List of PJ Electrical Diagrams

Williams 728
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Hey P-J,

So I understand the theory behind the contactor as a failsafe for the relay. That being said, why not use a dual relay? What are the odds of both sides failing open? And if they do just kill the power to the panel? I guess I don't see the need.
 
P-J said:
AD,

I struggled like hell today trying to come up wih a workable diagram for you. I think I have it worked out. The real problem was the sketchy info provided about the motor by the maker (vendor). I did not throw away any of my time today but spent about 6 hours trying to cypher the info they provided. Good grief-!

Take as look at this and see if it might help you.

motor-schematic-7.jpg


______________________________________________________________

The switch I used in the diagram is from Auber Instruments and is the SW3 (center off) unit with 4 added N/O modules added. (Total of 3 decks - 2 each)

If you plan on going this route and need more info - Please let me know..

Wishing you the absolute best.

P-J
Click to expand...

P-J,

I have parts ordered should arrive next week. Now I just have to figure out a cabinet.

My electrician buddy said he would give me a hand when I get down to wiring it, and he is pretty sure no blue smoke will come out if something isn't quite right. Which is a good thing because he doesn't have the tool to put the smoke back in once it escapes.

Of course he also advised I find some insulated underwear for when we turn it on.... and that I might not want to sleep in the house with it there.

As I said he is not happy with the bodine schematic and he used to work for them.

Thanks for the diagram, I will let you know the results.
 
Airplanedoc said:
P-J,

I have parts ordered should arrive next week. Now I just have to figure out a cabinet.

My electrician buddy said he would give me a hand when I get down to wiring it, and he is pretty sure no blue smoke will come out if something isn't quite right. Which is a good thing because he doesn't have the tool to put the smoke back in once it escapes.

Of course he also advised I find some insulated underwear for when we turn it on.... and that I might not want to sleep in the house with it there.

As I said he is not happy with the bodine schematic and he used to work for them.

Thanks for the diagram, I will let you know the results.
Click to expand...
AD,

Please refresh the diagram view. I overlooked one item in the sketchy info given about the motor. The "run capacitor"... I've updated the diagram and added it to the plan.

Thanks for understanding.

P-J
 
sandyeggoxj said:
Hey P-J,

So I understand the theory behind the contactor as a failsafe for the relay. That being said, why not use a dual relay? What are the odds of both sides failing open? And if they do just kill the power to the panel? I guess I don't see the need.
Click to expand...
When you say "relay" are you referring to the SSR? If so, using 2 of them still will not isolate and protect you from leakage current.

But if you want - do it your way. I choose not to "bet my life"

P-J
 
P-J said:
When you say "relay" are you referring to the SSR? If so, using 2 of them still will not isolate and protect you from leakage current.

But if you want - do it your way. I choose not to "bet my life"

P-J
Click to expand...

Geez man, Just asking questions here. In the future I will state "solid state relay" instead of relay to avoid any doubt in what I am referring to. I am sorry to be asking such elementary questions. I will take my inquiries somewhere else next time.
 
P-J said:
Please link a diagram and explain a little more about your concerns..

I'd be glad to help.

P-J
Click to expand...

Not sure if I am able to do a diagram at the moment. But my main concern is about the constant 110v running to the element. I assume that the element can not fire unless it has the full 220v running to it when the PID tells the SSR to send the other 110v leg. But can the constant 110V running to the element do any damage to it or are there any safety issues to worry about?

Hope that makes sense :drunk:
 
P-J said:
When you say "relay" are you referring to the SSR? If so, using 2 of them still will not isolate and protect you from leakage current.

But if you want - do it your way. I choose not to "bet my life"

P-J
Click to expand...

sandyeggoxj said:
Geez man, Just asking questions here. In the future I will state "solid state relay" instead of relay to avoid any doubt in what I am referring to. I am sorry to be asking such elementary questions. I will take my inquiries somewhere else next time.
Click to expand...

Don't see the need to take the comment wrong. He was stating a point and a safety concern. It's the internet don't get offended so quick. Relax and have a homebrew :)
 
celtic_dude said:
Not sure if I am able to do a diagram at the moment. But my main concern is about the constant 110v running to the element. I assume that the element can not fire unless it has the full 220v running to it when the PID tells the SSR to send the other 110v leg. But can the constant 110V running to the element do any damage to it or are there any safety issues to worry about?

