Strong (off?) flavor from US-05?

I'm having a hard time figuring out where a strong flavor that has occurred in two very different beers is coming from.

I'm not even sure it's an "off" flavor to be perfectly honest. I can't seem to match it with any of the off flavor charts I've looked at. It's hard to explain exactly what it tastes like. It sort of reminds me of the way my bucket smells after I rack a beer off of it...that residual hop aroma you sometimes get.

I'm hesitant to say there a very slight plastic/rubber taste that comes along with it. "Hesitant" because it's not quite right, but It's as close as I can explain.

I've tried to identify the source of this flavor, and therein lies the problem.

First of all, one was an American Wheat, and the second was a Cream Ale. They had NO INGREDIENTS in common except that they both used US-05 Yeast.

The American Wheat was all DME. The Cream ale was a partial mash.

They both used the same water source, but it is well water which has no chlorine, and I've used this same water with every other beer I've made thus far with no problems whatsoever.

The fermenting buckets used were different for each beer.

The smell/flavor appeared BEFORE racking into bottles (I tasted in the hydro readings), so it wasn't anything from those pieces of equipment.

You can see why I'm having trouble deciding what might be causing this. Today, when my brother also noted that the cream ale tasted like the American Wheat, he suggested perhaps it was from the yeast, but the flavor is so predominant, I didn't think it was the case.

The American wheat admittedly could have had better temp control
(never higher then 68 degrees though), but the cream ale was perfect temp control. A steady 63 degrees the whole time.

So that's why I'm posting. Could it actually be the yeast? Did I miss anything else, any ideas?

I'm planning on sending a couple bottles out to other brewers to see what they say, but for now, I thought I'd ask HBT!

EDIT: Also, I'm planning on making a tasting video of the cream ale tomorrow, and I'll try to better explain what it tastes like in that. I'll post it here tomorrow.

Plastic/rubber is a common description of chlorophenols coming from chlorine in the water. If you are sure there is no chlorine then it is possibly from infection. How long have they been in bottle? Maybe they are just green?

Tracking down off flavors is maddening but will eventually make you a better brewer

Genjin said:

Tracking down off flavors is maddening but will eventually make you a better brewer

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Oh man, that couldn't be more true!

Onipar, the beers in question are both light beers, so they're more likely to show off flavors. Have you had other light(er) beers using the same water and yeast that didn't show this 'off' flavor? Is it a yeast-y bite/young beer thing? And there's a method to the madness of this next question(s); would you describe the flavor as something in the finish? Maybe a bit dry and tart, washing the palate of the otherwise good beer? I'm leaning towards water, but let's eliminate other possibilities.

The first beer I made was a Belgian white. We used the same water and a different yeast, and it definitely did not taste like these two beers.

The last beer we made was a Honey Kolsch. That beer I brewed at my brother's house. Different water source, but the same yeast (Us-05), and though it's still too early to tell for sure (it's in secondary), I think I detected a similar flavor coming through.

So, I'm feeling like it can't be the water. I *know* there's no chlorine in it because it's well water. Comes right from the ground.

The American wheat was brewed months ago. The Cream Ale is three weeks in the bottle. So that one is a bit green maybe.

I'm not a very big beer drinker, and I've only been brewing a year, which is why I'm not entirely sure if it is even an off flavor (and why i want to send some bottles for others to taste).

The flavor is up front, not the finish. Not tart at all. It has a bit of sweetness to it
(the cream ale), which I think is part of the style. There is a bit of yeast bite now that you mention it...

Thanks for the help, I'm really hoping I can figure this out. It IS maddening!

onipar said:

The first beer I made was a Belgian white. We used the same water and a different yeast, and it definitely did not taste like these two beers.

The last beer we made was a Honey Kolsch. That beer I brewed at my brother's house. Different water source, but the same yeast (Us-05), and though it's still too early to tell for sure (it's in secondary), I think I detected a similar flavor coming through.

So, I'm feeling like it can't be the water. I *know* there's no chlorine in it because it's well water. Comes right from the ground.

The American wheat was brewed months ago. The Cream Ale is three weeks in the bottle. So that one is a bit green maybe.

