Domestic Best Bitter?

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Eskimo Spy

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I'm trying to make a best bitter clone of a Hogs Back Traditional English Ale, the brewery is in England, and tiny, so they don't sell their beer here.

So, does anyone know of a best bitter, low carbonation and around 4.2% ABV, available in the states? Specifically, Texas? I want to try the style out with my clone to see if I'm coming close. Thanks for any help!
 
If you can get Coniston Bluebird Bitter, it's both very good and hits your abv right on the head. If the carbonation is higher than you want, you can pour it from one glass to another to "flatten" it a little. I don't know if you can get in Texas, but I could get it in NC even before they reformed their beer laws and I can get it here. Fuller's London Pride is also good, and might be easier to find. Fuller's can do no wrong in my book.

I've got Jamil's Best/Special Bitter in secondary right now. Bitters are probably my favorite beers.
 
If you can get Coniston Bluebird Bitter, it's both very good and hits your abv right on the head. If the carbonation is higher than you want, you can pour it from one glass to another to "flatten" it a little. I don't know if you can get in Texas, but I could get it in NC even before they reformed their beer laws and I can get it here. Fuller's London Pride is also good, and might be easier to find. Fuller's can do no wrong in my book.

I've got Jamil's Best/Special Bitter in secondary right now. Bitters are probably my favorite beers.

I'm not sure I'd compare with Bluebird. IIRC, Bluebird contains exclusively Challenger hops as opposed to the usual focus on EKG or Fuggles. I've had Bluebird here in the States and recall that it didn't taste typical of the ales I've had in the UK. Now, it could be that the long voyage or shelf storage helped to skew the flavor from the freshness of it's home country, but I think the sole use of Challenger makes it somewhat atypical. Hog's Back's TEAs description in my "Eyewitness Companions: Beer" (Michael Jackson) states:
A pale brown, well-crafted, malty bitter with a hoppy and slightly fruity aroma, some bitter-sweetness, and a long, dry finish.

It does sound delicious. Kind of reminds me of my Redden Bitter. I'm racking my brain and can't think of one readily available in the states that would come close... maybe Fuller's London Pride.
 
You're right menschmachine, the Bluebird is all Challenger, so it will have an entirely differently hop bouquet than most special bitters. The malt character (Maris Otter and crystal) is pretty typical for a bitter, if a little low on upfront maltiness (I love victory malt). Either way, it's a good beer, and I probably just mentioned it because I like it so much. I think you're probably right though- London Pride is the closest Eskimo Spy is likely to get to what he's brewing in terms of commercially available brews. Saint Peter's may have something available as well.
 
Good call! The Hogs Back is fuggles and EKG, although I used all EKG, Briess Golden Light and crystal malt 60ºL. I'm trying to find some Fuller's London Pride now to have a decent comparison, thanks guys.

Hey, would it be more in the style to carb with corn sugar or DME?
 
IMHO I really wouldn't worry too much about any comparison to a commercial bottled or canned bitter. Bitters do not taste nearly the same from a commercial bottle as they do cask conditioned, and you won't be able to get it CC here. If you keep basically to a traditional recipe, your bottles will be effectively cask conditioned as the yeast will stil be active. Your brew will be more than likely be greatly superior to any bottled bitter you are comparing it with.

I used to love Old Speckled Hen on draught. I bought some bottles here a few months ago, and I won't be buying any more. I was very dissapointed with it. In fact every bitter I have brewed has been better than an "original" bottled bitter.

Just brew it and enjoy it, it will taste like the real thing. :)
 
Good call! The Hogs Back is fuggles and EKG, although I used all EKG, Briess Golden Light and crystal malt 60ºL. I'm trying to find some Fuller's London Pride now to have a decent comparison, thanks guys.

Hey, would it be more in the style to carb with corn sugar or DME?

Corn sugar will be fine... just go easy on it, keep the volumes to be within style.

If I were to guess at fermentables based on the vague description in my beer book and what I know about British beers, I would consider using a Marris Otter malt extract next time. Add some Crystal 60, 80, or 120 along with a little bit of a "malty" grain like Munich or Vienna. I'd put EKG and Fuggles in for bittering and only EKG for flavor and aroma. For yeast (if dry), I'd definitely use S-04. Maybe Nottingham, but I don't think it would come out quite as fruity. For liquid, any of the more fruity English strains would be good. I really like WLP-023 Burton Ale. I'd also keep a close eye on fermentation temps. To get that balance between malt and the fruity characteristics from EKG and the yeast, you'd want the fermentation temp right in the middle of its optimum range. You'd also want a medium sized yeast starter... not too much, not too little.

Hope that's not TMI!
 
