a$$ awful efficiency

So, I'll save you the gory details, but my first AG i got 62% efficiency. I just finished my second, and I got 55% efficiency. I believe the problem is my temperatures. I hit my mash a little low, 149. It took about 20 minutes to boil enough water to raise the temperature to 154, and I held it there for another 60 minutes. Double batch sparge. First sparge I nailed 168. Second sparge was low, 160. Could my mash and sparge temps be a big issue?

Also, the crush is questionable. I ordered from Northern Brewer. Does anyone have experience with them? Good crush, bad crush.

PH was 5.4. I didn't do an iodine test, but I assumed after 80 minutes it would be pretty well converted. Any other thoughts on what I could improve on? I'm pretty discouraged. Especially since all my bottles are full, I've got two batches now fermenting, so it will be awhile before I get to try again.

Blargh

I've done 3 AG's from NB and I've been getting 78%. Crush seems ok to me. Not sure what to tell you.

Work on hitting your temps closer and then make sure you drain off your liquid slowly to allow more sugars to leach out of the grains.

How much water did you need that it took 20 min to boil it up? How did this addition affect the volumes of your batch sparges? If you had to significantly reduce your batch sparge volumes, that will affect efficiency as well.

If your doing two batch sparge's of around 2 to 2.5 gal, you want the water to be around 185F to 190F. I'm assuming that when you 168 and 160 your talking about the bed temperature. Test for conversion, take gravity readings of each extraction to ensure your getting what you should be. Stir very well after adding the sparge water, then wait 10-15 minutes to let diffusion work, then drain. Then post you volumes and gravity.

Make sure your thermos are calibrated as well! That screwed me a few batches until I got a new one that was accurate.

post recipe. i'd liek to see the grain bill mostly. perhaps you were too heavy on malts that cannot convert themselves.

If your grain is from NB, I'm gonna go with the crush. Last batch of grain I ordered had a HORRIBLE crush. I'm guessing 80% or more of the kernels were completely intact and not crushed.

To their credit, they gave me a gift certificate equal to the value of the grain I bought when I complained.

Hey man, I had a 50% eff. last brew on my IPA. Luckily it had a high enough OG to begin with that the sh*t efficiency just made it a lighter beer and it will be fine. Ive never ordered from NB, only AHS. I would say though that your problem is the crush, that was mine on the 50% IPA. My LHBS grain mill sucks donkey dick. When I have a friend crush my grain or when I run it through a mill twice I get great efficiency. I can almost always trace the bad from a bad crush. I have since become a crush nazi, however, and I powderize everything.

p4ck37p1mp said:

Make sure your thermos are calibrated as well! That screwed me a few batches until I got a new one that was accurate.

Click to expand...

+1 to thermometers

If the iodine test said you where converted then I have to assume your volumes are off. how much wort do you end up with including left in boil kettle.

Ok, lots of interest here, and I appreciate the help.

Here's the recipe.
11.5 pounds crisp marris otter
1 pound simpsons crystal
.25 pounds sympsons chocolate

It's the Northern Brewer Winter Warmer kit.
I believe my thermometer is calibrated correctly. It's brand new, reads boiling at 212.

I mashed with 4 gallons (1.25 quarts per pound rounded up just a bit) and sparged 2 gallons twice. I ended up with 6.5 gallons. I could have, and probably should have, drawn off more and boiled longer.

I drew off the mash and sparges as fast as my MLT would do it. I didn't let the sparges sit very long, but I stirred them for a minute or two pretty vigourosly, then drew off. Next time I'll take gravity readings of each runoff and see what that does for me, as well as doing an iodine test.

Thanks again for all the help.

BugleBrew said:

So, I'll save you the gory details, but my first AG i got 62% efficiency. I just finished my second, and I got 55% efficiency. I believe the problem is my temperatures. I hit my mash a little low, 149. It took about 20 minutes to boil enough water to raise the temperature to 154, and I held it there for another 60 minutes. Double batch sparge....

Click to expand...

ok so i just did my first Hefe brew 2 days ago and my initial temp (aiming for 153) anded up at 144 or so. It took a while and i never quite got it up to 153 and my efficiency was terrible......so unless i screwed something up earlier in the process, temp makes a huge deal when it comes to efficienty. Mine sucked also

scinerd3000 said:

ok so i just did my first Hefe brew 2 days ago and my initial temp (aiming for 153) anded up at 144 or so. It took a while and i never quite got it up to 153 and my efficiency was terrible......so unless i screwed something up earlier in the process, temp makes a huge deal when it comes to efficienty. Mine sucked also

Click to expand...

Wheat eff. sucks unless you do a protein rest or cereal mash. You have to plan for 5-10 points lower than usual. At 144 it takes a lot longer for full conversion. If you didn't do a mashout and didn' have 185-190 sparge water, you probably sparged too cool.

My usual response to these eff. threads now is to go search HBT for "mash efficiency" and figure out your mash eff. If you get 95% mash efficiency, which everyone should be able to achieve, a poorly executed batch sparge by a blind horse in a back alley should get you over 70% brewhouse efficiency.

EDIT: Here's the mash eff. thread.

EamusCatuli said:

Hey man, I had a 50% eff. last brew on my IPA. Luckily it had a high enough OG to begin with that the sh*t efficiency just made it a lighter beer and it will be fine. Ive never ordered from NB, only AHS. I would say though that your problem is the crush, that was mine on the 50% IPA. My LHBS grain mill sucks donkey dick. When I have a friend crush my grain or when I run it through a mill twice I get great efficiency. I can almost always trace the bad from a bad crush. I have since become a crush nazi, however, and I powderize everything.

Click to expand...

Okay, well that saves me the trouble of asking how good the crush is at Friar Tuck! Guess I'll buy that MaltMill after all.

Saccharomyces said:

Wheat eff. sucks unless you do a protein rest or cereal mash. You have to plan for 5-10 points lower than usual. At 144 it takes a lot longer for full conversion. If you didn't do a mashout and didn' have 185-190 sparge water, you probably sparged too cool.

My usual response to these eff. threads now is to go search HBT for "mash efficiency" and figure out your mash eff. If you get 95% mash efficiency, which everyone should be able to achieve, a poorly executed batch sparge by a blind horse in a back alley should get you over 70% brewhouse efficiency.

EDIT: Here's the mash eff. thread.

Click to expand...

figures.........i should have researched more before my first wheat. no protein rest and my temps were off....oh well- theres always next time