Joe's Ancient Orange Mead

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Soooo, not JAOM🤔😄

Although, that does sound like an interesting flavor profile 💡💡🤔😉
Sooo, does that become a cyser? (or something)
My Ancient is clear, but was waiting for the oranges to fall before I bottled it. Maybe I will rack it into another carboy, then wait for everything to settle. Signs of a beginner..... I didn't realise you had to wait for so long before 'sampling'.
 
@laureen you can sample at any time. But time is your friend. They mellow and flavors meld together as they age. If you can set some aside for at least 6 months, you'll appreciate the improvement.
 
How clear is clear, JAOM started on 12/8/22 exactly per the recipe. Today 2/10/23 most of the raisins and orange have dropped to the bottom, let it sit some more ?
 

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Thats only 2 months, JOAM takes a couple of months to clear and another few months to age to smooth deliciousness. it gets better with age, so why hurry?
Set it and forget it for 4 months at least.

less if you use a modified JOAM (ale yeast and only use the orange zest and meat (not the white part).

but TASTE it every month so you learn the timing of what you like and how it improves.

I can't tell you about JOAM aged over 6 months, it never lasts that long.
 
Hi everybody, I'm new to the whole world of beer and mead, but this seems so easy to pull that I think it's a good one to start with.

My question is, I have an 8 gallon glass carboy what someone gifted me.
How do I know how much more ingredients to put in to compensate for the far bigger amount of water I'll have to use?
Given that cloves and cinnamon and these kind of ingredients tend to be very potent, I'm not sure how much to put in there.
Thanks
 
Hi everybody, I'm new to the whole world of beer and mead, but this seems so easy to pull that I think it's a good one to start with.

My question is, I have an 8 gallon glass carboy what someone gifted me.
How do I know how much more ingredients to put in to compensate for the far bigger amount of water I'll have to use?
Given that cloves and cinnamon and these kind of ingredients tend to be very potent, I'm not sure how much to put in there.
Thanks

Given the price of honey, I would not make a large batch for my very first time.
 
Given the price of honey, I would not make a large batch for my very first time.
I agree. Save your carboy for later.
I have been making mead and beer for 10 years and would never make 8 gallons of something. How boaring to have to drink EXCTLY the same thing for a year or two.
Get a jug of water from the grocery store and TRY making mead first. Or start with a 4 litre/pint jug first.
Learn to walk before you commit to running a marathon.
There are some skills you need to master first.
Unless you like having to drink rocket fuel for the next year or two.
JOAM IS easy.
Use ale yeast, orange zest/pulp and throw away the white part of the orange. Use the proportions of water to honey in the recipe and scale up or down as needed.
Put a bubbler half full of vodka on top and put it in a warm dark cupboard for a month. Ignore it. Don’t touch it. Peeking is fine.
Take out and taste it (it will taste like orange rocket fuel). Learning how it progresses is part of the fun,,
Look at it. If it isn’t completely clear, replace the bubbler and put it back in the dark cupboard. Ensure the bubbler is half full.
Wait a month and repeat
And agin
And again
about 4 months after starting you will notice a really nice flavour change.
If it is completely clear, pour off the good stuff and discard the fruit and glunk at the bottom of the jug. Put it into another sterile jug and wait until the 4 month mark (or 6 month mark, tasting every month) (time is very flexible)
When it is smooth and tasty, let your friends try it.
When THEY think it is tasty it is time to bottle. But it is also probably gone by now, so try another batch
 
I agree. Save your carboy for later.
I have been making mead and beer for 10 years and would never make 8 gallons of something. How boaring to have to drink EXCTLY the same thing for a year or two.
Get a jug of water from the grocery store and TRY making mead first. Or start with a 4 litre/pint jug first.
Learn to walk before you commit to running a marathon.
There are some skills you need to master first.
Unless you like having to drink rocket fuel for the next year or two.
JOAM IS easy.
Use ale yeast, orange zest/pulp and throw away the white part of the orange. Use the proportions of water to honey in the recipe and scale up or down as needed.
Put a bubbler half full of vodka on top and put it in a warm dark cupboard for a month. Ignore it. Don’t touch it. Peeking is fine.
Take out and taste it (it will taste like orange rocket fuel). Learning how it progresses is part of the fun,,
Look at it. If it isn’t completely clear, replace the bubbler and put it back in the dark cupboard. Ensure the bubbler is half full.
Wait a month and repeat
And agin
And again
about 4 months after starting you will notice a really nice flavour change.
If it is completely clear, pour off the good stuff and discard the fruit and glunk at the bottom of the jug. Put it into another sterile jug and wait until the 4 month mark (or 6 month mark, tasting every month) (time is very flexible)
When it is smooth and tasty, let your friends try it.
When THEY think it is tasty it is time to bottle. But it is also probably gone by now, so try another batch
Thank you very much for the detailed explanation!
I will definitely give it a try, I'll buy a 1 gallon one and stick to the original recipe with the changes you mentioned.
 
