Edgeumicate Me About Hops...

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TwoWheeler

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Being new here, I can stir up a hornet's nest with impunity and then claim it was because I was a n00b and didn't know better.....right? :p

Here: I don't like IPA's or any really hoppy beers. Beer is water, malt and yeast. Anything else is in there for balance and/or interest.<ducks and runs.....>

:D No, seriously, my palate doesn't really do "bitter" well. I don't drink coffee or eat dark chocolate, for the same reason. I'm hugely fond of Belgian beers, with German styles a pretty close second. I prefer beers that are BALANCED, not in-your-face with any one thing. Guess that's why I like the Belgian stuff so much - there's usually layers of flavors.

I have been, however, doggedly exploring different styles and have found a few beers that are somewhat aggressively hopped that I don't mind. The biggest surprise was Dogfish 90. THAT, I liked. Not sure why. (Their 120 I liked too, but man, that's "dessert" beer!)

What I'm trying to do is figure out what elements of hop flavor I don't care for to determine what hops and utilization I like and which I don't. I've heard hop flavor described as "grapefruit", "grassy" and "pine-y". I think it's the "pine-y" element I don't care for.

Comments?

<waits for inevitable flaming from hopheads...>
 
I think you hit the nail on the head- you don't like bitter. Those other beers you like tend to be sweeter and/or not bitter. DFH 90 isn't bitter, considering it's an IIPA.

Do you like Rogue's Dead Guy ale? It's a maibock style ale- a malt bomb in my opinion!
 
Those other beers you like tend to be sweeter and/or not bitter. DFH 90 isn't bitter, considering it's an IIPA.
To me, it's like hot sauce - I like heat, to a point, but after a while, heat just obliterates everything else, so what's the point? Same with hops - there seems to sometimes be an almost one-upmanship mentality to it - "How hoppy can you take it?"

Maybe the higher ABV of DFH90 balances the bitterness better? (I also found I like hoppy beers better with food).

Do you like Rogue's Dead Guy ale? It's a maibock style ale- a malt bomb in my opinion!
Y'know, as many times as I've seen it, I've never tried it. I'll have to add it to my "research". (Oh darn).
 
Might I suggest a Belgian Strong Ale like a Simcoe Smash Recipe ?
I got the idea from drinking a Simcoe Silly from Kuhnhenn's Brewery in Warren Michigan.
 
I can't stand pine hops. I like citrus hops the best, as long as they don't go too grapefruit. Flowery hops are okay. I believe the hop varieties you'd like best are Simcoe and Amarillo. They're both in DFH90, which is one of my faves also. I also really like Willamette hops, and seem to use them in about half my beers.
 
twowheeler I can relate to your dilemna. I can stand hoppy to a point. Too much hoppiness begins tasting like rotten grapefruit to me. Much cheaper to suck on a grapefruit.

As trochiest suggested, the amirrillo or simcoe hop are good ones to start with. I have gone to my local homebrew club tastings to get idea where to start and these two hops were great from home brew tastings.

My taste is where yours is and I just ordered.

Amirillo Ale-Midwest
Jamil's Evil Twin-NB

Both are amirillo hopped based to begin my hop journey.
 
As trochiest suggested, the amirrillo or simcoe hop are good ones to start with.

Of course they are.....that's why I planted Cascade, Willamette, Chinook and Nugget....:p

I'm just trying to get a better handle on exactly what it is I like and don't like.

Banjoman - my "house" beer is a Belgian Strong Golden. I'm currently using 2oz of Saaz in beginning of the boil and one oz at the end. It's pretty good, balance-wise. This latest batch, I cut it back to one oz in the boil, just for poops and giggles. (I also pulled off one gallon while racking to secondary and I'm going to "oak" it).

Maybe next go-round, I'll play with the hops. I notice in the DFH recipes I have from Sam's book that they use Simcoe in several of their recipes - and I love their beers - so maybe I'll play with trying Simcoe in the next batch.
 
Banjoman - my "house" beer is a Belgian Strong Golden. I'm currently using 2oz of Saaz in beginning of the boil and one oz at the end. It's pretty good, balance-wise. This latest batch, I cut it back to one oz in the boil, just for poops and giggles. (I also pulled off one gallon while racking to secondary and I'm going to "oak" it).

Maybe next go-round, I'll play with the hops. I notice in the DFH recipes I have from Sam's book that they use Simcoe in several of their recipes - and I love their beers - so maybe I'll play with trying Simcoe in the next batch.

Wow, yeah, you don't like hops too much if you're using only Saaz lol. I believe the Simcoe/Amarillo combo is supposed to be one of those greater than the sum of its parts deals.
 
I would say that hop bitterness is an acquired taste. After getting my start with amber ales and Sam Adams, the first Sierra Nevada Pale Ale I had was offensively bitter. These days I reach for a SNPA when I'm not in the mood for something bitter!

Same thing with coffee. I used to like flavored coffees, extra cream, extra sugar. Now I take it black, no sugar. Same with dark chocolate.