I'm not a very big beer drinker, and I've only been brewing a year, which is why I'm not entirely sure if it is even an off flavor (and why i want to send some bottles for others to taste).

The flavor is up front, not the finish. Not tart at all. It has a bit of sweetness to it
(the cream ale), which I think is part of the style. There is a bit of yeast bite now that you mention it...

Thanks for the help, I'm really hoping I can figure this out. It IS maddening!

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Hmmm.... trouble shooting off flavors IS maddening. But, necessary.... so different water, same yeast, and you think the flavors crossing that boundary and likely from the yeast. Let's put the cream ale aside til it ages a bit more, the yeast bite can cover things. The other one has a sorta sweet sorta plastic/bandaid thing going on, right? That screams chlorophenols, but you've gotten it with two differing water sources. One which should have no chlorine/chloromine, right?
I'm looking past the yeast at the moment, although the yeast could be at fault or at least making the flavor more pronounced. But, could this be the cool temp ester people talk about from 05? Is it a faint peach/apricot sweetness? Doesn't sound like it, but I had to ask.
This is what I'd do if it were me; I'd brew a batch using bottled spring water, make a light low hop brew that will let off flavors show, split it and use 05 in half, and another clean, well attenuating strain in the other half (or even a liquid version of chico). Ferment them as similar as you can, and try to keep them cool (below 65). That'll put the suspects (water and yeast) out on front street. If it shows up in the 05 batch only, yeast. If both halves are good, water. If it comes through in both, it's something else. I know that isn't much help at the moment, but that's why this is so frustrating, it takes time and more brewing to get it straightened out.

NordeastBrewer77,

That's an *excellent* idea, and it's exactly what I'm going to do. My next batch will actually be my very first all grain brew too, so it should be interesting to split the batch and have this experiment on top of that.

Unfortunately, my last brew day was yesterday, and it was a nut brown with a different yeast, so that won't be any help!

The sweet flavor I mentioned is only in the cream ale (not the American wheat), and from what I've read in reviews of this beer kit (Speckled Heifer from Northern Brewer), it is supposed to be a little sweet.

Honestly, even after everything I've said, I tend to lean towards the water source as well.

There is definitely no Chlorine in either source (they are both well water sources on our properties, we live in rural Pennsylvania). HOWEVER, something I only just now remembered: I have hard water.

Now, from what I've read in some books and things, this isn't necessarily a problem, but is there anything in hard water that might cause this flavor? I never had an extensive analysis of the water (costs too much), but I think there is calcium and magnesium.

I'm going to do a tasting video today of that Speckled Heifer, and post here later. Hopefully that will help a bit too.

But otherwise, yes, in two weeks I'll do that experiment!

onipar said:

HOWEVER, something I only just now remembered: I have hard water.

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That's what I was wondering too. Wells can have a lot of minerals in them, which can affect the brew. Really hard water isn't always the best for lighter beers. If you're gonna be doing the AG thing, keep that in mind, you wanna be able to get the pH of the mash right. My tap water's generally pretty decent, if you boil off the chloromines it makes pretty decent beer. It is hard water, so for lighter beers, or at this time of year when there's a lot of runoff from rain, I use spring water (especially for the mash). I use a brand called Glenwood Springs, it's from central MN getting up towards the headwaters of the Mississippi, great clean water up there. Doubt you can find it out in your neck of the woods, but there's probably a local or regional spring water company in an area known for clean water, or great fishing lakes, etc... I've found over time that spring water always makes for a good brew, and it's not too expensive if you buy the 2.5 gal refrigerator jugs, maybe $4-5 per batch.

Yeah, being a budget brewer, I always tried to keep costs down, and paying for water seemed like an easy one. But I guess if hard water is causing the flavor I'm tasting, well, I don't have much of a choice.

I suppose I'll know for sure once I do that experiment you mentioned. I would have gotten a water analysis a long time ago, but it costs like $100 (no free testing for me since it isn't "city water."

I always thought a certain amount of minerals was a good thing in the water, but I guess when you don't know *what* is in it, or in what quantities, there's just no telling.

