When to rack into secondary?

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Fadeux

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I have an Irish Red Ale in primary that I did on friday night, the airlock has been bubbling like crazy, but has really slown down. the instructions say 5-7 days before racking to secondary, would it be crazy to rack it now?
 
What's the purpose of the secondary for this beer? If it is simply to clear the beer, I would let primary fermentation complete first. Take a couple of SG readings several days apart. When the SG is stable, rack to secondary.

In reality, a lot of folks skip the secondary altogether, despite what a recipe might call for.
 
Not another one. Ok, if you had done any research AT ALL on this forum, this probably the MOST discussed topic on this board. At least 95% of the people here say do not rack to secondary, just leave it in the primary for 3 weeks, then bottle it.
 
Not another one. Ok, if you had done any research AT ALL on this forum, this probably the MOST discussed topic on this board. At least 95% of the people here say do not rack to secondary, just leave it in the primary for 3 weeks, then bottle it.

+1 million....
I would only rack to secondary if adding fruit or some type of specialty recipe. In fact, I can't remember the last time I did.
There are those who love the pristine, uncloudy beer but me, I just want it to taste good. If it's a bit cloudy, I could care less. However, it's your beer, so do with it what you want.
3 weeks in the primary almost always shows my beer ready to bottle. No explosions in over a decade.
 
Jesus shaneco take it easy. That's why its called beginners forum. You're supposed to help these guys not criticize. As far a a secondary I only use it for dry hopping and long bulk aging. If you are not doing any of these , three weeks on the primary should be fine. Check your gravity a few times. If it is the same then its done.
 
This is the first I am hearing of skipping the secondary.

It's mentioned all the time on these forums, at least that's what I am finding from my scavenging.

You will get 100 different answers and since I've been brewing for just a couple of months I suspect mine is way down the pecking order....but I use just a primary. I am currently fermenting a brew that says to rack to a secondary and my LHBS owner agreed it was the correct thing to do, and he also told me to pitch in the champagne yeast at that time too i.e., after 7 days rather than 3 weeks like the recipe (Thomas Hardy's Ale - Clone Brews 2nd edition) says.
 
95% is pretty high, really. I will admit that most will agree that secondaries are not necessary, but quite a few of us still use them for various reasons.

If you are not adding fruit, wood chips, or bulk aging a big beer, a secondary is not necessary... some feel that it gives you clearer beer. Secondary is NOT for fermenting - it is for clarifying, aging, etc.

Regardless, though, racking after three days is not a great idea. Just because the vigorous fermentation is done does not mean that the beer is ready. Most here advocate a minimum of two weeks in primary (many say three).

The ONLY way to know if fermentation is done is to take a gravity reading, then take another in two days. If they match, fermentation is done.

I recently did an article that covers a LOT of the newbie questions, you might find it useful: Common Sense for Homebrewers.
 
I think it's a style issue. Do it of you want to. I just moved a Belgian I've had in primary for a month to a secondary, but only because I thought it might help clearing it up. I just popped the first bottle of a wheat beer i skipped the secondary on and it tasted and looked just fine.

Again, just do what you feel and experiment. As a general rule I wouldn't rack until the bubbles stop and og is stable. You wouldn't bottle a beer that isn't done with primary would you?
 
The biggest reason I want to rack it into my carboy is then I can start another recipe in primary. sorry to those people who feel I wasted their time, but you're the ones who clicked the thread.
 
I get the frustration with this question, as I see it posted pretty often, but there's no reason to yell at the guy. I probably would've asked the same question, had I not seen someone else post it, first. Responses like that are what really turn people off from asking for help, or drive them away from the hobby.

Fadeux, you can usually avoid secondary, and just ferment in primary for the entire time. Secondary is used mostly to help clear beers that tend to be more cloudy, to rack onto fruit, herbs/spices, etc. for additional flavors, or for longer-term aging.

My first brew said to rack to secondary, too. I think they put that in there to sell carboys, if you ask me. But, it won't hurt to have the secondary carboy, anyway, in case you want fruit. Or if you want to make room in primary for a another beer.

FYI, use the search tool to look for similar posts. Chances are someone has asked your question before. And don't worry about asking newbie questions if you can't find an answer. That's what we're here for, to help!

EDIT: If you want to clear up primary for a new beer, I say go for it.
 
Don't let the less than constructive responses get you down.

See this post in the This vs. That sticky at the top of the forum. Should give you a quick idea of the pros and cons.
 
The biggest reason I want to rack it into my carboy is then I can start another recipe in primary. sorry to those people who feel I wasted their time, but you're the ones who clicked the thread.

I'd probably wait a bit longer. Once the beer is at FG, then it would be fine to move. Sometimes, the beer can be stalled by racking prematurely. Not always, of course ,but sometimes. I'd avoid any chance of that and wait until the SG reading was the same at least over the course of three days to ensure fermentation is complete.
 
The biggest reason I want to rack it into my carboy is then I can start another recipe in primary. sorry to those people who feel I wasted their time, but you're the ones who clicked the thread.

Sorry people acted like that. It's a beginner forum, expect the same beginner questions, no?

I gave you a link you might want to check - it will save you lots of forum reading/searching.
 
This is the first I am hearing of skipping the secondary.

Don't sweat it, yes this is and has been a well spoken about topic. The problem lies with outdated information that is still floating around. With exception of dry hopping, lagering, or adding things like fruit there is really no benefit to transferring to a secondary.

"Secondary" is kind of a misnomer actually as the beer will not ferment again after you transfer to another container. In commercial settings I believe the term they use is "bright tank".

If you transfer too soon then the beer will not be finished and during the transfer you run the risk of contamination so there are some potetial problems with performing a "secondary"!