IMHO I really wouldn't worry too much about any comparison to a commercial bottled or canned bitter. Bitters do not taste nearly the same from a commercial bottle as they do cask conditioned, and you won't be able to get it CC here. If you keep basically to a traditional recipe, your bottles will be effectively cask conditioned as the yeast will stil be active. Your brew will be more than likely be greatly superior to any bottled bitter you are comparing it with.

I used to love Old Speckled Hen on draught. I bought some bottles here a few months ago, and I won't be buying any more. I was very dissapointed with it. In fact every bitter I have brewed has been better than an "original" bottled bitter.

Just brew it and enjoy it, it will taste like the real thing. :)

Not really a direct comparison, I'm trying to get an idea of the style and flavors. I've been trying to find Fuller's London Pride or somesuch on tap, just to get an idea of the bitterness and mouthfeel.
 
Corn sugar will be fine... just go easy on it, keep the volumes to be within style.

If I were to guess at fermentables based on the vague description in my beer book and what I know about British beers, I would consider using a Marris Otter malt extract next time. Add some Crystal 60, 80, or 120 along with a little bit of a "malty" grain like Munich or Vienna. I'd put EKG and Fuggles in for bittering and only EKG for flavor and aroma. For yeast (if dry), I'd definitely use S-04. Maybe Nottingham, but I don't think it would come out quite as fruity. For liquid, any of the more fruity English strains would be good. I really like WLP-023 Burton Ale. I'd also keep a close eye on fermentation temps. To get that balance between malt and the fruity characteristics from EKG and the yeast, you'd want the fermentation temp right in the middle of its optimum range. You'd also want a medium sized yeast starter... not too much, not too little.

Hope that's not TMI!

The homebrew shop didn't have any marris otter or fuggles, I'll be ordering those from AHBS next time. I used Wyeast 1968, we'll see what my English friend thinks of it.

It's bubbling away at 70º, happy as can be. And there's no such thing as TMI!
 
Not really a direct comparison, I'm trying to get an idea of the style and flavors. I've been trying to find Fuller's London Pride or somesuch on tap, just to get an idea of the bitterness and mouthfeel.

OK, while a standard bitter, not a best bitter, Boddington's is the closest tasting version of the real thing that is available in cans IMO. The head will be different, as is the style of Boddington's it will have a large creamy head, especially as the cans have a widget. So, for the typical style, ignore the head on the boddinton's but take note of the flavour. They can the flavour fairly well. Then get a can of Old Speckled Hen and note the head and carbonation, but not the taste. Mix and match your opinions, and you might get a rough idea. ;)
 
Man am I glad we can brew better bitters than we can buy here in the states. The canned products are still pretty good, but a nice cask-or-bottle conditioned bitter is one of the best things in the world.

One more thing, OP: If you don't know about it already, this website is really handy for helping you dial in the carbonation of your batch. Like someone said already, you want a lower level of carbonation in your bitter than you'd want in an American brew. Too much will make the beer seem too thin.
 
Man am I glad we can brew better bitters than we can buy here in the states. The canned products are still pretty good, but a nice cask-or-bottle conditioned bitter is one of the best things in the world.

One more thing, OP: If you don't know about it already, this website is really handy for helping you dial in the carbonation of your batch. Like someone said already, you want a lower level of carbonation in your bitter than you'd want in an American brew. Too much will make the beer seem too thin.

Yeah, I had run the calc using Beersmith, and it came up with about the same amount, 1.3 oz for the 5 gallon batch. I can't wait!
 
OK, while a standard bitter, not a best bitter, Boddington's is the closest tasting version of the real thing that is available in cans IMO. The head will be different, as is the style of Boddington's it will have a large creamy head, especially as the cans have a widget. So, for the typical style, ignore the head on the boddinton's but take note of the flavour. They can the flavour fairly well. Then get a can of Old Speckled Hen and note the head and carbonation, but not the taste. Mix and match your opinions, and you might get a rough idea. ;)

Okay cool, the local store has canned Boddington's pub ale

randalls_2015_22530241


in stock, so I'll try that. They've got bottles of Old Speckled, should I try that as well for the head and carb, or look for cans?
 
I have no idea what's currently available in Texas, but out of the three beers mentioned, my two cents (or my one English penny, going on the current exchange rate) would be to go with Bluebird as the best proxy-beer to try. Like the Hogs Back beer, it's a slightly fruity English bitter with the same ABV as T.E.A. has. Bluebird would probably be a little more spicy due to the Challenger hops, but importantly it's bottle-conditioned; Pride and Boddies are both pasturised, and I think would come across as a little more watery. Pride wouldn't be bad, though I think it uses Challenger and Target (and maybe Northdown or Northern Brewer? I forget) so it's still hopped differently, as well as being a little stronger than T.E.A.

