Why do pre-hopped kits taste so bad?

When I first tried homebrewing about 12 years ago I started with a couple of those canned pre-hopped kits with the little yeast pack on top. Even to my uneducated palate something tasted wrong with those beers. There was a sharp harsh unpleasant taste that is characteristic of that type of kit. I soon quit homebrewing for 10+ years.

Since I started brewing again, doing things the right way this time, I have never had a beer with those off flavors. But recently I tried some beers that someone else brewed with the canned kits, and the memories came rushing back. Each had that same taste to it, regardless of brand or style.

So, my question is: what makes that distinctive canned kit taste? Is it the lack of freshness in the ingredients? Or perhaps the pre-hopping?

Probably a lot to do with the freshness. There might also be some user error there as well since you have to figure most people using pre-hopped kits are just started out

Casey27 said:

So, my question is: what makes that distinctive canned kit taste? Is it the lack of freshness in the ingredients? Or perhaps the pre-hopping?

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A little of both probably. Also, the instructions on those can are just plain bad. If you use a couple pounds of sugar suggested in the instructions instead of malt to make them, it's even worse.

Those kits are good for new brewers to learn the techniques of sanitation and brewing so they are not worthless. Also, I have drank several canned kits that didn't taste bad at all but they were made by brewers that did not follow the instructions.

I think it's a couple of things. Freshness, sure. Cheap ingredients, of course. There's the fact that the malt is, well, pre-hopped, so you get IBUs but no hop aroma. I haven't looked at a kit in a while, but I remember reading the directions on one and they said it wasn't necessary to boil for an hour. Fundamentally, you've got stale cheap ingredients and over-simplified directions.

I had a friend help me brew yesterday, and he was absolutely amazed at the process. He said two things really surprised him:

(1) The beer actually tasted like real microbrew, not what he thought homebrew tasted like, and
(2) It really wasn't that hard.

I had the same complaint with my mr. beer kit. after the first prehopped pale ale kit that came with it, I made the remainder of my batches in it with DME, steeped crystal malts, and hop pellets. It didn't take me long to move past pre-hopped and not look back. I'm not sure of the reason though why they are so ****y.

Whew, lucky for me I didn't start with pre-hopped kits. LHBS hooked it up right, even though I made many of my first brews with LME (ugh!) But again, like many have said before, once I stopped following the beginner instructions and did even the slightest bit of research on proper procedure, my beers became 1000% better.

Reno_eNVy_446 said:

Whew, lucky for me I didn't start with pre-hopped kits. LHBS hooked it up right, even though I made many of my first brews with LME (ugh!) But again, like many have said before, once I stopped following the beginner instructions and did even the slightest bit of research on proper procedure, my beers became 1000% better.

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whats wrong with LME?

chemman14 said:

whats wrong with LME?

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Liquid Malt Extract

bad67z said:

Liquid Malt Extract

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Not what? what's wrong reno_envy? I am doing partial mashes now, less than half of my grain bill being ultra-light LME. I don't see a problem with it. my beers are amazing

chemman14 said:

whats wrong with LME?

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Absolutely nothing is wrong with LME. It is best to buy it fresh and not in cans.

There are a lot of people that have used bad LME and blame it on the LME instead of freshness or LME in a metal can.

You can make excellent beers using malt extract. Just don't let anyone ask you if the beer you are offering them is extract or all-grain before they taste it.

Forrest

Austinhomebrew said:

Absolutely nothing is wrong with LME. It is best to buy it fresh and not in cans.

There are a lot of people that have used bad LME and blame it on the LME instead of freshness or LME in a metal can.

You can make excellent beers using malt extract. Just don't let anyone ask you if the beer you are offering them is extract or all-grain before they taste it.

Forrest

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I agree, the 2 beers that have finished that I made out of extract are awesome

bhatchable said:

Not what? what's wrong reno_envy? I am doing partial mashes now, less than half of my grain bill being ultra-light LME. I don't see a problem with it. my beers are amazing

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I had great results, but the Home Brew Shop (the good one, out of two stores in my area) let me in on the secret that the yeast is worth replacing. I love the Cerveza, and do well with that Cooper all extract. I would use it as a quick second keg filler. Since then, I have gone All Grain, little more initial expense, but ten gallon batches sure is a whole lot easier to keep me "refreshed."

