Erlenmeyer starter starter process tips?

Do you guys add DME prior to putting on the stove? I have always done my starter in a pot and moved to gallon jugs - which then are placed on my DIY stirplate. I just picked up a 5L erlenmeyer for lager starters and wondering what the best method is for glass stove heating in one shot. DME is instant caramel over steam so guessing you add prior to boiling as that narrow opening seems would be a mess. Any problems with it sticking to the bottom and caramelizing? Any tips to make it simple and avoid a mess and the resulting wrath of SWMBO?

Not sure how I ended up with two starter's in the title - but thank you thank you for the input!

When boiling in a flask I warm the water up slightly first, move the flask off the heat, add DME, swirl until fully dissolved, then place it back on the heat. There's no sticking or scorching this way.

Also keep an eye on it during the boil watching for boil overs. It also helps if you boil it lightly instead of super hard.

I found it impossible to get the DME in the little neck of the flask without it clumping up. Now, I boil the water and DME in a pot on the stove, cool it in the sink and pour it into the sanitized flask using a funnel. Much easier.

Tip #1: use a funnel for getting your DME into your flask. A kitchen funnel will likely be too narrow. I make a funnel by rolling up a sheet of paper; that lets it be as wide as possible and it extends a good way down into the flask so you minimize the amount of DME that sticks to the side of the flask. Realistically the easiest thing to do is to mix in a separate pot or whatever then pour into your flask, but that's an extra step.

Tip #2: use foam control (I cannot emphasize this enough). Because of the shape of flasks they are incredibly prone to boilovers. Fermcap or whatever (several drops) really help with this, but you still need to keep an eye on things.

Tip #3: don't forget the yeast nutrient!

I tried the paper funnel over the hot, near boiling water, and ended up with a mess. Hoping there is some alternative tricks as I was hoping to avoid having to use a pot. I guess boiling water putting the DME in the flask and then adding it to the flask is ok, as that makes clean up on the pot basically drying it off. Any other ideas?

I also use the paper funnel method, ussually a magazine or piece of news paper.
To mix the dme I've been putting it on the stir plate before boil then move it to the heat when it looks mixed.
I just started using fermcap and am impressed. It really cut down the mess.

Brewham said:

I found it impossible to get the DME in the little neck of the flask without it clumping up. Now, I boil the water and DME in a pot on the stove, cool it in the sink and pour it into the sanitized flask using a funnel. Much easier.

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I do it this way ^^^, not because I couldn't get the DME in, but strictly speaking I don't trust cheap Chinese flasks and I would kill myself before my wife did if the flask broke on the new stove. I've done the clean up a stove boil over before and it is not a pretty site.

Even with a degree in Biology and a former job as an analytical chemist, I don't trust the flasks the HBS sell. Unless it is Pyrex, or another definite lab glass mfg. I just boil in a pot and pour through a small funnel right after flameout and then chill in the sink. No worries about boilovers either.

I pressure cook dme and water and store for future starters. Using the large Mason jars which make 1 liter. Next let the stored starter wort hit room temp and dump the yeast.

Before doing this, I would boil everything in a pot then transfer it over to the flask after it cools. Next dump the yeast and let the stirplate do its thing. Cover with foil.

Many ways to do it.

makomachine said:

I tried the paper funnel over the hot, near boiling water, and ended up with a mess.

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I put the correct weight of DME in the flask, then add water as per Mr. Malty to get to the correct volume. Put my hand over the top (a big enough bung would work) and shake the hell out of it to mix, then boil on the stove. Yeah, trying to funnel DME over hot water would suck!

What's the advantage of Erlenmeyer flasks over mason jars anyway?

+1 to Fermcap! I swear by the stuff. Using it in my boil also seems to reduce wicked blowoffs in fermentation as well. I've seen some posts saying this isn't true but in my experience, it does help.

jrnyenhuis said:

What's the advantage of Erlenmeyer flasks over mason jars anyway?

