RIS recipe critiques

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BA_from_GA

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Gonna do a perle single-hopped RIS next week... had this recipe roughly figured out for a few months, but want to offer it up for criticisms. the only other AG stout i've done came out very astringent and thin-boddied. ( due to too high % of roasted grains, and my mash temp dropping to the mid 140's)


here's what i've got

77% 2-row pale malt 16 lbs
5% black barley 1 lb
4% chocolate malt 12 oz
3% special b malt 10 oz
2% black pattent 6 oz
2% 120L 8 oz.
7% molasses (1/2 black strap, 1/2 light) somewhere around the 1-1.5 lb range.

again, all GR perle hops ( 8.1%aa)
1.5 oz @ 90 min
1.5 oz @ 30 min
1 oz @ 15 min

1 tsp gypsum in the mash (not sure about the quantity of this, but read it's good to use w/ lots of dark grains to keep the ph up)
1 whirl floc tab @ 15 min


ok, have at it...
 
You recipe is money, tons of dark cystal (special B and C120) work great in beers like this.......

The only thing I would do, but that's just me is ditch the 120, and go with all special B......it's a little darker, fruitery and I think will give the stout that added depth....maybe a touch of victory or aromatic as well....8 oz or so.....

I would increase my IBU as well on a beer this big, maybe add another 1.5 oz at 60 and another 1 oz at 5...but that's just me. My RIS goes over 100 IBU
 
I'd be careful with the black patent. black patent is used in very small quantities to add color (a couple of oz in a 5 gallon batch). If you add too much, it adds more color, but it also adds a crappy acidic and ashen taste to the beer.

In short.... you never really want to actually TASTE black patent in a beer.... just SEE it.
 
I'd be careful with the black patent. black patent is used in very small quantities to add color (a couple of oz in a 5 gallon batch). If you add too much, it adds more color, but it also adds a crappy acidic and ashen taste to the beer.

In short.... you never really want to actually TASTE black patent in a beer.... just SEE it.

Whoa! My bad....I thought it roasted barley, it's black barley!!

Heck I would sub roasted barley for the black barley, then you're in business! Here is the grainbill for my RIS, tastes great after 3 months in secondary. For what it's worth, I mashed at 156, pacman brought her from 1.095, down to 1.018. Perfect. I hopped it with 100 IBU of chinook, cascade and willamete with tons of late additions.

---- Briess 2 Row Caramel 120 0.375 lb
---- Crisp Pale Chocolate Malt 0.5 lb
---- Briess 2-Row Brewer's Malt 17 lb
---- Simpsons Dark Crystal (C150) 0.375 lb
---- Crisp Chocolate Malt 0.375 lb
---- Caramel Munich 0.375 lb
---- Special B 1 lb
---- Briess Roasted Barley 1.25 lb
 
I'd be careful with the black patent. black patent is used in very small quantities to add color (a couple of oz in a 5 gallon batch). If you add too much, it adds more color, but it also adds a crappy acidic and ashen taste to the beer.

In short.... you never really want to actually TASTE black patent in a beer.... just SEE it.

Yeah. You could consider Carafa Special II or III (or Sinamar extract) to get more color without the black patent taste.
 
Whoa! My bad....I thought it roasted barley, it's black barley!!

Heck I would sub roasted barley for the black barley, then you in business!

I wasn't talking about the black barley. I was talking about the specific mention of black patent.

77% 2-row pale malt 16 lbs
5% black barley 1 lb
4% chocolate malt 12 oz
3% special b malt 10 oz
2% black pattent 6 oz
2% 120L 8 oz.
7% molasses (1/2 black strap, 1/2 light) somewhere around the 1-1.5 lb range.

Actually... I don't even know what black barley is. Going to need to look at one up.
 
I looked it up. Sounds like it is roasted barley, just roasted a little more than usual.

I think the pound of that is *probably* ok. I'd still be concerned about the black patent.

This thing is already going to be as black as sin, so I don't think the SRMs added by the patent will make any difference, but the flavor you might get could be something you don't like.
 
Gypsum will lower pH. You need chalk (probably, depending on your water), but I would probably leave the gypsum in there too for the sulfate.
 
I'm going to go against the grain and state that I do enjoy a fair amount of black patent in a stout. Sure, yes, it depends upon what kind of flavor you're going for, but if you know what to expect using a large amount of it, don't hold back. I used 8oz in a 3 gallon batch once before (along with 6oz of roasted barley, if memory serves) and loved the results.

To my tastes, it seems either a very small (<2oz) amount of black patent can be good, for color and a little hint of flavor, as can a large amount, say >8oz, where it becomes a major player in the flavor profile of the beer, as a pleasant roasty, ashy, slightly bitter one. Anything in the middle seems too weak to set up a good flavor structure but strong enough to drown out other elements, and isn't so good. That's my take, anyway.
 
well thanks so far....

the wife is a big stout fan, as well as a fan of the dark fruits flavors (special b), but not the overly bitter/harsh stouts (though i enjoy them).

i think i'll up the IBUs some to just under 100, as well as up the special b and drop the 120L. I think i'll also try this one with no black patent. I do have some aromatic so i may end up tossing in .5 lb of that.

as per teh chalk... do you mean, like chalk board chalk? what purpose does it send (don't have a great understanding of mash pH... i usually don't use any additives at all, just tap water)

also, what are thoughts on the molasses. I know the lighter will ferment out more, while the black strap will add more residual flavor/sweetness, so i'm trying to balance their contribution, getting some flavor, and some body boost and maybe alcohol.

thanks for the input so far. I'd done a fair amount of reading on the style and looked at different recipes as well, so i'm glad i was able to come up with something pretty close to fitting what i was shooting for.
 
Chalkboard chalk is apparently usually gypsum. You want calcium carbonate, to raise pH/provide residual alkalinity, unless your water is high enough in carbonate already.

Don't listen to me, though. I've never even brewed a stout.*
 
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