How hard is it to mini-mash...possibly my third brew

My first brew is an extract brew(Octoberfest) and my second will be the same(APA). Both have steeping grains. What is the difference and difficulty of a mini-mash recipe? I love homebrewing and would like to increase my ability. Thanks RR

It's not nearly as difficult as it seems at first.

The simplest all-grain / mini-mash instructions I've ever seen are here..
http://cruisenews.net/brewing/infusion/page1.php

This page was what convinced me that I didn't need this to go all grain ( No offense to MonsterMash intended, I'm just jealous ).

I actually just did my first partial mash, a couple of weeks ago with a doppelbock. It is very easy. The only additional equipment you need is a cooler, and you probably could work around that. I will also take this oppurtunity to get on my extract soapbox, as a new brewer don't worry about diving into all grain, you can make many excellent beers using extracts and steeped grains.

Give it a shot -- it isn't hard at all -- just a few more details to keep track of. Plus, if you enjoy it, then you are a big step closer to all-grain brewing. The mechanics of partial-mashes/mini-mashes are very similar to all-grain brewing techniques.

Here are a couple of articles that I found really helpful (in addition to the one previously posted):

http://***********/feature/1536.html
http://byo.com/feature/353.html

Let us know how you made out!

I did a mini mash on my 3rd brew, (transferring to 2ndary on sunday) and its not really all that hard, it only takes about an hour longer than a normal extract brew with steeping.

Keep in mind that mini-mashing is different from steeping. I didn't realize this myself until recently. If you by a kit with grains that you put in 170 degree water for 30 minutes, all you are doing is steeping those grains to get flavor out. A true mini-mash involves actually mashing a portion of the grains (as opposed to using all extract) to gain flavors. it gives extract brewers a bit more control over the grains without going all-grain. I'm sure some others can give you much better advice. I am by no means an expert at this, but keep in mind that steeping is not the same as mini-mashing.

You can actually do minimashes without having to make a mash tun and lauter tun (although those things make it a lot easier) and just use a bunch of large pots and an oven. Here is how Homer does it:

Take the largest pot you have (your brewing pot), preferably 5 gallons or larger (mine is 6). Add up to 5 pounds of cracked base malts (pale 2-row, etc.) and your specialty malts inside a big nylon mesh bag. Add 165 degree strike water at a ratio of 1 or 2 quarts of water per pound of grain which should hit about 152 (or thereabouts). Put a thermometer in your oven and have it prewarmed to about 160 degrees. Pop the pot in and keep the oven temp as stable as you can at about 155 (or what ever). Wait one hour. Stir occasionally to distribute heat evenly. Pull the bag of grains out of your brew pot leaving behind the wort. Transfer the bag of grains to another waiting pot of water containing a couple of gallons at about 170 degrees. Steep (sparge?) it in there about 10 minutes and then add sparge to your main boil. Give grain to the deer and birds. Add dried malt extract to bring up the gravity to your recipe and go Homer go!

Not nearly as easy as using a cooler with manifolds etc. and sparge buckets, but a hell of lot simpler, cheaper and it works too. As good a method? Probably not but it really can approximate AG brews using extract. A little maltdextrin powder won't hurt either.

As treehouse says, the key is the Very Large Grain Bag. I have a cool/mash tun, but for mini-mashes, I'll use the VLGB in the cooler. I'll open the bag and stir the grain while it is in the sparge water.

I have a weird old electric oven that is wide, but not too tall and a large enough pot won't fit.

Do the minimash! It can be done with no extra equipment than you'd use to steep grains, all the above links will gove you all th info you need. In my opinion, if you are even thinking you *might* want to some day go to All Grain, minimash is a great intermediate step.

meh...


just go all grain if you have the space. And maybe keep some DME around just in case you don't reach your OG the first time. But AG is just as easy as a PM.

I used the more-beer mini-mash bucket and one of there kits and loved it!!

http://morebeer.com/browse.html?category_id=1053&keyword=&x=1&y=1

I did the oatmeal stout PM and going into the secodary it tasted good...for very green beer!

Very easy.. just follow the directions that come with! the bucket serves as the Mash Lauter Tun and rap it in a blanket!
good luck

Chimone said:

meh...

But AG is just as easy as a PM.