I’m working on my second batch now this time instead of 1 gallon I am doing 5 gallons. It was very drinkable after eight months the first time but only got better with age. Followed the recipe to the tee the first time but added a couple of grapefruit with the navel oranges on the second batch. Cheers to you all!
 
Ancient Orange Mead (by Joe Mattioli)
1 gallon batch

3 1/2 lbs Clover or your choice honey or blend (will finish sweet)
1 Large orange (later cut in eights or smaller rind and all)
1 small handful of raisins (25 if you count but more or less ok)
1 stick of cinnamon
1 whole clove ( or 2 if you like - these are potent critters)
optional (a pinch of nutmeg and allspice )( very small )
1 teaspoon of Fleishmanns bread yeast ( now don't get holy on me--- after all this is an ancient mead and that's all we had back then)
Balance water to one gallon

Process:
Use a clean 1 gallon carboy
Dissolve honey in some warm water and put in carboy
Wash orange well to remove any pesticides and slice in eights --add orange (you can push em through opening big boy -- rinds included -- its ok for this mead -- take my word for it -- ignore the experts)

Put in raisins, clove, cinnamon stick, any optional ingredients and fill to 3 inches from the top with cold water. ( need room for some foam -- you can top off with more water after the first few day frenzy)

Shake the heck out of the jug with top on, of course. This is your sophisticated aeration process.

When at room temperature in your kitchen, put in 1 teaspoon of bread yeast. ( No you don't have to rehydrate it first-- the ancients didn't even have that word in their vocabulary-- just put it in and give it a gentle swirl or not)(The yeast can fight for their own territory)

Install water airlock. Put in dark place. It will start working immediately or in an hour. (Don't use grandma's bread yeast she bought years before she passed away in the 90's)( Wait 3 hours before you panic or call me) After major foaming stops in a few days add some water and then keep your hands off of it. (Don't shake it! Don't mess with them yeastees! Let them alone except its okay to open your cabinet to smell every once in a while.

Racking --- Don't you dare
additional feeding --- NO NO
More stirring or shaking -- Your not listening, don't touch

After 2 months and maybe a few days it will slow down to a stop and clear all by itself. (How about that) (You are not so important after all) Then you can put a hose in with a small cloth filter on the end into the clear part and siphon off the golden nectar. If you wait long enough even the oranges will sink to the bottom but I never waited that long. If it is clear it is ready. You don't need a cold basement. It does better in a kitchen in the dark. (Like in a cabinet) likes a little heat (70-80). If it didn't work out... you screwed up and didn't read my instructions (or used grandma's bread yeast she bought years before she passed away) . If it didn't work out then take up another hobby. Mead is not for you. It is too complicated.
If you were successful, which I am 99% certain you will be, then enjoy your mead. When you get ready to make different mead you will probably have to unlearn some of these practices I have taught you, but hey--- This recipe and procedure works with these ingredients so don't knock it. It was your first mead. It was my tenth. Sometimes, even the experts can forget all they know and make good ancient mead.
How much was the average alcohol content?
 
Hey, what type of gallon, US or Imperial?
Welcome to our forums!

You're replying to a post from 2007. The member you're asking, @JustDave, hasn't logged in since 2008. Now his location is "Massachusetts" so you can reckon it being US gallons. ;)
All that information is available in the (left) side-bar and by hovering over a member's avatar/name.

Similarly, the OP's recipe is also for 1 US gallon:
Ancient Orange Mead (by Joe Mattioli)
1 gallon batch
 
Okay, I have a question. I've never made mead. I've never even tasted mead. I just stumbled across this and thought it would be a fun diversion while I was off for the Christmas holidays. The one thing I wonder about is that in the OP, it says:
"After major foaming stops in a few days add some water and then keep your hands off of it."
As a beer brewer I'm loath to open my fermentation vessel in the middle of fermentation so:
1) why do I need to add water?
2) how much water am i supposed to add (I assume top off the carboy)?
3) is oxidization not a problem with mead?
 
Okay, I have a question. I've never made mead. I've never even tasted mead. I just stumbled across this and thought it would be a fun diversion while I was off for the Christmas holidays. The one thing I wonder about is that in the OP, it says:

As a beer brewer I'm loath to open my fermentation vessel in the middle of fermentation so:
1) why do I need to add water?
2) how much water am i supposed to add (I assume top off the carboy)?
3) is oxidization not a problem with mead?
1) to eliminate the head space
2) as much as needed to eliminate the headspace
3) it is, but it is still fermenting so every introduced oxygen is scrubbed by the yeast.
 
1) to eliminate the head space
2) as much as needed to eliminate the headspace
3) it is, but it is still fermenting so every introduced oxygen is scrubbed by the yeast.
I would add,
Mead (when compared to beer and wine) is much more resistant to oxidation. I have left half filled meads on the counter for a month or two without signs of oxidation.
When allowing a wine/mead to settle out over an extended period of time, replace headspace with liquid is net gain.
 