TBH, I think the beer you end up making will probably be far better than the English beers you can get hold of. It'll be well made, fresh, unpasturised, and it won't have had to sit in a baking warehouse for ages during shipping. Actually, if you print this out...

TEA.jpg


...and stick it on the bottles, you could probably pass it off as the original :D
 
They've got bottles of Old Speckled, should I try that as well for the head and carb, or look for cans?

Probably best to stick with the bottles. I dunno if the cans have widgets or not. Widgets tend to get a bit carried away with the ol' fizziness.

Please bear in mind, I am definitely NOT recommending these beers for buying other than as a comparison. Draught bitter or homebrew bitters are the only way to go in my opinion. If you taste these bottles and cans before you get to try your homebrew, you might be tempted to ditch your batch. ;)
 
Probably best to stick with the bottles. I dunno if the cans have widgets or not. Widgets tend to get a bit carried away with the ol' fizziness.

Please bear in mind, I am definitely NOT recommending these beers for buying other than as a comparison. Draught bitter or homebrew bitters are the only way to go in my opinion. If you taste these bottles and cans before you get to try your homebrew, you might be tempted to ditch your batch. ;)

I bought a 4-pack of the Boddington's ale and a bottle of Old Speckled Hen, so between the two it should give me a decent idea of the bitterness, mouthfeel, head retention, and carbonation.

lol, I know you're just helping me get something to approximate style. And no worries, I don't throw out beer unless it is so infected it can move by itself!
 
I have Jamil's Bitter up next in a 2.5 gallon recipe. I'll be using Fuggles for the first time instead of the EKG. The carbonation should be around 1.3 volumes for this style?


This style seems like what a Cream Ale or American Lager should be......
 
I have Jamil's Bitter up next in a 2.5 gallon recipe. I'll be using Fuggles for the first time instead of the EKG. The carbonation should be around 1.3 volumes for this style?


This style seems like what a Cream Ale or American Lager should be......

Aubie, I just brewed Jamil's Special Bitter, and it tasted better going into secondary than any beer I 've brewed. I get the sense that the English/Scottish session ales might be Jamil's favorites overall, and I think his recipes for those styles are especially dialed in. I added 4 oz. of maltodextrin to give it a bit more body, because 1.3 volumes of carbonation felt too flat to my American palate last time I made a bitter. I plan to aim for 1.7 volumes this time. YMMV.
 
Ooooookay, so I drank the Hen and the Boddington's tonight...

First off, the post about the Hen being skunky were spot on. Stinky. But, once I fought through the skunk, I get the idea of the general style, more or less.

The Boddington's, however, was complete ass. I'm not a fan of the nitro insert, and it ruined the beer, IMO. The taste was ruined, as was the mouthfeel. Blech. No more Boddington cans for me!

All that said, now I'm really anxious to taste my version, it is going to be fantastic to drink a non-skunked version!
 
Aubie, I just brewed Jamil's Special Bitter, and it tasted better going into secondary than any beer I 've brewed. I get the sense that the English/Scottish session ales might be Jamil's favorites overall, and I think his recipes for those styles are especially dialed in. I added 4 oz. of maltodextrin to give it a bit more body, because 1.3 volumes of carbonation felt too flat to my American palate last time I made a bitter. I plan to aim for 1.7 volumes this time. YMMV.

If I were making this for me, I would likely increase it to the ceiling of the recommended Co2 levels for the style, but the guy who asked for it is a Brit from the region that makes this beer, and it is served undercarbed.
 
If I were making this for me, I would likely increase it to the ceiling of the recommended Co2 levels for the style, but the guy who asked for it is a Brit from the region that makes this beer, and it is served undercarbed.

Good call. I carbed my first one to 1.2 volumes or so, and while it was really good, I wanted just a bit more carbonation. I think you're right on with the way you're approaching this beer.
 
Thanks for the recipe Orfy, I was really bummed when I tasted that Bod. Why would anyone want to drink that can of head? Yuck.
 
Beersmith shows the style carbonation volumes to range from .8 - 2.2. I figure to aim at the 2.0. Does it really need the Cara-pils?
 
FYI... If the Hen is in a clear bottle, it might be a little skunky.


I had that happen when I tried it last winter. Orfey was raving about it (on tap of course) and I found one in a *gawk* clear bottle...and skunky it was. He mentioned I should keep my eye out for it in cans. I just came across some canned last weekend, but am still a little hesitant.
 
I had that happen when I tried it last winter. Orfey was raving about it (on tap of course) and I found one in a *gawk* clear bottle...and skunky it was. He mentioned I should keep my eye out for it in cans. I just came across some canned last weekend, but am still a little hesitant.

Cans or bottles, it's just nothing like draught. But you gotta satisfy that curiosity, don't ya? ;)
 
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