Need help trying to reduce costs

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scorchingice

scorchingice

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Joined
Aug 15, 2009
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Location
Monticello Indiana, USA
I am currently a home brewer that has made extract batches and partial grain batches of homebrew, and very soon I will jump on the all grain wagon.

Currently I buy kits online because I live in an area where we have one main place to shop (Wall mart). I do not have anyplace near me that I could purchase hops, yeast smack packs, etc for certain.

Anyhow when I started homebrewing, I will go ahead and say that I was under the assumption it would eventually become cheaper to make beer than it is to buy it and come out better tasting. I assumed that once I bought the original equipment (fermenters, Swing Top bottles, Brewpots, etc) that I would only need to buy the ingredients and of course that should be cheaper. Well ordering online it is not cheaper, but I still love homebrewing so of course I do not plan to stop doing it just because I am not saving money. However this leaves me with a few questions.

How do I start cutting down on the cost of homebrewing? I plan to start growing my own hops this season and would like to find out some information about possibly buying grains locally.

Can I buy the basic 2 row malt grain from local farmers ? (We got TONS of farms where I am) I do not know anything about this but if I could find a way to purchase the main grains locally and grow my own hops I figure I could at least cut down on my costs. (Sure I will not be able to guarantee the AA of my hops but who cares, each batch will be a new taste experience)

Anyhow without special equipment for malting my own grains, what would I have to look for and ask for from the local farmers?

Again if I could buy the Grains local, grow my own hops, and only buy the smack pack yeast, the corn sugar, the specialty grains for flavor, I would assume this way I could at least cut down on my costs and save up for that Kegerator I would rather be spending my money on.

Is this possible or am I going to be stuck buying either kits or paying huge shipping on grains trying to buy them in bulk online? Or does someone have some other suggestions for me on how to buy in bulk and cut down my costs from buying these pre made ingredient kits?

Thanks in advance
 
start buying in bulk, 55 lb. grain bags. grow your own yeast. if your so inclined you can even grow your own hops. you could also buy an inline filter for your garden hose that will filter out all the crap you don't want in your beer.
 
Well, buying local grain and growing your own hops would definitely save money. But, you'd have to malt the grain yourself. I'm sure people have done it, but I'm not sure what kind of time and equipment investment is necessary to do it. And growing your own hops is nice, but how much can you reasonably grow? If you relied solely on homegrown hops, I'm wondering if that would slow your brewing to a crawl.

I think your best bet is to buy in bulk. Plenty of people do it and report 5 gallon batch costs at or below $20, which is certainly less than two cases of beer of the same quality. You can offset your cost even more by finding other people in the community interested in buying in bulk and purchasing pallets of grain sacks.

Yeast slanting would also make one pack of yeast last indefinitely.
 
TipsyDragon said:
start buying in bulk, 55 lb. grain bags.
Click to expand...

Am trying to find a good place to buy from without huge shipping costs.

TipsyDragon said:
grow your own yeast.
Click to expand...

Not worried about the cost of the yeat smack packs

TipsyDragon said:
if your so inclined you can even grow your own hops.
Click to expand...

I mentioned I was starting my hop growing this year.

TipsyDragon said:
you could also buy an inline filter for your garden hose that will filter out all the crap you don't want in your beer.
Click to expand...

Maybe later, more interested in gaining information of how to lower costs of the ingredients by buying in bulk locally, growing my own hops, etc.
 
Making SMaSH beers (single malt, single hop) would also eliminate your need for specialty grains thus reducing money spent on materials and money spent on shipping (by a lot).
 
scorchingice said:
I am currently a home brewer that has made extract batches and partial grain batches of homebrew, and very soon I will jump on the all grain wagon.

Currently I buy kits online because I live in an area where we have one main place to shop (Wall mart). I do not have anyplace near me that I could purchase hops, yeast smack packs, etc for certain.

Anyhow when I started homebrewing, I will go ahead and say that I was under the assumption it would eventually become cheaper to make beer than it is to buy it and come out better tasting. I assumed that once I bought the original equipment (fermenters, Swing Top bottles, Brewpots, etc) that I would only need to buy the ingredients and of course that should be cheaper. Well ordering online it is not cheaper, but I still love homebrewing so of course I do not plan to stop doing it just because I am not saving money. However this leaves me with a few questions.

How do I start cutting down on the cost of homebrewing? I plan to start growing my own hops this season and would like to find out some information about possibly buying grains locally.

Can I buy the basic 2 row malt grain from local farmers ? (We got TONS of farms where I am) I do not know anything about this but if I could find a way to purchase the main grains locally and grow my own hops I figure I could at least cut down on my costs. (Sure I will not be able to guarantee the AA of my hops but who cares, each batch will be a new taste experience)

Anyhow without special equipment for malting my own grains, what would I have to look for and ask for from the local farmers?

Again if I could buy the Grains local, grow my own hops, and only buy the smack pack yeast, the corn sugar, the specialty grains for flavor, I would assume this way I could at least cut down on my costs and save up for that Kegerator I would rather be spending my money on.

