the way it is, but that's business. Not that I agree with it. If the brewer, or myself were the ones signing the paychecks, the beer would always have that extra cascade aroma. But the fact is, the difference was so subtle, most people wouldn't even be able to discern between batches.

homebrewer_99 said:
[
Even Coke and Pepsi changed the names of their products when they changed their recipes. Maybe their lawyers know something....][\QUOTE]

are we really comparing a small brewpub in Montana to coke or pepsi?


No two batches of beer are the same, homebrewing or commercial. The larger breweries have more consistency, so bud light tastes like the same watery mess it always does. But our beers change from batch to batch, it may be a change in the recipe, or a change in the temperature of the strike water. They are not changes to make more money, they are changes to make the beer better.

In this particular instance, the beer was made a little better for the sake of a competition. That seems slightly underhanded for the sake of competition, but not to the customers. On the other hand, in the competition, they're judging that specific batch of that specific beer. There are no rules that say the beer tasted at judging must taste exactly that same as the beer poured from your taps.

The brewers take pride in their work. The quality of their work is judged solely on the product, and it is constantly judged by the customer. This was not an underhanded attempt to make more money. Just a tweak in a recipe for a competition.

homebrewer_99 said:
[Are we still friends? :D ]
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of course we are. and i urge any one of you to come in and drink a Sharptail Pale Ale with me and you'll see that it is still a damn fine beer with only 6 lbs of dry-hopped Cascades


edit: not sure what's wrong with the quotes, can't seem to figure it out either
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MTpilot said:
But our beers change from batch to batch, it may be a change in the recipe, or a change in the temperature of the strike water. They are not changes to make more money, they are changes to make the beer better.
Click to expand...

Or, it's a change because a particular batch is going to a competition, and you want it to be better than the product you're actually selling. :rolleyes:

I have no issue with changes made to compensate for varying ingredients or conditions. That's just proper, brewing technique, and probably quite necessary to maintain production of a reasonably consistent product. But if your brewery is intentionally altering batches specifically for the sake of competition (as you've already stated) and has any intention of using awards for marketing purposes, it absolutely is deceptive and misleading to your customers.

Is it unethical....well, yeah! It doesn't quite rank up there with Enron's shenanigans, but it's unethical. All's fair in homebrewing, but once you start selling to the public there has to be some level of accountability.
 
I think doing small batches as 'handmade' could have a niche.
You'll have to take measures to stand out though...

some ideas:

-Bottle with 22 oz or champagne bottles
-use your label to tell a story. Make batches for local events and indicate it on the label, clearly date it, brewed on, aged X, bottled etc.
-perhaps wax seal your extra special batches
-cycle styles thoroughout the seasons
-try to encourage consumer feedback and involve the public
-get local artists to do label work
 
First off, to the OP: In theory, without the ever-present evil hand of the government on your shoulder, your idea might be economically viable. Might. That would depend on the local market for craft brew. But unfortunately, that evil hand is on your shoulder...telling you how much beer you need to make, and demanding extortio...er, tariffs in exchange for the "right" to sell your product. It's a cruel, cruel f*cking world for the guy who just wants to start a small business...and this is especially true when it comes to certain "evils" like booze. The government regulates and taxes the hell out of alcoholic beverages, because this country still has yet to break free from its puritanical roots. It's a sad reality that you will indeed face if you attempt such an undertaking. The biggest obstacles right off the bat would be the licensing and registration fees, but more importantly, the production minimums. I don't know where you live, but most state liquor boards require tens of thousands of gallons per year of production just to maintain a beer business. Why do they do this? I'm sure they have some kind of logic-bending "it's for the children" justification for it, but the truth is that the larger companies have money to "lobby" (read: bribe) officials to protect their market share by keeping smaller companies from being viable. It's dirty, it's underhanded, and it's the reality of our government. You'll notice it in other industries too...for instance, there's a local goat farm that produces great goat cheese. But he got "shut down" because "big dairy" lobbied the government to bolster the laws and regulations in the industry, and increase their reach to the smallest of small guys. Now, of course, the gubmint will say that it's just protecting the consumer from evil tainted goat cheese, but everyone knows the truth.