This is not a water problem. I also brew with well water and I have made many excellent beers. I have also made a few beers with the burnt rubber/plastic off flavor. I have noticed this mostly when I first started brewing before I was making starters or if my starter was too small or took a long time to get going. I am quite sure it is due to the health of the yeast. Do you make starters? Use a stir plate if you can. Otherwise, shake the starter often. If you are using dry yeast, don't make a starter, but rehydrate the yeast properly and make sure you use the propper amount or a little more. Mrmalty.com has a lot of good info in this area. Also, how are you aerating the wort? make sure you eiter shake very well for several minutes or add plenty of pure O2. I do 2 min with pure 02 and an airstone now. I have not used an airpump so I cannot comment on that. I think improving the yeast health, cell count and oxygen will make a big difference. If this helps please post results.

You can get your water tested at wardlab.com. I highly recommend it especially for well water. It is not expensive.

Also, I don't think hard water would cause burnt rubber/plastic flavor. It may give an astringent flavor. You should get the test though. I did and it is an easy way to eliminate potential causes of issues.

Thanks cosmo!

In fact, this was my original thought (unhealthy yeast) and I'll tell you why. The American Wheat beer was the first time I tasted this flavor. The yeast I used for it was the "yeast cake" from a previous batch, and I pitched the American wheat right on top.

So of course that was my initial idea, that the yeast wasn't healthy, or that I over pitched, or something like that.

However, this latest beer (the cream ale) used a brand new packet of dry yeast US-05. I didn't make a starter with it, but I usually don't with dry yeast. I don't usually rehydrate it either. I just sprinkle it on top of the wort, let it sit for a few minutes, then stir it in. I use the entire packet for a 5 gallon batch.

cosmo said:

This is not a water problem. I also brew with well water and I have made many excellent beers.

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First off, I'd venture to guess that the well water in FL is vastly different from the well water in PA. The first thing I thought when the OP said well water was in that area of the country there's lots of limestone, which means calcium, which means hard water. I'd be willing to bet that the wells in FL produce a much softer, more tannic water than what you'd find a thousand miles to the north. None of the flavors the OP is talking about come solely from yeast, especially from 05 which is one of the cleaner strains out there. The flavors sound like that which you'd get in a light beer mashed at an improper pH, or from hard minerals in the boil. My guess is it's coming from calcium or sulphates, and a light beer brewed with a clean yeast is causing the flavor to be more noticeable.
Obviously, you'd have to consider yeast health, but I think with the beers in question it'd be quite hard to under pitch using s-05, seeing as 1 packet was surely enough. edit: Or considering that the OP pitched one of these beers onto an entire cake.

Well, even though I've never had a proper analysis, I did have a free water analysis done at Home Depot once, and the water Definitely has A LOT of calcium. We have very hard water.

So yeah, I'm starting to lean in that direction as well.

onipar said:

Well, even though I've never had a proper analysis, I did have a free water analysis done at Home Depot once, and the water Definitely has A LOT of calcium. We have very hard water.

So yeah, I'm starting to lean in that direction as well.

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Water reports are really helpful, the sucks that you have to pay for one in your area. You could always use a basic aquarium test, you can get tests for carbonate and general hardness. It's no exact science, but if your carbonate hardness is through the roof, you know that your water is hard to adjust, meaning that the grains in the mash may not be enough to lower the pH to the proper range (under 6, 5.2 is ideal). Water high in carbonates is much harder to influence. In the aquarium hobby, if you want stable water, say in a hard water cichlid tank, you'd start with high carbonate water because it's more stable and will hold it's pH much better and longer. Trying to adjust pH or general hardness of water high in carbonates is like trying to take a steak from an angry dog. You can do it, but you might be better off just getting a different steak.

I did a tasting video to try and help describe the flavor a bit better. There's no need to watch the whole thing. Basically I found that the flavor has definitely changed. That slight plastic thing still is there, but this bottle also had a very slight tart and dry finish. That was not in the other bottles I tried though. But it could be it's still developing.