Hope that makes sense :drunk:
Click to expand...

No safety issues if you incorporate the DPST, NO contactor. Switch it off, and you know both lines are off and your element has no hot lines to it. When you want to heat, turn your switch on to close the contactor circuits, and let the PID/SSR do its work. Always consider the element to be hot when your switch/contactor is set to ON. When the SSR is closed the element will fire, and you have a closed 240v circuit. When the SSR is open the element will not fire (leakage aside), but one of the lines is hot with 120v, which is still a good reason to consider it hot. Problem solved.
 
jeffmeh said:
No safety issues if you incorporate the DPST, NO contactor. Switch it off, and you know both lines are off and your element has no hot lines to it. When you want to heat, turn your switch on to close the contactor circuits, and let the PID/SSR do its work. Always consider the element to be hot when your switch/contactor is set to ON. When the SSR is closed the element will fire, and you have a closed 240v circuit. When the SSR is open the element will not fire (leakage aside), but one of the lines is hot with 120v, which is still a good reason to consider it hot. Problem solved.
Click to expand...

Makes Sense! :mug: Thanks So no harm to the elements then with 120v running.
 
I know this has been covered somewhere but im either finding it and not understanding it or something.

- I want to use one of the 30A Diagrams to build my panel. 1 PID, 2 Pumps, Estop, 2 Elements (1 at a time obviously)(5500W)

I need to put a 30A GFCI Breaker into my box and I have to run wire but Im confused if 10/4 Romex will work or not? 10guage is much cheaper then 8 and 6 for 40 and 50 amps respectively.

I may be able to pull it off if I buy the 10 gauge and use one of the 30 amp builds I just want to make sure.

The other question is if I use his 40a Diagram but power 4500W elements instead of 5500W elements would that work with 30A.

I like having 2 PID's and my thinking is that the less current drawn from the 4500W Element will allow current to be pulled by the extra PID controller and still be safe for 30A service.
 
Could any of these schematics be translated in single phase 230V version? I am looking for a controller for a 3kW element a switch for Mash/Boil (PID bypassed) and a wiring to protect me from electrocuting myself in case something goes wrong.
 
Hi,

Does anyone have a wiring diagram/advice to run a 30amp 1 pump BIAB setup with a BCS 462 to monitor recirculation, boil, knockout and control hot and cool fermentation chambers, and a keezer?

-Thanks
 
P-J said:
Yes it will. It is almost identical to the one offered by Auber Instruments.
Click to expand...


P-J,
My main goal is to control the temp in my HLT with a 5500w 240v heating element. I bought a 470k-2W Potentiometer with a 40A SSR. I also have a Packard C230B 2 Pole 30 Amp Contactor 120 Volt Coil and Amico Overload Protection 2P+N Earth Leakage Circuit Breaker AC 230V 32A. What is my best diagram of yours to follow to make my panel build a success?
Thanks for your advice.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew
 
SpottedDogBrewing said:
P-J,
My main goal is to control the temp in my HLT with a 5500w 240v heating element. I bought a 470k-2W Potentiometer with a 40A SSR. I also have a Packard C230B 2 Pole 30 Amp Contactor 120 Volt Coil and Amico Overload Protection 2P+N Earth Leakage Circuit Breaker AC 230V 32A. What is my best diagram of yours to follow to make my panel build a success?
Thanks for your advice.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure that I understand what you are trying to do.

How do you intend to control the HLT temperature using a Potentiometer and SSR? What about the temprature sensor?

Why not use a PID and temp probe to do that task?
 
P-J said:
I'm not sure that I understand what you are trying to do.



How do you intend to control the HLT temperature using a Potentiometer and SSR? What about the temprature sensor?



Why not use a PID and temp probe to do that task?
Click to expand...


