Help/Comments on ~ 1 barrel system design

Hi - First time poster, long time extract brewer.

I'm looking for help/ideas/comments on building a 30 to 40 gallon system. In short, I have a unique opportunity to design and build a hobby system, using commercial materials, utilities (steam, glycol, potable soft water, potable hot water, etc.), plc control and skilled sanitary welders. Sorry for what will be a long post, but I want to be detailed to get good input.

I'm a process controls engineer with extensive experience in dairy systems. I am involved in building a new processing facility. I know the owners well, we are friends. They have offered (in exchange for beer, of course!) to let me design and build a system using spare parts they have aquired.

FERMENTER - I have found a roughly 50 gallon, 60 degree cone bottom tank. I just need to wrap a coil around it, insulate it, make a sealed lid/airlock, and connect glycol. Comments?

BREW KETTLE - I have several possible 50 - 75 gallon steam jacketed tanks with agitators. I'm thinking that I can just apply steam and run the agitator at 30 - 60 rpm or so. Comments?

MASH TUN & HLT - This gets more challenging, I am not familiar with all the necessary design criteria at this larger volume.

HLT - I assume I should be using a tank that is steam heated and will hold 40 gallons or so? I have a ~50 gallon jacketed tank that could have an agitator attached, tank's about 22" dia x 30" high. I'm thinking agitation is a good idea to stabilize heat xfer, but is it necessary? Comments?

MASH TUN - I have several options, none are perfect. All could have a false bottom added.
Option 1: ~ 70 gallon processing tank with scraped surface agitation and steam jacket, about 30" inside diameter. Cons: small TOP access hatch (10" x 15"), NO side access hatch. Not really suitable for pivot style dumping of spent grains. Cutting a side hatch is a remote possiblilty, but tough since it is jacketed.

Option 2: Tank I mentioned as HLT candidate, but then I need something else for HLT. Pro: This tank could probably be pivoted to dump grain. It also has a small 6" side access opening, pretty small for emptying grains?

Option 3: ~ 36" round tank, ~36" high, no top, no agitation, no jacket. Odd cone bottom - it is side cone, that is, the cone tapers to one side of the tank, not to the center. Cone is about 10" deep. Is this a problem - this cone would hold probably 7 - 10 gallons of water BELOW the grain bed, unless the false bottom was actually in this funky cone. Might be able to modify the cone to reduce this volume. I can fab a support over the top for sparging/agitator, etc. Grain could easily be shoveled out.

Questions:
- I assume that there is a minimum and maximum recommended grain bed thickness? Wouldn't this be directly influenced by the tank diameter and batch size? It seems to me there has to be a correlation...
- For this size batch, I am guessing that (very roughly) the grain bill could be 80 lbs to 120 lbs or more. Is agitation required/recommended? Seems to me it would be a necessity....

FWIW, pump(s) will probably be air powered double diaphragm, rated for 200+ degrees.

Any comments are welcome! If you think I'm whacked for trying to do this, say so!!

Wow. I need dairy friends.

Dude, you have just become a microbrewer.

Monster Mash does obscene batches like these. I'm sure he'll chime in with some very valuable input. In the mean-time you should check out his setup, which is rather impressive, and big, his brewery that is

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/brewer007/my_photos

Thanks for the link, that looks impressive! I'll have to snap some pictures of my candidate vessels and post them, that might spark some ideas.

This is basically going to be a "community brew club" system for 3 - 6 people per batch, stuffed in a "secret" corner of the factory, LOL. I'll also be brewing for company parties and similar events. Should be fun.

My system is almost 1 bbl . The pots are 30 gallons so I can brew 25 gallon batches.
If you post pics of what you have it will help a lot. A mash tun works best if it wider then it is tall. Mine is pushing the limits but it still works great.

Now that Monster Mash is here, where on earth is BrewPastor? I hear he dabbles in a few larger batches now and again. PAGING BREWPASTOR TO THE THREAD! This man is in need of your guidance!

double M - exactly what are your kettles and seemingly all of your equipment made of? they appear as if they are some sort of upside down stainless steel gas cylinder of some sort - but i'm probably way off in left field

Here are pics of what I have available:

Fermenter (no brainer):


Mash Tun or Fermenter?


Mash Tun?


A few more in the next post.

Steam Jacketed Brew Kettles? The one on the left could also be a Hot Liquor Tank or Mash Tun?


Hehe, if I got really ambitious:

So - I am looking for thoughts about which would be the best for a Mash Tun and HLT based on a ~ 1 barrel batch size. The Mash Tun is the one that I am really unsure about - I don't really know the design goals for grain bed thickness, how much liquid is OK under the bed, etc.

Any comments on mash bed depth? Pros and Cons?

Example: 60 lbs of grain

6" deep x 42" round (short & flat tun) vs. 30" deep and 18" round (tall & skinny tun)?