Anyway, /soapbox.


And as for MTpilot's issues, I believe that, as long as they are above board with their "additions" and tell the customers everything, it's completely ethical. But the minute they hang a competition medal from the menu board and call it an "award-winning brew", but don't offer up that exact same recipe to the customer, it becomes an egregious case of ethical spoilage. I mean, let's say a brewery has 4 beers, all of them mid-to-low OG brews and nothing out of the ordinary. One day, they brew a high-og Old Ale and age it in oak, then send it off to competitions. They win a medal. Hey, they hang that medal in their brewpub. Cool. But they don't offer that beer to the public. No worries...until you make the inference that some of your regular beers are award-winners. This isn't really any different, but it's all about how you communicate with your customers.
 
Evan! said:
First off, to the OP: In theory, without the ever-present evil hand of the government on your shoulder, your idea might be economically viable. Might. That would depend on the local market for craft brew. But unfortunately, that evil hand is on your shoulder...telling you how much beer you need to make, and demanding extortio...er, tariffs in exchange for the "right" to sell your product. It's a cruel, cruel f*cking world for the guy who just wants to start a small business...and this is especially true when it comes to certain "evils" like booze. The government regulates and taxes the hell out of alcoholic beverages, because this country still has yet to break free from its puritanical roots. It's a sad reality that you will indeed face if you attempt such an undertaking. The biggest obstacles right off the bat would be the licensing and registration fees, but more importantly, the production minimums. I don't know where you live, but most state liquor boards require tens of thousands of gallons per year of production just to maintain a beer business. Why do they do this? I'm sure they have some kind of logic-bending "it's for the children" justification for it, but the truth is that the larger companies have money to "lobby" (read: bribe) officials to protect their market share by keeping smaller companies from being viable. It's dirty, it's underhanded, and it's the reality of our government. You'll notice it in other industries too...for instance, there's a local goat farm that produces great goat cheese. But he got "shut down" because "big dairy" lobbied the government to bolster the laws and regulations in the industry, and increase their reach to the smallest of small guys. Now, of course, the gubmint will say that it's just protecting the consumer from evil tainted goat cheese, but everyone knows the truth.

Anyway, /soapbox.


And as for MTpilot's issues, I believe that, as long as they are above board with their "additions" and tell the customers everything, it's completely ethical. But the minute they hang a competition medal from the menu board and call it an "award-winning brew", but don't offer up that exact same recipe to the customer, it becomes an egregious case of ethical spoilage. I mean, let's say a brewery has 4 beers, all of them mid-to-low OG brews and nothing out of the ordinary. One day, they brew a high-og Old Ale and age it in oak, then send it off to competitions. They win a medal. Hey, they hang that medal in their brewpub. Cool. But they don't offer that beer to the public. No worries...until you make the inference that some of your regular beers are award-winners. This isn't really any different, but it's all about how you communicate with your customers.
Click to expand...

Good info!

Do you have more information on licensing, registration, tariffs, limits, etc? I'm just looking to get educated, but nothing online gives me any real answers. I called my local fascists for alcohol (forget their official name), left a message no return calls..
 
Evan! said:
And as for MTpilot's issues, I believe that, as long as they are above board with their "additions" and tell the customers everything, it's completely ethical. But the minute they hang a competition medal from the menu board and call it an "award-winning brew", but don't offer up that exact same recipe to the customer, it becomes an egregious case of ethical spoilage. I mean, let's say a brewery has 4 beers, all of them mid-to-low OG brews and nothing out of the ordinary. One day, they brew a high-og Old Ale and age it in oak, then send it off to competitions. They win a medal. Hey, they hang that medal in their brewpub. Cool. But they don't offer that beer to the public. No worries...until you make the inference that some of your regular beers are award-winners. This isn't really any different, but it's all about how you communicate with your customers.
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I agree here. After thinking about this overnight, this might have been the first time we made it like that. If the beer had won a medal, I can't imagine any way that we would have gone back to less hops (and we are still talking about dry hopping, not even changing the IBUs)

And once again, we're brewing the same beer, not sending an old ale to competition and selling a mild under the same name. I think this got blown out of proportion some how.
 