I would add,
Mead (when compared to beer and wine) is much more resistant to oxidation. I have left half filled meads on the counter for a month or two without signs of oxidation.
When allowing a wine/mead to settle out over an extended period of time, replace headspace with liquid is net gain.
I have lost mead through oxidation, so better just don't leave it in half filled bottles. However, it takes more time than with beer to be detectable.
 
Mead doesn’t foam up like beer does
And top up with juice instead of water. Why dilute your mead?
Do a modified JOAM and let it age at least 3 months after bottling. If it tastes like rocket fuel, let it age another month and taste again. Repeat until tasty or gone.
Modified JOAM : use ale yeast instead of bread yeast, and use the zest and juice and pulp of the orange, but not the white pith. Shortens aging.
 
I have never had a mead foam up like mentioned earlier. But I also don't boil meads at all for any reason although I understand some people do boil it for a few minutes and that apparently is when it foams up. It is absolutely not necessary to boil mead. You only need to warm the water enough to dissolve the honey well and maybe to pasteurize it. I don't pasteurize mine either. Note I have never had one go bad from oxidation either. Neither do I bottle it. I keg everything, I protect it from excessive oxygen, however once it gets below a gallon I don't fret about it and will carefully transfer it to a smaller bottle until it is gone. Meads have a life of their own, they can take on a taste that is not pleasing but put it away and leave it alone a few months and it will change again. At the moment I have Blackberry and Raspberry Melomels that I made January 20, 2020. I have less than a half gallon of each left. They started out undrinkable, way too tart and alcoholic. As they age the get better, then worse then good again. Both are delicious at the moment but I don't expect them to be around much longer.
 
So I'm a complete mead newbie and decided to make a batch of JAOM on a whim over the Christmas holidays. Well, almost JAOM - I happened to have some blackberries on hand, and no raisins, so I threw in about 6 blackberries. Anyway, in my excitement, I forgot to take an OG reading, but after just over 2 months, when everything had settled down I bottled it, and took a gravity reading anyway. It ended up at .994. Is that a normal FG? Can I get an estimate of ABV with just that reading? Thanks.
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It looks good. You would need to know the original gravity to calculate the abv. However you can come up with a good estimate going by the quantity on honey to water and type of yeast used.
 
It looks good. You would need to know the original gravity to calculate the abv. However you can come up with a good estimate going by the quantity on honey to water and type of yeast used.
Thanks. Yeah, that's what I was thinking - I followed the recipe quantities pretty closely, right down to using the Fleischmann's bread yeast, so I figure it should have a similar OG to anyone else's who did the same. The recipe didn't mention an expected OG though.🤷‍♂️
 
If you know the ingredients and you know the starting volume, then it is easy to estimate your starting gravity. Here's the rule of thumb: one pound of honey dissolved in water to make 1 US gallon of must will increase the gravity of the water by 35 points - and so give you reading of 1.035. Two pounds to make that same volume will double that to 1.070 etc etc. A handful of fruit will add no significant amount of sugar or liquid.

Never tried to make JOAM so I honestly have no good idea of what the other ingredients are, except for an orange which is there perhaps to increase the bitterness (the pith) and the acidity if the JOAM finishes sweet. Yours is brut dry at .994.

You may want to taste it and see if you want to back sweeten, but to do that you may need to stabilize the mead to prevent the yeast from refermenting any sugars you add. I have the feeling that the original JOAM recipe assumed that it would finish with unfermented sugars.
 
That's very dry for a JOAM. I've never had one go dry before and it usually remains rather sweet. I'd rack it and taste and and determine what you want to do next (either leave it if you like the taste or stabilize and backsweeten to your liking.
 
If you know the ingredients and you know the starting volume, then it is easy to estimate your starting gravity. Here's the rule of thumb: one pound of honey dissolved in water to make 1 US gallon of must will increase the gravity of the water by 35 points - and so give you reading of 1.035. Two pounds to make that same volume will double that to 1.070 etc etc. A handful of fruit will add no significant amount of sugar or liquid.

Never tried to make JOAM so I honestly have no good idea of what the other ingredients are, except for an orange which is there perhaps to increase the bitterness (the pith) and the acidity if the JOAM finishes sweet. Yours is brut dry at .994.

You may want to taste it and see if you want to back sweeten, but to do that you may need to stabilize the mead to prevent the yeast from refermenting any sugars you add. I have the feeling that the original JOAM recipe assumed that it would finish with unfermented sugars.
Thanks! Really helpful - I appreciate it. Based on those estimates my OG was somewhere around 1.105, leaving me with an ABV of 14.5%. It actually tastes pretty good - much better than I expected. I bottled it and will let it sit for 3 months or so and see how it is then.
 
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