Some brewers will transfer their beers after primary is complete so that they can free up their primary fermentor and that I can certainly understand!
 
I saw that link Homebrewdad, it is very helpful, reading it right now. Thanks everyone!
 
You didn't waste anyones time. They shouldn't have clicked your post if they didn't want to answer. As far as raking early to start a new beer is recommend getting another fermentor. I've got 6 and they are always either full or just ready for a new beer. This hobby is all consuming and I love it!
 
"Secondary" is kind of a misnomer actually as the beer will not ferment again after you transfer to another container. In commercial settings I believe the term they use is "bright tank".

If you transfer too soon then the beer will not be finished and during the transfer you run the risk of contamination so there are some potetial problems with performing a "secondary"!

Some brewers will transfer their beers after primary is complete so that they can free up their primary fermentor and that I can certainly understand!

Call me a newbie (which I am!), but this doesn't make sense to me. If there's enough active yeast to carbonate in bottles, then there's likely plenty of yeast to finish fermentation in a secondary carboy. I'd be more concerned about oxidation and aerating the beer. But, even then, the yeast will likely clean that up, if done before fermentation is complete. It's not like the yeast die, and there are tons of yeasties still floating in suspension. I say go for it.

I get that waiting until fermentation is complete may be the plan. And then they want to age in some other vessel. But saying that the fermenation will not finish in secondary is something I have a hard time believing.
 
Call me a newbie (which I am!), but this doesn't make sense to me. If there's enough active yeast to carbonate in bottles, then there's likely plenty of yeast to finish fermentation in a secondary carboy. I'd be more concerned about oxidation and aerating the beer. But, even then, the yeast will likely clean that up, if done before fermentation is complete. It's not like the yeast die, and there are tons of yeasties still floating in suspension. I say go for it.

I get that waiting until fermentation is complete may be the plan. And then they want to age in some other vessel. But saying that the fermenation will not finish in secondary is something I have a hard time believing.

But it does happen sometimes. Especially with a highly flocculant yeast. Sometimes prematurely racking the beer stalls it. Not always. But sometimes.
 
Call me a newbie (which I am!), but this doesn't make sense to me. If there's enough active yeast to carbonate in bottles, then there's likely plenty of yeast to finish fermentation in a secondary carboy. I'd be more concerned about oxidation and aerating the beer. But, even then, the yeast will likely clean that up, if done before fermentation is complete. It's not like the yeast die, and there are tons of yeasties still floating in suspension. I say go for it.

I get that waiting until fermentation is complete may be the plan. And then they want to age in some other vessel. But saying that the fermenation will not finish in secondary is something I have a hard time believing.

You can call me a newbie as well, but I think it's quite plausible that early racking could create a problem completing what should be the primary fermentation, yet be acceptable for carbonating. It's a matter of degree---for fermentation, you're asking the surviving yeast population to ferment 2 gravity points or so (0.002 worth of SG), versus 10-15 gravity points (0.015 worth of SG) if you interrupt at the "70% done" point of a fairly typical beer. That's a lot more to ask, and certainly gives you a greater chance for non-ideal fermentation products to affect the outcome if it's not a great fermentation.

Furthermore, while I don't have first-hand experience yet, there are plenty of brewers who still stand by using a "secondary." What seems to have gone away, however, is the insistence that you get there very quickly after fermentation completes---it seems to be more universally accepted that an extra week or two before racking won't hurt, regardless of whether the brewer believes a secondary will be beneficial after that point.
 
But it does happen sometimes. Especially with a highly flocculant yeast. Sometimes prematurely racking the beer stalls it. Not always. But sometimes.

This has me imagining how disorienting the 5 foot journey through a siphon tube must be for those yeasties. :cross:
 
That makes sense. I can see how reducing yeast count like that can make extra work for already-tired yeast. With a more sensitive yeast strain, that could be a real issue, especially if you transfer way too early.
 
That makes sense. I can see how reducing yeast count like that can make extra work for already-tired yeast. With a more sensitive yeast strain, that could be a real issue, especially if you transfer way too early.

This. Yeast in solution might be fine for bottling... but if fermentation is still going on and you get rid of lots of yeast, you could cause fermentation to stall.
 
If a secondary is used. How long does it take for a beer to clear? Also, though I admit this part is off topic, Should I save the yeast cake in the primary? Or is that a stupid idea.
 
Everything is variable. You can't just grab a number out of the air and decide that is how long any of this takes.

For secondary I'd take hydro readings and if you are close to your expected FG gravity then consider racking to secondary for finishing up and clearing.

Now normally I wouldn't use a secondary per se. Since I keg I'd just ferment out in the primary and then cold crash before racking to the keg.

BUT since you said you want to use your primary feel free to transfer your beer after the initial fermentation is complete (take a reading with hydrometer) and get another batch going!

(But you might also think about buying another fermenter)
 
You know what is the most discussed about topic on here. It's" what's the most discussed about topic". I believe I have heard that statement from using a secondary, to taking a hydrometer reading to is my beer infected.

The truth is this is a forum for folks ( mostly new to the hobby) to talk and ask questions. Maybe they are new to the program too and haven't mastered the search function yet. Regardless who really cares, if you don't want to answer their question don't click on the post and read it. Not that someone who clicks on the same post just to bash the topic is really someone possessing a valued opinion anyways.

Good beer + good friends= good times
 
I just joined this site yesterday. alot of good info on hear too. I have been making wine for 6 years and have just recently tried my first brew WITH MY WIFE BY MY SIDE.We are both newbies to brewing. To those who know everything please give those of us less knowing a break. When I first started my JOB we had 11 weeks of field training and 1 year probation so we could asked questions and learn the ropes. And YES my trainers had been asked the same questions over and over and over.... just $.02 worth from the new guy......
 
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