Stalled Stout

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kennywd

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I have a Chocolate Stout that was in Primary for 7 Days, OG was 1.061 and after Secondary and the for 2 weeks its stayed at 1.031. I tried to re-pitch Champagne yeast, but have no idea if this will help or not. I don't really know the signs if its working should i see the same effects as primary fermentation? This is my second brew and first higher gravity brew. Any input would be great. Short form its been in primary for a week and secondary for 2 weeks and no gravity change. Thank you for who ever reads this. I am sure next time I will try a yeast Starter cause that is were I believe I went wrong.

TYPE: Extract

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.00 gal
Boil Size: 4.01 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.061 SG
Estimated Color: 39.4 SRM
Estimated IBU: 5.3 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
2 lbs 7.2 oz Dark Dry Extract (17.5 SRM) Dry Extract 5 27.4 %
5 lbs 6.2 oz Dark Liquid Extract (17.5 SRM) Extract 4 60.2 %
14.5 oz Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM) Grain 1 10.1 %
0.5 oz Barley, Flaked (1.7 SRM) Grain 3 0.0 %
3.2 oz Oats, Steal Cut (1.0 SRM) Grain 2 2.2 %
0.43 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 6 5.3 IBUs
0.50 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] - Aroma Steep 10.0 min Hop 7 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg Irish Ale (Wyeast Labs #1084) [125.00 ml Yeast 8 -
 
Yeah, I always say this to new brewers, before getting into high gravity learn how to wrangle yeast or you will have a bad day. As you noted you underpitched, a starter in the ballpark of 1.5 liters is what you would want for that (off the top of my head). Next, you removed the beer from the yeast way too soon. Many seasoned homebrewers have moved away from secondaries except for certain cases (fruiting, bulk aging for months on end, lambics) so leaving the beer on the yeast would have helped push down the gravity further. You also want to consider your temp, you want stability or you can crash out your yeast. Proper wort oxygenation and quality yeast nutrients will also be a big help. Finally, make sure you are using fresh yeast, if that smack pack was 3 months old you really are fighting an uphill battle without a starter and proper yeast care.
 
Thank you for the speedy reply. So basically your saying you would have left your beer on primary for how long normally? The Entire time or just part of the time? My Temperature is normally at a constant 68 degs via swamp cooling and water bath, so I know that's good. I thought I should had done a yeast starter like you said..next time I know. Any ideas one what I can do to save this brew?
 
I leave my ales, or brews with ale yeast, in primary until they're done. NO racking to another vessel after a week just because some nut (or the stinking kit sheet) said to. IME, leaving the brew in primary, on the yeast cake, has resulted in great brews. Of course, moving to all grain didn't hurt either. Especially since I now control the mash temp, and the FG destination of the wort. Not the company that produced the extract.

Search a bit and you'll see a good number of threads where people, brewing with extract, cannot get below 1.020 for the FG, no matter what the recipe should have hit.

If champagne yeast doesn't do anything to bring down the SG closer to your goal, then I would say it's done. Means that all the sugars that the yeast could consume, has been converted into alcohol, and you're not going to get anything more from the wort.

BTW, I have used Wyeast 1084, and it does really well, normally. Leaving the wort on it for a solid month wouldn't have done any harm. I had a brew sit on it for 6 weeks, with zero ill effects. IMO, you can safely go a couple of months, or longer (there are enough people that have left the brew in primary for 6+ months here) without issue. Of course, maintaining temps during the important times matters... 68F is fine for 1084 too, so I don't think that has anything to do with the issue here.
 
Like Golddiggie said, nothing much you can do that you haven't done already. Let the champagne yeast try to do what its going to do. The good thing though is now you know that secondary bucket is mostly useless so you can go ahead and use it for a primary to have two brews fermenting at the same time.
 