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Agreed. AG might even be easier IF you have the space and the equipment. A PM is a compromise and like all compromises, PMs have their drawbacks. That being said, I do get near to 70% efficiencies using PMs. The big disadvantages of PMs that I can think of are:

Don't get full boil volumes and then you have hop utilization issues, hot break issues, etc. etc., etc...
Difficult to hit and hold target mash temperatures
Can be wasteful due to inefficient sparge
Cloudy worts because of no filtration through a grain bed (don't forget the Irish Moss!)
Difficult to reproduce recipes due to variations in mashes
More expensive costs per bottle

I'm sure there are others. But I can make a PM beer that will stand up to any AG brew and frequently even are better (IMHO). There are still other parameters in making good beer other than going AG. Good yeast, good temperatures, good hops, good recipes, good sanitation...etc. etc. Just doing an AG homebrew won't guarantee you great beer. But it sure do help...

treehouse said:

Agreed. AG might even be easier IF you have the space and the equipment. A PM is a compromise and like all compromises, PMs have their drawbacks. That being said, I do get near to 70% efficiencies using PMs. The big disadvantages of PMs that I can think of are:

Don't get full boil volumes and then you have hop utilization issues, hot break issues, etc. etc., etc...
Difficult to hit and hold target mash temperatures
Can be wasteful due to inefficient sparge
Cloudy worts because of no filtration through a grain bed (don't forget the Irish Moss!)
Difficult to reproduce recipes due to variations in mashes
More expensive costs per bottle

I'm sure there are others. But I can make a PM beer that will stand up to any AG brew and frequently even are better (IMHO). There are still other parameters in making good beer other than going AG. Good yeast, good temperatures, good hops, good recipes, good sanitation...etc. etc. Just doing an AG homebrew won't guarantee you great beer. But it sure do help...

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treehouse, i tend to disagree with you across the board. first off, partial mashing and full boils are compatable (if you have a big enough kettle), but even partial boils are not an issue if you compensate for the different hop utilization levels. Most all PM kits take this into account, so that concern is negated off the bat.

If you are AG'ing with anything other than insulated coolers, I think temperature control is exactly the same with a PM. I used to mash on the stove for PM's, and keeping temperature constant was as simple are pulling the grain bag out and cranking the gas.

I always got very good efficiency by 'ladel sparging' through the grain bag in a colander. Alyways got good enough #'s, and regardless you will be adding extract after the sparge so there is noithing to worry about if your efficiency is lower than a good AG setup. That's the beautiful check of doing partials, the extract is always there as a fallback. Also, if you sparge it carefully there is little concern w/ clarity (again, you are adding extract which tends to add cloudiness itself, so this is no concern again).

Regarding them being difficult to reporduce due to the 'variation in mashes' wouldn't this be inherently MORE of a factor in AG batches, hence making PM's more easy to reproduce?

Lastly, PM's usually fal right between extract and AG as far as cost goes. It's only logical.

I tend to agree with you last paragraph, it is totally possible to make a great PM beer (though that claim tends to contradict you previous points!). There is much more to it than simple process, and there have been bad to amazing PM's and AG's made.

Hope it doesn't come across as an attack, I just couldn't disagree more with the mentioned points.

Thanks Gruntingfrog. Great link. Its nice to see pictures instead of text only. I'm going to start looking for the necessary equipment to try AG.

Fiery Sword said:

Hope it doesn't come across as an attack, I just couldn't disagree more with the mentioned points.

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Not at all do I take that as an attack and your points are all well taken. I pretty much just ripped that post out and pointed out what I thought were some disadvantages to PMs off the top of my head even though I do PMs. However, let me clarify a couple of things. Number 1:

first off, partial mashing and full boils are compatable (if you have a big enough kettle),

If you had a big enough kettle, you would proably be doing AG anyway. It's an equipment question and that is why people do partail mashes. Equipment size.

Regarding them being difficult to reporduce due to the 'variation in mashes' wouldn't this be inherently MORE of a factor in AG batches, hence making PM's more easy to reproduce?

My point was that temperature is harder to control and thus more variation using an oven and pot. I think that using a cooler and AG setup, temp is more constant and thus more reproducable. However, variation can good!

I tend to agree with you last paragraph, it is totally possible to make a great PM beer (though that claim tends to contradict you previous points!).

I hate it when I contradict myself...

Thanks for the great links gruntingfrog & FlyGuy. PM certainly looks feasible. That being said I think I think a few more extract batches(mjm) will help me get my basic techniques more established. My first batch was a thrilling ride through the wilds of Chaos!!! My Dad & little brother are coming over tomorrow when I brew batch #2(APA). My first batch, Octoberfest is 2 weeks old in the bottle. RDWAHAHB sounds like a great idea!! Thanks again all. RR