Mariss Otter?

I called on prices to see if it was worth it to drive a bit farther to get a sack of grain, and yes, it is. But more importantly, I found that I could get MO for a lot less than I expected. I've been wanting to try it, because I've seen a lot of people talking about it, but I'm not sure exactly what it brings to the table as far as it's special properties.

I assume I'd use it in place of all, or most, of the 2-row that I'd normally use for brewing Pale Ales and the like. So what's it got that the average 2-row doesn't?

I use it often. I especially love it in English style beers. It's got too much flavor to use in IPAs, in my opinion, but it's good in maltier beers.

It's got this bready/grainy texture and flavor that US 2-row just doesn't. It's "warmer" and maltier tasting, if that makes sense.

Maris Otter is a 2 row. It is a British 2 row that imparts a slight bit of nuttiness or some have described it as an earthy feel. If you are brewing to style Maris Otter is typically the base malt in all UK style ales.

I've been very interested in trying MO as well. Haven't tried it yet but I've been thinking of doing a MO/Cascade SMaSH.

I have an amarillo/maris otter smash on tap right now. It's good!

I do love Marris Otter in many styles - I have only used one sack of it so far, but I do notice the difference.

The best way to learn the differences in the two grains is to chew each one for a while and then spit it out into a trash can. Standard 2 row or pale malt has a much 'narrower' taste, and as stated above, the MO gives a nuttier, and I like to use 'fuller' or 'broader' flavor. The difference is pretty noticeable.

Yeah it costs more, but then it's imported, so transportation to the US is what you are paying extra for; and as also stated above, it's the Brits' standard base grain.

I brew stouts, browns, pales and IPA's, and while I almost always have both in my stock, I much prefer the taste of the MO at a 100% base grain usage.

YooperBrew said:

I have an amarillo/maris otter smash on tap right now. It's good!

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I bought some MO last week to try the same SMaSH; what hop schedule did you follow please?

Bentpirate said:

I bought some MO last week to try the same SMaSH; what hop schedule did you follow please?

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I did this:

9 lbs Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 81.82 %
2 lbs Toasted Malt (27.0 SRM) Grain 18.18 %

1.00 oz Amarillo [9.50 %] (60 min) Hops 31.2 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo [9.50 %] (15 min) Hops 7.7 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo [9.50 %] (5 min) Hops 3.1 IBU

1.00 oz Amarillo [9.50 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -

I did a balanced water profile- "balanced" on the EZ spreadsheet. I did "cheat" and toast 2 pounds of MO for about 30-40 minutes before crushing it.

Well, I've been meaning to try making a mild or some sort of english session beer. But my next few brews were going to be:

a) Wit or Blonde
b) IIPA or Oaked Bourbon IIPA
c) Stout or Oaked Bourbon Stout

I suppose I "could" sub a mild for the Wit or Blonde. I like having a lighter beer on tap, but I also plan on sharing. The IIPA and the Stout would likely get bottled.

Any other suggestions for recipes that use MO? I'm up for anything as long as it's not a sour.

I have a brown ale recipe that I use MO for the base malt.. It comes out terrific. Its not aggresivly hopped so i guess its not super american west coast or anything but its a good beer to get people into tasting beer with color

its in my drop down.

This one is excellent...
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f65/irish-red-1st-place-hbt-comp-141086/

I am just sure that there that there is some simple way to duplicate the flavor of MO with some base pilsner or domestic 2-row and a bit of victory or similar. That would make one less bulk grain to stock. I wish I know what that combination was.

YooperBrew said:

I did this:

9 lbs Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 81.82 %
2 lbs Toasted Malt (27.0 SRM) Grain 18.18 %

1.00 oz Amarillo [9.50 %] (60 min) Hops 31.2 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo [9.50 %] (15 min) Hops 7.7 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo [9.50 %] (5 min) Hops 3.1 IBU

1.00 oz Amarillo [9.50 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -

I did a balanced water profile- "balanced" on the EZ spreadsheet. I did "cheat" and toast 2 pounds of MO for about 30-40 minutes before crushing it.

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Scary thought, including the roasting - that is very close to what I was thinking, seeing this post help me realize that I am not a dumb as I think - YIPPIE

HenryHill said:

chew each one for a while and then spit it out into a trash can.

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Whats wrong with swallowing the grain?

Kralizec said:

Whats wrong with swallowing the grain?

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Well, see, when tasting grain, some guys spit and some guys swallow. I guess that other guy is a spitter. Rude, if you ask me.

I find that it has a bit more of the "biscuity" flavor.

Can some one give me their opinion on this SMaSH idea?

10 lbs 12.0 oz Marris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 100.00 %
0.50 oz Citra [12.30 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
0.50 oz Citra [12.30 %] (60 min) Hops 16.1 IBU
0.50 oz Citra [12.30 %] (60 min) (First Wort Hop) Hops 17.7 IBU
0.25 oz Citra [12.30 %] (12 min) Hops 3.4 IBU
0.50 oz Citra [12.30 %] (2 min) Hops 1.4 IBU

38.5 IBU's...

Since we now have a good feel for how MO compares to Pale Ale...

How about Marris Otter vs. Munich?

Drinking a mild ale I did with MO and Amarillo right now. Nice summer ale.

6.50 lb Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 70.27 %
2.75 lb Pilsner (2 Row) Ger (1.5 SRM) Grain 29.73 %
0.75 oz Amarillo Gold [9.90 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
0.50 oz Cascade [7.50 %] (60 min) Hops 13.5 IBU
0.50 oz Cascade [7.50 %] (30 min) Hops 10.4 IBU

Homercidal, here is an Special/Best/Premium Bitter recipe I have been brewing for 3 or 4 years now. It has won gold in the two competitions in which it was entered (scores of 41 and 44). It is a nice session beer @ 4.5% - 4.6%. I almost brought a keg to Yooper's brew day instead of Citralicious Pale Ale.




Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 10.00 gal
Boil Size: 12.55 gal
Estimated OG: 1.045 SG
Estimated Color: 11.6 SRM
Estimated IBU: 31.9 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
11.50 lb Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 73.72 %
1.50 lb Toasted Maris (27.0 SRM) Grain 9.62 %
1.25 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 8.01 %
0.35 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain 2.24 %
2.50 oz Fuggles [5.20 %] (60 min) (First Wort HopHops 27.0 IBU
1.00 oz Fuggles [5.20 %] (15 min) Hops 4.9 IBU
2.00 oz Williamette [4.80 %] (0 min) Hops -
2.00 tbsp PH 5.2 Stabilizer (Mash 60.0 min) Misc
2.00 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
1.00 lb Brown Sugar, Light (8.0 SRM) Sugar 6.41 %
2 Pkgs SafAle English Ale (DCL Yeast #S-04) Yeast-Ale

Mash @ 152F for 75min

I ended up buying Golden Promise. I caught a glimpse of it on some other forums while google searching for something and did a little reading. I do plan on picking up a sack of MO the next time and brewing some English beers with it. I have been thinking about a Mild for a while and that Bitter looks good. Not sure why those beers never get brewed. I don't brew that often, so the regular IPA, Wit, Blonde get brewed more I guess.

I did a mild with Golden Promise, and it was fantastic! I can did up the recipe if you want.

Here's the Maris/Cascade SmaSH I made this weekend:

12 lbs Maris Otter
1 oz Cascade @ 60 min
1.5 oz Cascade @ 30 min
1 oz Cascade @ 15 min
1 oz Cascade @ 0 min
1.5 oz Cascade - dry hop

It was so good when I racked into the fermenter. The flavor of the MO is fantastic. This could easily become my "go to" grain!

Kralizec said:

Whats wrong with swallowing the grain?

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Just found this question.

Swallowing the grain or anything you are attempting to taste compare (think wines or pro tasters), you'll find that spitting out the target is better for getting it off your palate, before trying a new target. You will still have this on your breath and in your throat when trying the next one, so your next trial is already tainted before you start it.

Spitting it out when done only puts it on your tongue; very little is swallowed.

Maris Otter is greatly misunderstood. Most of the malts sold as 'Maris Otter' aren't in fact Maris Otter at all, they're just regular old 2-row, grown in England, and kilned in the English tradition.

Also note that not all '2-row' malt is the same here, either. Much of the malt that's referred to as '2-row,' '2-row pale,' 'pale malt,' 'brewers malt,' etc is all the same. English-style kilned malts *are* available here, too, they're just far less common. Most folks don't realize that there's a difference between '2-row pale malt' and 'pale *ale* malt.' And because the plain old pale malt is what's most in demand for light american-style beers, that's what's generally out there.

But if you're specific and shop around, you can find english-style ale malts here, Gambrinus ESB malt, for example.

See:
http://www.countrymaltgroup.com/canadamalting.asp
http://www.countrymaltgroup.com/greatwestern.asp
and
http://www.brewingwithbriess.com/Products/High_Temp_Kilned_Malts.htm#PaleAle
vs
http://www.brewingwithbriess.com/Products/Base_Malts.htm#TwoRow

Note how pale malt and pale *ale* malt are all listed separately? There's a MUCH smaller difference between 'maris otter' and 'pale *ale* malt' as there is between 'maris otter' and 'pale 2-row' malt.

prosper said:

Maris Otter is greatly misunderstood. Most of the malts sold as 'Maris Otter' aren't in fact Maris Otter at all, they're just regular old 2-row, grown in England, and kilned in the English tradition.

Also note that not all '2-row' malt is the same here, either. Much of the malt that's referred to as '2-row,' '2-row pale,' 'pale malt,' 'brewers malt,' etc is all the same. English-style kilned malts *are* available here, too, they're just far less common. Most folks don't realize that there's a difference between '2-row pale malt' and 'pale *ale* malt.' And because the plain old pale malt is what's most in demand for light american-style beers, that's what's generally out there.

But if you're specific and shop around, you can find english-style ale malts here, Gambrinus ESB malt, for example.

See:
http://www.countrymaltgroup.com/canadamalting.asp
http://www.countrymaltgroup.com/greatwestern.asp
and
http://www.brewingwithbriess.com/Products/High_Temp_Kilned_Malts.htm#PaleAle
vs
http://www.brewingwithbriess.com/Products/Base_Malts.htm#TwoRow

Note how pale malt and pale *ale* malt are all listed separately? There's a MUCH smaller difference between 'maris otter' and 'pale *ale* malt' as there is between 'maris otter' and 'pale 2-row' malt.

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I am not sure what you mean. I have always known that in America, and I assumed Canada was no different, that a higher L base malt from standard kilned 2-row malt, was known as pale malt, and I have not seen before nor do I see now, what you mean by separate listings-one is around 2.0L and the other is a bit darker at around 3.5L. There is only one of each offering, and the spelling or reference names are no different.

Yet the English version of 2-row, grown and kilned in England, is always referred to as Maris Otter, as it is not only a slightly different species of grain, it is grown in England where the environment is different as well.

If there is another version of this, I'd love to know...but I'm not seeing it from the examples listed.

If it helps, you can drink mild like a lighter beer.

Homercidal said:

I suppose I "could" sub a mild for the Wit or Blonde. I like having a lighter beer on tap, but I also plan on sharing. The IIPA and the Stout would likely get bottled.

Any other suggestions for recipes that use MO? I'm up for anything as long as it's not a sour.

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