Champagne yeast won't do much to help attenuate a stuck beer. Wine yeast has been selected to eat fruit sugars not maltose, and the simple sugars were knocked out by the 1084 right off the bat. What champagne yeast is good for is bottle conditioning because of its neutral flavor and alcohol tolerance. If you're wanting to salvage this brew you should make up a starter of something like 1056, wlp099, or pacman if you can find it. Pitch that while it's at high krausen. Adding yeast mid ferment is pretty stressful so you'll want to make sure the starter's really rocking when you dump it in. Or you could always jump over to the wild side and toss in some brett.
 
Well thanks for all the help I will wait for any sign of the yeast working. Since I pitched will it go though same type of fermentation as primary? Either way I was going to bottle in about a week, but figured I should wait an extra week. As far as priming goes be aide of the higher gravity will that change the amount of priming sugars. I would guess no, but asking to not screw anything else up.

Also I hate asking newbie questions, but sometime finding this information is hard to find for a specific issue. Again thanks.
 
Yeah, I'm going to really have to agree with Pohldogg on this one, champagne is really a hope and a prayer and won't give you the character you were hoping for.
 
OK so here is the thing, I think I will just cut my losses and go ahead and bottle on the schedule date I had this Sat. Thing is because of our only Brew shop being closed most of the week and even if I shipped in supplies a starter wont be ready.. As you can figure the champagne yeast didn't save me.

My question is will it be a bad idea to bottle? Its been sitting 4 weeks total. Gravity was at 1.031 I will check again on bottling date but I doubt I will have much change. I only had slight fermentation (barely any from what I could tell).

Last thing I want is Bottles blowing up in my face. So this will prolly be the last question on this brew. I will just learn from what not to do.. and do what I need for next time.
 
I have a Chocolate Stout that was in Primary for 7 Days, OG was 1.061 and after Secondary and the for 2 weeks its stayed at 1.031. I tried to re-pitch Champagne yeast, but have no idea if this will help or not. I don't really know the signs if its working should i see the same effects as primary fermentation? This is my second brew and first higher gravity brew. Any input would be great. Short form its been in primary for a week and secondary for 2 weeks and no gravity change. Thank you for who ever reads this. I am sure next time I will try a yeast Starter cause that is were I believe I went wrong.

TYPE: Extract

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.00 gal
Boil Size: 4.01 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.061 SG
Estimated Color: 39.4 SRM
Estimated IBU: 5.3 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
2 lbs 7.2 oz Dark Dry Extract (17.5 SRM) Dry Extract 5 27.4 %
5 lbs 6.2 oz Dark Liquid Extract (17.5 SRM) Extract 4 60.2 %
14.5 oz Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM) Grain 1 10.1 %
0.5 oz Barley, Flaked (1.7 SRM) Grain 3 0.0 %
3.2 oz Oats, Steal Cut (1.0 SRM) Grain 2 2.2 %
0.43 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 6 5.3 IBUs
0.50 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] - Aroma Steep 10.0 min Hop 7 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg Irish Ale (Wyeast Labs #1084) [125.00 ml Yeast 8 -

I made a double chocolate coffee stout (extract) using dry yeast S04. OG was about 70 and it stuck after 3 weeks at 36. I too tried the Champagne yeast and it did little. It went down to 34. Bottled it a week later and it should be ready this Sat after 3 weeks at 70*.
Next time I'll use an AG BIAB set up.

Do let us know the final outcome.
 
I'd highly suggest to not bottle that if it doesnt come down any further. letting it sit longer til you have more yeast to pitch in to finish it off wont hurt it. you should be getting down to at least 1.024 (more likely 1.018-1.021)
 
Here is what I would do;

1. Make a starter as earlier posts have said.
2. Here is the tricky part and you have two choices (I have done both), before removing the lid or stopper shake your bucket or carboy or (with a sanitized spoon) gently stir the wort.
3. Pitch said starter.
4. Wait and see.

This has happened to me before, so you can improve your beer.
 