Love the shirt, man!! :rockin:

That tart-ish flavor you describe sounds like it could be 05. Was that the one that fermented at 63? us-05 can get this tart, apricot like thing going on if it's fermented cool. I love it, but some people don't like it at all. And it still doesn't explain the one fermented at 68, cuz I've never heard of that ester coming out at temps over ~66ish.
I'm totally down for doing a trade, maybe I can help decipher the flavor and hell, just feedback from other brewers is always helpful. Drop me a PM if you want, we can talk about it.
Sounds like the beer you sampled in the vid may still be developing... but it also seems like you're really trying to pinpoint the flavor, which tells me it's not a common one. Without tasting, it's so hard to say.
As for the light beer being the reason.... ok, say with really hard water in the mash, grains lower the pH of the mash water, darker grains moreso that lighter grains (it's why dark beers traditionally come from regions with hard water. They needed the dark malt to lower the pH of the mash in order to make good beer.) Conversely, light beers can be sharpened or enhanced with water that had higher mineral content (thus, the 'Burtonizing' of water for English IPA). If your water's hard enough, the lighter grain bills may not lower the mash enough, causing the phenolic flavor you may be getting. Hope that explains it some.

NE,
You are right about the importance of making sure their is no issue with the water. I am sure that we have very different water. Mine has Total Alkalinity of 57 ppm (Ward Labs). An aquarium test is a good start. Even better to get a comprehensive set of tests from a lab for less than the cost of a batch of ingredients. I was just posting my experience, which sounds to me like the same off flavor that the OP described. And for me the 3 or 4 times this happend out of well over a hundred batches, it was definately due to the yeast. My notes indicate either under pitch or a yeast pack that was slow to start. I have never had this problem with a propper yeast starter. Even dry yeast can be stressed by handling (high temp, old yeast). I can't guarentee this is the same issue that the OP has but I think it is a good thing to consider. I am, however, interrested in your theory on hardness causing burnt rubber or plastic off flavor. Do you have a reference for that? Have you experienced this off flavor? Anyhow, I think we both agree that good water quality and a healthy yeast pitch are both important.

I've got two different beers, both US-05 repitches, both in swamp cooler in the low 60's (61-62 between the bucket and the shirt). One is a cream ale, the other is an ESB. Totally different styles, flavors, etc. Both brewed within 24 hours of one another.

I'll report on anything I notice if there is anything of note in terms of off flavors. I once had banana from a blonde ale fermented with US-05 but I wonder if the temp rose in my basement on a few hot days during ferm. I'm not anal about notes and such but I try to monitor temps from time to time...weekends can be hard if we're out doing things.

All in all my chico repitches have been great, clean, no off flavors. The only banana I get nowadays is wits that I ferment with wl400 in the mid 80's.

cosmo said:

I am, however, interrested in your theory on hardness causing burnt rubber or plastic off flavor. Do you have a reference for that? Have you experienced this off flavor? Anyhow, I think we both agree that good water quality and a healthy yeast pitch are both important.

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Chlorophenols can have a plastic-y type taste. And yeah, I've had that before, before I learned I needed to boil tap water before brewing with it and not just during. As far as a high concentration of minerals, namely carbonates, causing a similar flavor, I'm not sure if I would call it a plastic-y flavor, but it can definitely affect a beer. Mash pH is pretty important, at least as far as making sure the pH isn't too high, which is what I think might be the issue. The OP says this hasn't happened in darker beers, where dark grains would likely lower the pH to proper levels. But a similar flavor has shown up in light beers, where just the lighter grains may not lower the water's pH below 6. It's troubleshooting, and really hard to pinpoint a flavor based on description (although, the OP does a really good job explaining it in the YouTube vid). Based on that vid, mainly what the OP said about the flavors still developing, also brings up other possibilities. I'm still leaning towards water, because only the yeast and water were the same in the batches in question (and because my experience with us-05 says that maybe the cooler fermented beer could have a tart flavor, but not the warmer one), but there definitely are other possibilities.

tre9er said:

I

All in all my chico repitches have been great, clean, no off flavors.

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That's my experience too. It gets a bit fruit-y, a tart-ish apricot thing at lower temps, but still clean. I've heard banana/bubblegum from really warm temps, but never tried for that myself. From what I've seen with re-pitching 05 especially, but the liquid chico too, is that it gets a bit better on the second and third gen.