El_Borracho said:
Good info!

Do you have more information on licensing, registration, tariffs, limits, etc? I'm just looking to get educated, but nothing online gives me any real answers. I called my local fascists for alcohol (forget their official name), left a message no return calls..
Click to expand...

Depends on where you live. It's different in every state. I'd just keep calling those local booze fascists.
 
Evan! said:
The government regulates and taxes the hell out of alcoholic beverages, because this country still has yet to break free from its puritanical roots.
Click to expand...

I'm not a conspiracy theorist, I believe the evil-doers of the world have enough power to be quite open about it.

There are three things in this country taxed excessivly:

1.) Oil
2.) Alcohol
3.) Tobacco

I find it no co-incidence that two of the three are physically addictive and that the first is culturally addictive. (How many environmentalists would complain about Wal-Mart prices if the trucking industry stopped burning oil today?)

I don't think it's so much that alcohol is "evil" but that alcohol is a tax-based cash cow.
 
I want to open a brewery. Not a large micobrewery with all the bells and whistles, but a brewery with a soul. A brewery that when people that have tried its products hear the name, it puts a smile on their' faces, atleast on the inside. Just like with scotches, I want a brewery the makes each batch by hand with out the use of computers and fancy machines. A brewery that advertises its products as different and unique in there own right. Where the beer they had last month is the same recipe this month, but because its done by hand, and we as humans aren't perfect, it has those slight nuances that are very subtle, that the person with the refined palate such as the wine drinker will appreciate in each bottle they have and enjoy the little differences. Could a brewery such as this survive with the proper marketing tools and reaching the right audience? I think it could, but I want to know what all of you think.
 
davefleck said:
I think doing small batches as 'handmade' could have a niche.
You'll have to take measures to stand out though...

some ideas:

-Bottle with 22 oz or champagne bottles
-use your label to tell a story. Make batches for local events and indicate it on the label, clearly date it, brewed on, aged X, bottled etc.
-perhaps wax seal your extra special batches
-cycle styles thoroughout the seasons
-try to encourage consumer feedback and involve the public
-get local artists to do label work
Click to expand...

I thought of the champagne bottles and stories on the bottles and cyle through seasons and the public. I want to bring out the artisan side of brewing beer. I want to brew and still be able to keep the "dreamy" part of brewing in tact. That's half of what makes it fun to do.
 
State and federal licenses alone(not counting state and fed tax by the oz.) are a few grand a year. I did some rough research and determined that there was no fricking way i could make it without going too big,which defeated the whole mini-micro brew thing.Instead i was thinking trading growlers(bartering) for things.I sooooo want to sell my great suds but it won't work on a small scale legally.If i can have guests pitching yeast for me i theoretically am not gonna have the 200 gal limit.Anyways,these are some of my skewed ideas on the subject:drunk: .
Cheers:mug:
 
>> But the minute they hang a competition medal from the menu board and call it
>> an "award-winning brew", but don't offer up that exact same recipe to the
>> customer, it becomes an egregious case of ethical spoilage

I think this is the crux of it. Everyone who brews realizes that just to make the 'same' beer, you have to tweak your recipe to compensate for ingredients, water, season, etc. And because of that, your beer will naturally vary bbl to bbl. But the instant you knowingly tweak your recipe to win a competition, and then use that win to sell the 'original' recipe (or use the name to imply they are the same), you have violated the trust of your customers. And that is wrong...
 
Wow! All of the moral and ethical people in America came out on this thread!! You guys are killing me!! Are you paying the overhead of the said brewery? Do you have any idea how many breweries go under every week in this country? How about the hop shortage crisis? Are you going to complain when the brewer has to make his famous signiture beer, but with hops that not even he has ever heard of, because the regular hops just aren't available? I live in Northern California, home of the best beers on the planet!! Russian River, Bear Republic, Lagunitas, Moylands, and the list goes on!! I gaurantee that I notice a difference in flavor from batch to batch at every one of those breweries and that is called craft brewing!! And each one has won Gold at the GABF. So this discussion is stupid and pointless. If you are looking for morals and ethics go drink Budwieser or Coors!! Just stop it, and have a hand crafted beer from the local area and thank god that you have it!!
 