Search a bit and you'll see a good number of threads where people, brewing with extract, cannot get below 1.020 for the FG, no matter what the recipe should have hit.

I knew this would come up. It is total BS blaming it on the extract. With proper technique there is absolutely no reason for an extract brew not to finish where it should. Just saying that it is the extract curse does not help. The reason for not finishing where it should is more likely, underpitching, not enough aeration, wrong temp for the yeast, or racking to a secondary too soon, or someyhing else. Not some strange 1.020 curse.

I can get an extract brew to finish where I expect it to every time. I have had extracts go as low as 1.004.
 
Well it seems every one is saying wait and re-pitch. So I will keep everyone informed on what happens next.
 
IME/IMO, being patient with a brew cures/fixes most issues... Give it more time and it could slowly creep down to the FG you expected... Although, with all that extract, you might be looking at where it will be forever.

Time will reveal all.
 
Well we started the yeast starter Friday evening. And should pitch when ready. I appreciate every ones help. Will keep informed on the next stage of what's happening.
 
that starter should be ready to go in by now if you made it friday. you want to pitch it at krausen while the yeast are still active since they're going into a harsh environment.
 
I knew this would come up. It is total BS blaming it on the extract. With proper technique there is absolutely no reason for an extract brew not to finish where it should. Just saying that it is the extract curse does not help. The reason for not finishing where it should is more likely, underpitching, not enough aeration, wrong temp for the yeast, or racking to a secondary too soon, or someyhing else. Not some strange 1.020 curse.

I can get an extract brew to finish where I expect it to every time. I have had extracts go as low as 1.004.

Agreed - I've thus far had one extract beer I _thought_ was stuck at 1.020. Turned out, all I need to do was wait another week, and it fermented out to exactly where I expected. I don't subscribe to the theory that extracts, by their nature, get stuck like that.
 
dcp27 wish I had noticed your message faster.. I waited till yeast dropped decanted the beer and dumped the slurry. Oh well I just learned how to make a yeast starter and as far as I am concerned I am just learning alot from this experience. :ban:
 
Well we waited two weeks and had zero change even after adding in a yeast starter. We bottled because we needed the fermenter. I am keeping a eye on the bottle. Will open one up every few days to check carb. If worst a case scenario I will uncap and recap and or just have a party. We mini kegged also it has a release valve on top so I can easily release the co2. I will just learns from this and make sure to not do again. Well aat least try. If you guys have any other input that would be appreciated and again thanks for your help.
 
I would put the entire batch of bottles into closed plastic bins while they carbonate/bottle condition. Let them go at least 3-4 weeks before checking on them. Well, you can check to see if any have gone uni-bomber on you.

To date, I've only had one bottle that popped it's seal while carbonating. It was right as a heat wave was starting. Of the entire batch of bottles, it was just one. Since I use the swing-top/Grolsch style bottles, it didn't go all jihad on me, just lifted the top enough to release and started to foam. I quickly located the offending bottle and got it to the sink before any foam hit the box inside. I sealed it up again (really easy) and set it aside. I chilled it down later, but it was NFG. A simple smell of it told me that. I pulled another chilled bottle from the fridge and it was great (so the batch was really good).

IMO as long as you learn from your errors/missteps, it's all good. I will also say that once you go all grain, the days of wondering why a batch isn't fermenting as low as you thought pretty much evaporate. I will also reinforce not racking to secondary after a week, or even three/four, just because. ONLY do so when you're going to AGE a brew on something where it makes absolute sense to get it into another vessel.

I bottled a batch on Sunday that was in primary for 7 weeks... The hydrometer sample tasted great, and the chilled, carbonated version should be even better. I can barely wait to have a glass. :D
 
I appreciate it. Thanks for the tip on a closed plastic bin. I hadn't done that yet. I figured I should wait 3 to 4 weeks, but I don't mind wasting a bottle to taste. I will inform of the finished product in a few weeks.
 
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