I've seen the same sort of thing play out with friends. If you care to keep trying well-hopped beers (and you should, there's such a diversity of flavor out there!), I would guess you'll find yourself enjoying hoppy beers more and more.
 
I would say that hop bitterness is an acquired taste. After getting my start with amber ales and Sam Adams, the first Sierra Nevada Pale Ale I had was offensively bitter. These days I reach for a SNPA when I'm not in the mood for something bitter!

Same thing with coffee. I used to like flavored coffees, extra cream, extra sugar. Now I take it black, no sugar. Same with dark chocolate.

I've seen the same sort of thing play out with friends. If you care to keep trying well-hopped beers (and you should, there's such a diversity of flavor out there!), I would guess you'll find yourself enjoying hoppy beers more and more.

That's how it went for me as well. I went for sweeter maltier beers. Now I'm on the other side of the spectrum with IPAs as my favorite style.
 
That's how it went for me as well. I went for sweeter maltier beers. Now I'm on the other side of the spectrum with IPAs as my favorite style.

I was a major malthead for years, and only when I started brewing my own and smelling the hops before I through them in the wort did I start to gain an appreciation! I became a huge hophead for a while, but now I've kinda gotten back more into malt. I have a terrible sweet tooth though.
 
Wow, yeah, you don't like hops too much if you're using only Saaz lol.
No, actually, the "recipe" is from a Northern Brewer kit. I bought the first one as a "starting point" for a house beer and have been tweaking it each batch.

That's part of the reason for this post - I'm trying to figure out what I like/don't like, hop-wise, so I can play with that in future batches.
 
I would say that hop bitterness is an acquired taste.
I would think after over ten years of trying a crap-ton of craft beers, I would have acquired it by now! ;)
If you care to keep trying well-hopped beers (and you should, there's such a diversity of flavor out there!), I would guess you'll find yourself enjoying hoppy beers more and more.
I'm always willing to explore - which is what this post is all about - but I find that in beers as well as food, I prefer complexity and balance. I've found with the majority of aggressively hopped beers, it's all about "how bitter can we make it?", not "how can we use this bitter element in conjunction with the other elements in the beer?"

I've also had beers that went the other way - too sweet.
 
if you dont like them.... then you shouldn't drink them, eh?

brew/drink what you like, everything else is a waste of time and money.
 
if you dont like them.... then you shouldn't drink them, eh?

brew/drink what you like, everything else is a waste of time and money.
True. I'm not apologizing or trying to justify my tastes, but I'm always exploring what I like and why and always looking for new.

Hate to think I'm missing out!
 
And for others perhaps the Belgians taste a bit off color? There is a french proverb that I will misremember here: There is no accounting for colors or tastes.

My brother and I are only on batch 6. But we're planning to start doing a series of kludged AG Smash recipes to learn exactly what you're asking about: hops.

Although I have to do the opposite as well: overcome my viceral dislike of Belgian / Trappish beers and learn about yeast and "fruity" flavors.
 
True. I'm not apologizing or trying to justify my tastes, but I'm always exploring what I like and why and always looking for new.

Hate to think I'm missing out!

Understandable, but after reading this....

I would think after over ten years of trying a crap-ton of craft beers, I would have acquired it by now! ;)

I don't like getting poked in the eyeball, but I'm not going to keep trying it for ten years on the chance that maybe someday I will. :D

Maybe buy an IPA or something hoppy every once in a while in hopes that MAYBE you will find something you like, then try brewing a clone. But it seems like you're experienced enough to know that you don't like it and won't like it, so it's like beating a dead horse.

Good luck to you! I didn't like hoppy beers before I started homebrewing, now they aren't that bad, and I like DogFish Head 60 minute IPA!

:mug:
 
Maybe buy an IPA or something hoppy every once in a while in hopes that MAYBE you will find something you like,
:mug:

I usually don't rule anything out, without trying it - I might miss something.

As an analogy, I don't like country music, but won't pass up listening to something just because it may have some elements of country in it. In this way, I have discovered several artists that, for some reason or other, even though they're heavily country influenced, I still like them. (Son Volt comes to mind). Had I just done a blanket condemnation of the genre, I would have missed out on them.

So it is with hoppy beers - I generally don't care for "bitter", but there have been a few that I DID like, and a few that were "...ok...". What I'm trying to do is figure out WHY I like the ones that I DO like, so I can add that to my "toolbox" when creating my OWN beers.

To illustrate that with yet ANOTHER analogy...(I'm full of them today...) I learned a trick from Indian cooking - toasting spices in a dry pan, then frying them in the oil you're going to cook in. Toasting the spices deepens the flavor and frying them infuses the oil. I use this trick all the time, not just when I'm making Indian food. (Works great in chili and that sure ain't Indian!)
 
I'm probably like others, I can go either way. I like IPAs but I also like the darker beers as well. Its like Skittles and Chocolate to me...
 
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