Austinhomebrew said:

Absolutely nothing is wrong with LME. It is best to buy it fresh and not in cans.

There are a lot of people that have used bad LME and blame it on the LME instead of freshness or LME in a metal can.

You can make excellent beers using malt extract. Just don't let anyone ask you if the beer you are offering them is extract or all-grain before they taste it.

Forrest

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Oh don't get me wrong, I've made plenty of delicious beers with LME. My LHBS even carries fresh ultra-light, light, amber and dark in 3 and 6 pound tubs that you can return for a refund! Can't say I've ever bought a can.

I dunno, DME seems easier, lasts longer and (in my opinion) just mixes up better. I didn't have to warm it up and scrape the living crap out of the tub to get it all out and I didn't have to worry about scorching at the bottom of the kettle.

My $0.02, but in most cases I just say "to each his/her own"

Reno_eNVy_446 said:

Oh don't get me wrong, I've made plenty of delicious beers with LME. My LHBS even carries fresh ultra-light, light, amber and dark in 3 and 6 pound tubs that you can return for a refund! Can't say I've ever bought a can.

I dunno, DME seems easier, lasts longer and (in my opinion) just mixes up better. I didn't have to warm it up and scrape the living crap out of the tub to get it all out and I didn't have to worry about scorching at the bottom of the kettle.

My $0.02, but in most cases I just say "to each his/her own"

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That is another great thing about All Grain (I have only used my mash tun once) there is no massive stiring and hoping that it won't stick too bad. I also had one of the primaries wreak of alcohol! Now that is my kind of beer.:rockin:

Reno_eNVy_446 said:

Oh don't get me wrong, I've made plenty of delicious beers with LME. My LHBS even carries fresh ultra-light, light, amber and dark in 3 and 6 pound tubs that you can return for a refund! Can't say I've ever bought a can.

I dunno, DME seems easier, lasts longer and (in my opinion) just mixes up better. I didn't have to warm it up and scrape the living crap out of the tub to get it all out and I didn't have to worry about scorching at the bottom of the kettle.

My $0.02, but in most cases I just say "to each his/her own"

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Since DME is made from LME it is really the same. Both are good. You state very valid reasons to use DME.

I think the implied concern was LME versus all-grain.

Forrest

I only ever brew with pre hopped extract kits, I don't do a boil, I just add the LME with a packet of DME, mix with water and pitch yeast. Almost every person who has ever tried my brews loves it and they keep asking for more.

smokeu...how many # of dme do you usually use?

i have 3# bags and it's be easy to add entire bag.

My brother in law has been using pre-hopped kits for sometime now and with few exceptions makes pretty decent beer considering he pretty much just throws the dextrose in and walks away. He does leave it for longer than the instructions say but that is the only difference from their instructions.

I have been using the Cooper's kits as a base so far. I've added some dry hop steps and gone to DME instead of sugar. That twang people speak of has never been a problem with my brews so far. I can't do as much with the flavours as you AG guys but I still make decent beer.

I've made decent beer with Mr. Beer cans, as long as I don't use their booster or yeast, and my Coopers Mexican Cerveza came out surprisingly good. I used the additional fermentables pack from Austin Home Brew on that one. It was good enough that I'm going to try the Coopers Sparkling Ale very soon.

I'm hoping to purchase a coworkers old all-grain setup shortly, but the pre-hopped kits are so easy I'll probaly keep playing around with them. I mean, I like what steeping grains and hop additions can add to my beers, but sometimes it's nice, especially with two kids running around, to have a really easy brew day and still get pretty drinkable beer out of it.

Many pre-hopped kits use a stabilized hop extract for bittering, which can be rather nasty.

As for the people who dis LME/DME here, it's a personal problem. Extract beers routinely win at BJCP contests, state fairs, and other brewing competitions.

I first started using the pre-hopped cans.
However, the LHBS also sold me some decent yeast and LME.

The outcome was a decent beer, but every batch had some weird... taste to it.

I thought maybe it was the bucket... did I not rinse it enough, etc.

However, when I ditched the can and started using grains and LME the taste disappeared.

Now however, I am fighting fermentation temperature off tastes.

I have made some fantastic beers with both LME and DME and am now about to go all grain. Two words to make the best of extract....late addition