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I haven't seen a 6000 ml mason jar lately.

jrnyenhuis said:

What's the advantage of Erlenmeyer flasks over mason jars anyway?

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Size does matter. See post above. Largest Mason jar I have is a little less then 1 L.

Here's my process:
1. Put appropriate amount of water in flask and turn on heat.
2. Weigh out appropriate amount of DME and put in a medium sized mixing bowl. I also add yeast nutrient in the bowl.
3. When the water has heated up a bit, I get my oven glove, turn off heat, and pour about 1/3 of the water into the mixing bowl.
4. With a wire wisk, I blend the DME with the water. I also put a few drops of antifoam in.
5. Once DME fully incorporated, I pour the mixture back into flask (my mixing bowls have a pour spout, but a funnel is safest), bring up to boil.
6. Boil for 5 minutes, turn off heat and immediately slide the stir bar in.
7. Place sanitized foil over the opening.
8. Cool wort, pitch yeast, and place on stirplate.

I have tried several methods and last couple of times did the following successfully.
Measured amount of water into a saucepan on stovetop hotplate.
Erlenmeyer flask filled with hottest water from tap and allowed to sit waiting(to reduce temperature change shock later).
Start to heat the cold water in saucepan slowly and immediately add the DME and yeast nutrient to the saucepan while stirring with a kitchen whisk.
The DME dissolved before water gets very hot. When dissolved, tip hot water out of erlenmeyer flask into sink and replace it with the hot wort in the saucepan. Put starsan sprayed foil over the top of flask and boil for 15 mins.

When boil time complete take flask to sink and lower slowly into the hottest tap water you have. When flask had survived the temperature change (1 min) , drain sink and add cold water to level of erlenmyer wort. Replace cold water after 5 mins and add frozen cooler box gel/ice packs to the water. Monitor temperature of wort in flask. When target temp reached pitch the yeast.
I get paranoid about temperature shock on glassware even borosilicate and will keep doing it this way until some unforeseen disaster occurs.

Buy borosilicate (real pyrex not the new crap, but i digress) flask

Put on scale, tare, add amount of DME (Measure in kg. it's easier that way)
Add HOT water BY WEIGHT, not volume, my tap water is 150* most days.
Throw stir star in there.
add a big squirt of fermcap.

put the whole thing on the stove and boil it. Set the timer for 10 mins.

Fill sink with cold water. add a tray full of ice cubes.

Tear off a piece of foil from the roll and spray with starsan.

Once timer goes off, turn off heat, cover flask with sanitized foil. Wrap towel around the neck of the flask and move to the sink. Set timer for 5.

timer goes off, come back and swirl the flask to chill it some more. Add ice as needed.

once the flask is room temp (by hand) dry the flask and put on the stirrer.

Add yeast and bob's yer uncle. I usually only had half a white labs tube so I have a backup if needed. dry or wyeast I pitch the whole thing.

B

B

bad coffee said:

Buy borosilicate (real pyrex not the new crap, but i digress) flask

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Wonder if anyone beside me here has any feedback on Simax (Czech Republic) borosilicate flasks. I have two and have to say they were very cheap and have done the cold to hot , hot to cold move many times without a hitch. I give them a big thumbs up.

I have 'Kimax' and it's fine.

If your flask is not borosilicate, the first time you go directly from the stove to the ice bath you'll find out the hard way!

B

bad coffee said:

I have 'Kimax' and it's fine.

If your flask is not borosilicate, the first time you go directly from the stove to the ice bath you'll find out the hard way!

B

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Kimax is good old (expensive) USA stuff I think. I paid $6 for my 500ml and $16 for my 2000ml Czech Republic Simax Borosilicate Erlenmeyers here in Australia. I would not have the confidence you have to go straight from the stove top to ice bath. I try to change the temperature as smoothly as is possible in the time available. They would probably be ok and I am not worried about the dollars but hell the mess could be awesome.