NordeastBrewer77 said:

From what I've seen with re-pitching 05 especially, but the liquid chico too, is that it gets a bit better on the second and third gen.

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All of my chico is on 3rd or 4th gen right now. Probably not harvesting after this. I've made like 10 beers from one package...I think I can spring for a $4 pack.

tre9er, thanks! I'm looking forward to what you find.

cosmo, now that I think about it, the pack of yeast I used for the cream ale was probably close to 6 months old. I did have it in the freezer the whole time, so I don't know if that's considered "old" or not.

NordeastBrewer77, thanks! I'm a horror writer (I think I've told you this before), and I really dig Fright Rags t-shirts. The one in the video is "cereal" killers: Loco Puffs.

That slight tart flavor mentioned in the video: I liked it. That's what threw me off for a second, because I was enjoying the beer more than before, and that new tartness seemed to mask that other flavor I had been tasting.

This is the one with US-05 at 63 degrees, so maybe that was from the yeast, as you said.

The cream ale was only a partial mash, and the American wheat was all extract, which makes me question the effect hard water really would have had then.

I'll PM you about a trade. Thanks again everyone for all the comments! I think we've got it at least narrowed to the yeast or water.

Don't think it was mentioned before, but what temp was the wort when you pitched? If the one yeast was in freezer, did it sit out for a while first? On repitches do you warm them up to pitch temp long before pitching? I think the banana flavors I had with chico might have also been due to pitching at 75

tre9er said:

Don't think it was mentioned before, but what temp was the wort when you pitched? If the one yeast was in freezer, did it sit out for a while first? On repitches do you warm them up to pitch temp long before pitching? I think the banana flavors I had with chico might have also been due to pitching at 75

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In my beer log it says I pitched the cream ale at 64 degrees. And I always take the yeast out of the freezer and let it sit out for pretty much the whole time I'm brewing. The American Wheat was pitched at 60 degrees, but that was onto a yeast cake that might have been a bit warmer, since it was sitting out.

onipar said:

In my beer log it says I pitched the cream ale at 64 degrees. And I always take the yeast out of the freezer and let it sit out for pretty much the whole time I'm brewing. The American Wheat was pitched at 60 degrees, but that was onto a yeast cake that might have been a bit warmer, since it was sitting out.

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Well since the two were different scenarios, hard to say pitching environment was the issue. Maybe the dry yeast was stressed by underpitching/being old and less viable and the repitch cake got warm waiting for beer and got stressed...

tre9er said:

Well since the two were different scenarios, hard to say pitching environment was the issue. Maybe the dry yeast was stressed by underpitching/being old and less viable and the repitch cake got warm waiting for beer and got stressed...

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Could be. I will say that the rubber/plastic was more prominent in the American wheat, and as this cream ale is aging, it seems to be dissipating somewhat. In fact, i wouldn't be surprised if the people I send the beer to don't taste it at all.

onipar said:

That slight tart flavor mentioned in the video: I liked it. That's what threw me off for a second, because I was enjoying the beer more than before, and that new tartness seemed to mask that other flavor I had been tasting.

This is the one with US-05 at 63 degrees, so maybe that was from the yeast, as you said.

The cream ale was only a partial mash, and the American wheat was all extract, which makes me question the effect hard water really would have had then.

I'll PM you about a trade. Thanks again everyone for all the comments! I think we've got it at least narrowed to the yeast or water.

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I noticed your first sip, you had this, 'huh, that's not how it tasted before' look.

Hmmm, so the all extract beer shouldn't be affected by hard water I wouldn't think. I've always heard pH isn't nearly as important for extract beer. I never pay attention to that stuff when I do all extract recipes. Hope we're right there! As for the PM recipe, I'm sure how much of an effect hardness would have is dependent on mash size, but I'd think it'd play at least some role. Now I'm really intrigued though. I was thinking these were both PM batches, just from talking with you before, my bad. I'm gonna go drink some beer and see what kind of effect, if any, water high in carbonates has on extract beer. I'm still not thinking it's yeast, but I'm wondering if it's the water since one of these is extract. I'll post back what I find....

I'm drinking beer right now too. I find that it makes me happy and a bit giddy

tre9er said:

I'm drinking beer right now too. I find that it makes me happy and a bit giddy

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Ha!!! Funny, I that's exactly what I'm discovering.