Is this possible or am I going to be stuck buying either kits or paying huge shipping on grains trying to buy them in bulk online? Or does someone have some other suggestions for me on how to buy in bulk and cut down my costs from buying these pre made ingredient kits?

Thanks in advance
Click to expand...

Once you buy a few things, it's not so bad. I live somewhere we don't even have a Wal-mart within 50 miles, so I'm a bit more isolated than you are. But you can buy a few things online, and pay $7 shipping no matter how much you buy. Check out austinhomebrew.com and brewmasterswarehouse.com. If you buy more than $60, shipping is free at morebeer.com. I know that's not what you wanted to hear- but that's the cheapest way to do it.

Once you get your ingredients, it's not expensive at all. Check out yeast washing, so that one package of yeast will last for many, many brews. Buy hops from hopsdirect, by the pound, so you can have them in the freezer for $.90/ounce.

For grains, you have to have them malted, so local farmers won't work. But you can buy a 50# sack for $40 and either pay for shipping, or buy a sack when you travel if you don't have a homebrew store. (That's what I usually have to do- I hauled a 50# sack almost 900 miles last time I went to visit family!)

I usually plan my brews in advance, so I keep a few items on hand. Each time I order, since it's flat rate shipping, I order a couple more pounds than I need for that brew. So now, I have a selection of specialty grains that I use often, and base malts, and quite a bit of yeast in my fridge. I also have four different kinds of hops from hopsdirect.
 
scorchingice said:
Maybe later, more interested in gaining information of how to lower costs of the ingredients by buying in bulk locally, growing my own hops, etc.
Click to expand...

water is an ingredient a local one at that. getting it from the city is cheaper than getting it from the store.
 
Is there a local brewery within a reasonable distance? Lots of breweries will let you buy grain and hops either from them or tag onto their orders. Local breweries are also a great place to pick up a quart or two of yeast.
 
mojotele said:
Well, buying local grain and growing your own hops would definitely save money. But, you'd have to malt the grain yourself. I'm sure people have done it, but I'm not sure what kind of time and equipment investment is necessary to do it. And growing your own hops is nice, but how much can you reasonably grow? If you relied solely on homegrown hops, I'm wondering if that would slow your brewing to a crawl.
Click to expand...

I definately do not wish to malt my own grain, I would like to find a way to get malted grain cheaper. Ordering online is not bad, but the shipping costs for heavy grain is a lot. As far as growing hops, I plan to grow 3 different types of hops with 4 plants of each type. So eventually I hope I get a good amount growing.

mojotele said:
I think your best bet is to buy in bulk. Plenty of people do it and report 5 gallon batch costs at or below $20, which is certainly less than two cases of beer of the same quality. You can offset your cost even more by finding other people in the community interested in buying in bulk and purchasing pallets of grain sacks.
Click to expand...

I agree. It seems I will have to buy the malted grain in bulk, the problem is where to get it the cheapest?
 
-as said before malt needs to be bought from maltsters, not farmers. (Hugh Baird, Briess, Gambrinus, Great Western etc)

Farmers grow barley, maltsters process barley into malt.

-Yeast should be one place to save quite a bit of money. Don't dismiss repitching at least.

-Find a local homebrew club...somewhere. You'll find people in the same boat looking for group buys or you'll flat out get a discount on your materials from a shop.
 
Nurmey said:
Is there a local brewery within a reasonable distance? Lots of breweries will let you buy grain and hops either from them or tag onto their orders. Local breweries are also a great place to pick up a quart or two of yeast.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I will look into this. I am not sure we have any close, but can try finding some.


philrose said:
-Yeast should be one place to save quite a bit of money. Don't dismiss repitching at least.
Click to expand...

Thanks I'll research this to find out how to go about doing this.

philrose said:
-Find a local homebrew club...somewhere. You'll find people in the same boat looking for group buys or you'll flat out get a discount on your materials from a shop.
Click to expand...

I will have to look to see if we have any close. More likely to have these than a brewery nearby.
 
The shipping costs on bulk grain may be high, but they should be less than buying grain 10 pounds at a time and adding the shipping costs together. You have to look at this in a more relative manner. You're spending more money short term, but less money long term.

As for which is cheapest, just shop around. Austin Homebrew, Northern Brewer, and MoreBeer all sell bulk grain. I'm sure there are many more stores out there. Pick a base malt you want to work with and buy a sack from whoever is cheapest after including shipping.
 
YooperBrew said:
Once you buy a few things, it's not so bad. I live somewhere we don't even have a Wal-mart within 50 miles, so I'm a bit more isolated than you are. But you can buy a few things online, and pay $7 shipping no matter how much you buy. Check out austinhomebrew.com and brewmasterswarehouse.com. If you buy more than $60, shipping is free at morebeer.com. I know that's not what you wanted to hear- but that's the cheapest way to do it.