Eastside Brewer said:
Wow! All of the moral and ethical people in America came out on this thread!! You guys are killing me!! Are you paying the overhead of the said brewery? Do you have any idea how many breweries go under every week in this country? How about the hop shortage crisis? Are you going to complain when the brewer has to make his famous signiture beer, but with hops that not even he has ever heard of, because the regular hops just aren't available? I live in Northern California, home of the best beers on the planet!! Russian River, Bear Republic, Lagunitas, Moylands, and the list goes on!! I gaurantee that I notice a difference in flavor from batch to batch at every one of those breweries and that is called craft brewing!! And each one has won Gold at the GABF. So this discussion is stupid and pointless. If you are looking for morals and ethics go drink Budwieser or Coors!! Just stop it, and have a hand crafted beer from the local area and thank god that you have it!!
Click to expand...

Interesting viewpoint. Just take what you're given and keep your mouth shut. Does that apply to automobiles, filet mignon and parachutes too?
 
Dkidwell83 said:
I want to open a brewery. Not a large micobrewery with all the bells and whistles, but a brewery with a soul. A brewery that when people that have tried its products hear the name, it puts a smile on their' faces, atleast on the inside. Just like with scotches, I want a brewery the makes each batch by hand with out the use of computers and fancy machines. A brewery that advertises its products as different and unique in there own right. Where the beer they had last month is the same recipe this month, but because its done by hand, and we as humans aren't perfect, it has those slight nuances that are very subtle, that the person with the refined palate such as the wine drinker will appreciate in each bottle they have and enjoy the little differences. Could a brewery such as this survive with the proper marketing tools and reaching the right audience? I think it could, but I want to know what all of you think.
Click to expand...

I don't know the differences between a winery and a brewery, but a LOT of small wineries (at least in my area) survive on the " I'm not a big winery, it's just a bunch of locals making some decent wine out of grapes we grow here. It's all hand crafted and we'd like you to have some. If not, that's ok " mantra.

I think if they can do it, you can do it. The only major difference is storage of the product. They can store cases upon cases for years and years and it only gets better. With your average brew, it's not going to last quite as long. You're also more likely to have go niche, which will give you an even smaller share of the market.

I, personally, love the idea. I think it would take someone with a large land plot and beautiful old house (much like a small winery) that people come to and visit and purchase your wares. I doubt you'd do well with a 'bar in a strip mall' idea.
 
Eastside Brewer said:
Wow! All of the moral and ethical people in America came out on this thread!! You guys are killing me!! Are you paying the overhead of the said brewery? Do you have any idea how many breweries go under every week in this country? How about the hop shortage crisis? Are you going to complain when the brewer has to make his famous signiture beer, but with hops that not even he has ever heard of, because the regular hops just aren't available? I live in Northern California, home of the best beers on the planet!! Russian River, Bear Republic, Lagunitas, Moylands, and the list goes on!! I gaurantee that I notice a difference in flavor from batch to batch at every one of those breweries and that is called craft brewing!! And each one has won Gold at the GABF. So this discussion is stupid and pointless. If you are looking for morals and ethics go drink Budwieser or Coors!! Just stop it, and have a hand crafted beer from the local area and thank god that you have it!!
Click to expand...

Subtle differences between batches is one thing but blatent bait and switch is a whole different story. Overhead, going out of business, etc has nothing to do with modifying recipe for a competition entry. If you sit down at a micro and get the sampler and the layout descriptions note how the IPA is done with Centennial and Cascade, that's what you'd expect is in there. I think you have it backwards. You expect MORE honesty from a micro because they're the crowd most home brewers relate to most.
 