And, I also found this thread discussing how hard water can actually influence extract beer. It got me thinking back to when I first started out, I and a couple friends noticed a minerally taste in a couple of my beers, extract w/steeping grain batches. One friend commented on how two of them tasted the same, even though they were different styles. Back then I knew very little about 'off' flavors and since this issue didn't continue, I figured it was part of the learning process. But I did start playing around with water early on because I was convinced that tap water caused off flavors in another early batch. It was at that point that I started boiling my tap water before using, and using spring water or a 50/50 tap/RO mix for lighter beers. My tap water here is Mississippi River water, very high in carbonates, sulphate, and quite alkaline 7.8-8 pH.
Who'd've thunk it..... water may be important in extract beers. I know after reading that thread, I'm going to pay a little closer att'n to the water I use in extract batches. I'm gonna keep reading and drinkin' beer... I'll post back if I find anything else that catches me eye.

I also found that my kegs are getting empty-erer. Good thing I have three beers fermenting. Think I will brew again tomorrow, just to be on the safe side.

Apparently our water in Lincoln is actually pretty good for brewing. Just a tad hard (but not too alkaline). In fact, a friend adds gypsum when making ESBs for extra hardness.

HA! Well I'm glad this thread had a nice outcome (everyone is drinking!)

Oh yeah, that first sip, I absolutely was like, "what just a second..." And you know, be prepared for the possibility that this is just the way the beer is supposed to taste! Ya never know.

I keep coming back to that experiment idea and thinking that, plus a water test, plus these beer trades, should be more than enough to shed some light on the matter.

Question for whoever sent water samples into that site mentioned earlier: did you have to pack it in an ice-filled cooler? The instructions seem to say that you have to ship it in a chilled environment...

Well, I didn't come across anything else that was worthwhile about hard water and it's effects on extract. But what I gathered from the thread I linked above is that I am definitely going to pay more attention to water quality in my extract batches.
I did, however, find couple big IPA's (Torpedo and my Simcoe IPA), a Saison Dupont and several BoPils (Staropramen and Summit, had to side by side a few) makes for a very happy, giddy evening.
Really though, I've been thinking about that thread I linked more and a few things came to mind. First and foremost, I do remember early on in my brewing that I tasted something 'off' in a few beers and began using different types of water to correct this. It's been since my first handful of batches that I started at least cutting my tap water with R/O or using all spring water. I wish I kept better notes back then, because the off flavor is just a memory now. My wife remembers me telling her I could 'taste our tap water' in an IPA and a pale ale. If that's what I said, mineral-y would be the most likely description, our tap water is very hard and tastes like minerals. Again, my notes from then are pi$$ poor, so that's a guess.

onipar said:

I keep coming back to that experiment idea and thinking that, plus a water test, plus these beer trades, should be more than enough to shed some light on the matter.

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You would surely think so. I'm still leaning towards water being the or one of the culprits here. We'll see.

Someone on my youtube channel also suggested doing two of the same beers (small test batches) one with tap and one with spring water.

The first beer I made (Beligian White) was also the only other light beer I made until the American wheat and this cream ale. I thought it came out poor, but it definitely didn't have the "same" flavor. And all my darker beers I really liked (including the pumpkin ale and graff), but that could have been masking whatever this is.

Or, as you mentioned, it could be the well water changes depending on the season. That Belgian I mentioned was brewed in April of 2011 though, which would have been right around the thaw as well...

onipar said:

Someone on my youtube channel also suggested doing two of the same beers (small test batches) one with tap and one with spring water.

The first beer I made (Beligian White) was also the only other light beer I made until the American wheat and this cream ale. I thought it came out poor, but it definitely didn't have the "same" flavor. And all my darker beers I really liked (including the pumpkin ale and graff), but that could have been masking whatever this is.

Or, as you mentioned, it could be the well water changes depending on the season. That Belgian I mentioned was brewed in April of 2011 though, which would have been right around the thaw as well...