Once you get your ingredients, it's not expensive at all. Check out yeast washing, so that one package of yeast will last for many, many brews. Buy hops from hopsdirect, by the pound, so you can have them in the freezer for $.90/ounce.

For grains, you have to have them malted, so local farmers won't work. But you can buy a 50# sack for $40 and either pay for shipping, or buy a sack when you travel if you don't have a homebrew store. (That's what I usually have to do- I hauled a 50# sack almost 900 miles last time I went to visit family!)

I usually plan my brews in advance, so I keep a few items on hand. Each time I order, since it's flat rate shipping, I order a couple more pounds than I need for that brew. So now, I have a selection of specialty grains that I use often, and base malts, and quite a bit of yeast in my fridge. I also have four different kinds of hops from hopsdirect.
Click to expand...

This is very helpful information. Thank you. The flat rate shipping is what I need the most. Most of my buying in bulk worries was the shipping costs. Grain is heavy. I could buy the grains in bulk, and some Hops for when my hops plants are not growing any. I will look into yeast washing for sure, but since I have been buying kits, the yeast always came with so this wasn't an issue, but when I buy in bulk, every bit counts.

Thanks for this valuable information

:mug:
 
FYI, Northern Brewer doesn't offer fixed rate shipping on their bulk grain. It appears that Austin Homebrew DOES, though, which is awesome.

So you can buy yourself a sack of 2-row or something, then maybe a few pounds of whatever specialty grains you find yourself using a lot of (roasted barley if you like stouts, maybe some crystal for general use, and so on). I think the key in buying bulk is to really get a handle on what beers you want to make as that affects the hops and specialty grains you need.
 
weirdboy said:
Isn't Mid Country malt a source for bulk grain in that area?

They ship pretty damn cheap as I recall.
Click to expand...

Mid Country Malt Supply
334 West Armory Drive
South Holland, Illinois 60473


Odd enough that is about 10 minutes from my other house in Lansing IL.

Thanks for this information !!! I could go pick some up from here.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Ok some questions about buying in bulk.

#1 How long will the following items stay good storing them and what is the best temperature to store them at? Is outside in winter going to harm them? Do they need to stay within a certain temperature range?

a. Hops
b. Grain

#2 Is it better to store the ingredients until you need more beer made or is it better to go ahead and make all the beer at once and store it to "Age"? If it is better to make extra and let it "Age" would it be better to age it unprimed in the fermenters or put them in corny kegs with priming sugar and leave them in the kegs for a few months untapped ?


Thanks again...
 
I can buy DRY bulk extract for 2.50-2.75 a pound in bulk....

I mean these aren't all grain prices by any means, but its way cheaper than any LHBS sells for. I dunno... Considering the ease with which beer making is with extract and the fact that for the most part any beer doesn't need any more than 6-9lbs of malt extract. we are talking 18-27$ per brew in malt if you bulk order. Which is way better than 24-36 per brew if you buy at a lhbs. You can easily bulk buy hops too.

LHBS beer average costs - 30$(malt), 6$(hops)-, 7$(yeast), 2$(specialty grains)
Bulk Purchase and Re-using yeast - 20$ / 1$ / 1-2$/ 2$

So basically instead of 45$ for 2 cases of beer, you can make 2 cases for 25$. All grain could probably make that beer for 13-17 dollars.

And without buying hops online...you really just can't make some of the great Indian Pales unless you want to pay out the butt for hops from your LHBS. Any beer that requires a decent amount of hopping if almost off limits to extract brewers buying from their lhbs. Becuase you would need to spend upwards of 10-15$ in hops alone. When if you bought online bulk...it would be maybe 1~$ total to create an indian pale ale.
 
BULK BULK BULK!

Hops, grain/extract, boom. Can a bunch of 1.040 wort (with a pressure capable food preserving canner) to build starters from all the yeast that you will wash.

Much savings can be had by buying in bulk and re-using yeast.
 
scorchingice said:
#1 How long will the following items stay good storing them and what is the best temperature to store them at? Is outside in winter going to harm them? Do they need to stay within a certain temperature range?

a. Hops
b. Grain
Click to expand...

Hops should be stored in as much of an air free environment as possible and as cold as possible. Optimum conditions would be vacuum sealed in a freezer.

Grain should be kept in a sealed container of some sort and kept dry and cool. I've been putting mine in large freezer ziplock bags and putting it in the fridge. But then, I don't have much grain. I think putting them in plastic containers and keeping them at room temperature will keep unmilled grain fine for like a year, possibly more.

You probably don't want to keep either outside. Animals will tear into them. Plus grain can get infested by weevils.

scorchingice said:
#2 Is it better to store the ingredients until you need more beer made or is it better to go ahead and make all the beer at once and store it to "Age"? If it is better to make extra and let it "Age" would it be better to age it unprimed in the fermenters or put them in corny kegs with priming sugar and leave them in the kegs for a few months untapped ?
Click to expand...

I'd say that's more personal preference than anything. Make as much beer as you can as fast as you can if you want a steady supply of beer. The ingredients will keep as long as you follow the directions above.
 

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