Bobby m, you make a strong point, subtle differences are not the same as blatent bait and switch. I don't honestly know any breweries in my area doing that. But you are totally right, if you go into a brew pub and pay 3 or 4 dolllars for a pint of your favorite IPA and it's something different, that would suck! I think I may have misunderstood the premise of this discussion, my only point is, I don't think the breweries around here are entering one beer and serving another. I agree that we should expect honesty from micro breweries, I am sorry that you have had to experience that.

Eastside
 
Kevin Dean said:
I'm not a conspiracy theorist, I believe the evil-doers of the world have enough power to be quite open about it.

There are three things in this country taxed excessivly:

1.) Oil
2.) Alcohol
3.) Tobacco

I find it no co-incidence that two of the three are physically addictive and that the first is culturally addictive. (How many environmentalists would complain about Wal-Mart prices if the trucking industry stopped burning oil today?)

I don't think it's so much that alcohol is "evil" but that alcohol is a tax-based cash cow.
Click to expand...

And I still haven't figured out why they haven't legalized and taxed the **** out of pot yet. I bet that would put a dent in the old deficit....
 
jdoiv said:
And I still haven't figured out why they haven't legalized and taxed the **** out of pot yet. I bet that would put a dent in the old deficit....
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That and a welcome relief to the prison system, in my small town they have a known rapists on home arrest (pffft) and the county jail is full of personal drug prisoners. That is just not right. I bet Bush could pardon all the pot prisoners on his last day and "fix" the national deficit, lol. I'm not even a fan of pot :D

Of course the unemployment rate would go up as far as DEA agents go :( LOL
 
wortmonger said:
That and a welcome relief to the prison system, in my small town they have a known rapists on home arrest (pffft) and the county jail is full of personal drug prisoners. That is just not right. I bet Bush could pardon all the pot prisoners on his last day and "fix" the national deficit, lol. I'm not even a fan of pot :D
Click to expand...

I think a lot of it has to do with concern for public safety. Look what happened to tobacco - all the crap that's added to it prior to being turned into a Marlboro. Pot isn't addictive now (yeah, right!) but let Winston-Salem have a go at it and it will be.

Plus, you have to think about the DWI factor. People LOVE driving and smoking. When there's no recourse against it, what's to stop people from rolling a Q into one doober and smoking it in a residential neighborhood?

Finally, won't someone please think of the children! A lot of people (myself included) would feel very guilty about getting high in front of their children. Unfortunately, a lot of people feel no guilt about this and the only thing preventing them from blunten parenting is fear that their kid will narc them out.

Besides, pot's not exactly illegal. They don't issue search warrants for dime bags. They're not going to break your door down because your neighbor smells skunky smoke. The law is basically "Smoke it, but do it at home."
 
Cheesefood said:
Plus, you have to think about the DWI factor. People LOVE driving and smoking. When there's no recourse against it, what's to stop people from rolling a Q into one doober and smoking it in a residential neighborhood?
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Why wouldn't there be the same recourse as now? Impaired driving is impaired driving. You can't drink in public, why don't we apply the same law to pot?

Whether you're impaired by an illegal substance or a legal one is a separate issue. In any case, studies in other areas show that legalization would cause a temporary spike as people try the new product followed by leveling off and even decreasing consumption. Holland's consumption is far below America's per capita usage.
 
The key to this discussion is where you are located. Every state has a different take on the brewery topic. A few states actually have a tax break for brewers who brew small amounts (relative) per year. When researching opening a small brewery I was able to find most all of the tax and regulatory information online.

Quick Answer: It's possible, depending on where you are located. It's far from a get rich scheme...
 
Oklahoma is a no tolerance state, a seed can get you a yr. I wouldn't ever condone smoking in front of children or in public, and feel they should treat it the same as DUI/DWI. I am just saying the prison system is overloaded with personal drug prisoners and we have to live with rapists and someone thinks the drugs are worse?
 
Back on topic for myself, I wish they would lower the mandatory amount you have to produce and allow more brewers to get licensed. I guess they don't see the fact they would make more taxes with more alcohol being produced. Make it harder to be a certified brewer, with local inspection to make sure your above board. This would never happen in Oklahoma though, they would first have to change the liquor laws so you could sell refrigerated above 3.2%ABW beer.
 

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