I will monitor the temp by the dial thermometer on the HLT.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew
 
If I go with this diagram minus the pump and add this Amico Overload Protection 2P+N Earth Leakage Circuit Breaker AC 230V 32A would I still need to add the 1amp fuse?
ImageUploadedByHome Brew1395321797.783094.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew
 
This was the first that came up - shipping extortionate, am sure you'll find cheaper... searched for "wago fuse block" (takes standard 4mm fuses)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wago-281-623-Fuse-Terminal-Block-Pivotable-WOW-/320760068490


This is still showing in my purchase history. You could also search for "din breaker 2p" (2 pole) or "din breaker 1p" (use a breaker as a fuse)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DIN-Dail-2P...30-400VAC-25A-6000A-DZ47-63-C25-/321208312048

Talking about 1p breakers, just bought this little 1A baby breaker to use as a fuse in place of my wago fuses to power my aubers, indicators, fans, low power stuff
http://www.ebay.com/itm/FREE-SHIPPI...BREAKER-1A-DIN-RAIL-single-pole-/161173684637
 
BigFloppy said:
This is still showing in my purchase history. You could also search for "din breaker 2p" (2 pole) or "din breaker 1p" (use a breaker as a fuse)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/DIN-Dail-2P...30-400VAC-25A-6000A-DZ47-63-C25-/321208312048
Click to expand...


I bought a similar one of these. I was looking for some type of 1 amp panel fuse for the auberins controller. I would assume for protection of the unit. I have a box that screws shut, so to eliminate having to go into the box to change a fuse I would like to be able to change this fuse if it blows outside the box. Just wondering if there was a cheap one I can add to the outside.



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PJ first and foremost thank you for sharing your knowledge with us all absolutely amazing what you do for us. I'm wondering if you could/or have done any diagrams for 60amp panels? I am fairly certain I could put something together based off your other diagrams however dealing with electricity and liquid I would really appreciate any insight. If you would consider doing so I will post a list of what I would like to accomplish with the panel. Thank you.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew
 
Deece - Post what you're looking to do. The amperage change will only modify some of the components, unless you want something crazy - IE, what you want to do is going to drive the wiring diagram more than how much power you expect it to handel, and it's likely that a design similar to or identical to what you want has already been done, just with lower amperage components.
 
SpottedDogBrewing said:
I see contactors in some designs and not in others! What is the purpose of a contactor? Is it there only for the 110v pump plug?
Click to expand...

A contactor is an over-sized, heavy duty relay. It serves as a mechanical / physical break in the circuit. SSRs have a tendancy to leak voltage, fail in the closed position, and otherwise do whatever they want. So even though your PID may show that it's not triggering the SSR, it's still possible that the SSR is sending some current to the heating element. This can be problematic if you are cleaning your kettle, or even just from a dry-fire perspective. The contactor uses a small input voltage / amperage (you can get a variety of ratings) to close a terminal block that controls the main power source. This way you mount the contactor to your back plate and run all your heavy gauge wires to it, and then put a small switch on your panel door, and run small easy to manage wires to the contactor. Push the button on the panel, the contactor closes, the circuit is complete, and everything works. Push it again, the contactor loses the input voltage, it opens, and the circuit between your PID - SSR - Heating Element is broken and no power will go to the element.

It's basically a substitute for a big 30 amp rated switch mounted to the front of the panel - easier wire runs, better looking switches, and it keeps all the heavy gauge wire to the back of the panel and not on the front.

-Kevin
 
BadNewsBrewery said:
A contactor is an over-sized, heavy duty relay. It serves as a mechanical / physical break in the circuit. SSRs have a tendancy to leak voltage, fail in the closed position, and otherwise do whatever they want. So even though your PID may show that it's not triggering the SSR, it's still possible that the SSR is sending some current to the heating element. This can be problematic if you are cleaning your kettle, or even just from a dry-fire perspective. The contactor uses a small input voltage / amperage (you can get a variety of ratings) to close a terminal block that controls the main power source. This way you mount the contactor to your back plate and run all your heavy gauge wires to it, and then put a small switch on your panel door, and run small easy to manage wires to the contactor. Push the button on the panel, the contactor closes, the circuit is complete, and everything works. Push it again, the contactor loses the input voltage, it opens, and the circuit between your PID - SSR - Heating Element is broken and no power will go to the element.



It's basically a substitute for a big 30 amp rated switch mounted to the front of the panel - easier wire runs, better looking switches, and it keeps all the heavy gauge wire to the back of the panel and not on the front.



-Kevin
Click to expand...

So.. If I have a 30amp switch mounted to the front of my panel this contactor is not needed?
Thanks for the full dummy'd down description:)



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