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Splitting batches with different water is a great idea too. As far as the darker beers, not only could they mask the flavor, but the darker malts may have actually affected the water in a way that benefited the beer. Especially if they were PM batches, enough dark malt in the grist and it would surely lower the pH.
My idea of fluctuations in water quality with the change in seasons was just a guess. I know I don't even drink my tap water in the spring because it's so discolored and cloudy from runoff and turbidity. I certainly don't brew with it. I was thinking if your well goes through half the changes that our river water does, it may be enough to affect your beer. Especially if you're in an agricultural area, there's all sorts of things that could get in there.
I know you mentioned the dreaded 'I' word in your YouTube vid, but is there anything that makes you think that other than the fact that this beer's still developing? I'm not seeing any reason to think that that's the case at all, but I figure you know best at this point.

NordeastBrewer77 said:

My tap water's generally pretty decent, if you boil off the chloromines it makes pretty decent beer.

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You must have to boil for a while. I think I read that AJ tested how long it took, and I remember it being over an hour (I could be wrong on the exact number though.).

afr0byte said:

You must have to boil for a while. I think I read that AJ tested how long it took, and I remember it being over an hour (I could be wrong on the exact number though.).

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Ok, Ill bite.....

Bout ten-twenty mins of a hard boil will drive of chlorine and chloromine, IME. Ask me how I know.


FWIW, I strongly feel that experience is a far better gauge of what happens in reality that saying I think I read something where I think some guy did something, I don't really remember, but I think....

NordeastBrewer77 said:

Ok, Ill bite.....

Bout ten-twenty mins of a hard boil will drive of chlorine and chloromine, IME. Ask me how I know.


FWIW, I strongly feel that experience is a far better gauge of what happens in reality that saying I think I read something where I think some guy did something, I don't really remember, but I think....

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Perhaps you don't have much. As a general rule, campden tablets are easier and cheaper. Plus, you (not you specifically) don't have to worry about boiling long enough to get all of the chloramine out.

NordeastBrewer77 said:

Ok, Ill bite.....

Bout ten-twenty mins of a hard boil will drive of chlorine and chloromine, IME. Ask me how I know.

FWIW, I strongly feel that experience is a far better gauge of what happens in reality that saying I think I read something where I think some guy did something, I don't really remember, but I think....

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This. I have friends who are afraid of certain things in brewing (corona mills, hot side aeration, cold crashing) because they've heard or so and so says...I am the one who makes recipes up as I go, tries things based on reading success of others, etc. My one neighbor has been brewing for 15 years and I think he believes his methods are the best way, only way. He gets good results so you can't argue but he turns his nose up at my ways sometimes.

tre9er said:

This. I have friends who are afraid of certain things in brewing (corona mills, hot side aeration, cold crashing) because they've heard or so and so says...I am the one who makes recipes up as I go, tries things based on reading success of others, etc. My one neighbor has been brewing for 15 years and I think he believes his methods are the best way, only way. He gets good results so you can't argue but he turns his nose up at my ways sometimes.

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It's true that chloramine doesn't as readily boil off as chlorine. You can look it up. Also, campden tablets are cheap. You can also look that up.

Get back on topic and keep it civil, please. We wouldn't want to have to put anybody in a timeout.

No worries everybody; I'm just glad for all the help.

NordeastBrewer77, you asked earlier about my mention of infection. I don't really think there was any infection. I think I was just caught off guard by the sudden presence of that tart flavor, and I had no other way to explain where it came from.

Bu then you mentioned it could be from the US-05 fermenting around 63, and I feel that's much more likely, especially since it is a "pleasant tart," not overpowering at all, and something you might not even notice when you taste it. Who knows, by time this beer makes it to you, you might not detect any off flavors.

See, that's the underlying issue beyond possible water/yeast/off flavor problems: I'm a new brewer, new to many styles, and simply doubting of my own palette. That's partly why I wanted to get a couple trades together.

As far as the water in my area, my tap water is always clear and never tastes strongly of anything to me. Lately we've been worried to drink it simply because we haven't had it tested in a long time, and we're unsure of how safe it is to drink (well water is supposed to be tested fairly often to ensure it's safe to drink).

That's why I'm definitely planning on getting the water tested. It will help with brewing, but also, I'll know if it's even safe!