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killian said:
I was just wondering what other options are out there.
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Buy one of these guys:

Bucket Heater - More Categories - Compare Prices, Reviews and Buy at NexTag - Price - Review

I guess it's not really an other option just a heat stick pre-built for you. I'm not that handy (also it has heat guard around it to hopefully stop me melting my cooler MLT) that's why I got it.

I just bought one on Tuesday so haven't used it yet but others have with good results. See thread in DIY.

Rudeboy
 
killian said:
I have been considering electric for my HLT and boil kettle. Most of the set ups I have seen are using hot water heater elements mounted in the hlt or kettle. I was thinking about building one of these Homebrewing Electric Heatstick / PA145404.JPG. I was just wondering what other options are out there.
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It's a horse apiece. Either way you're using water heater elements. So you make it fixed to the equipment or somewhat portable. Not much different either way.
 
Not a another option but some recommendations.
I made a couple of the heat sticks. I went with 2000w, 220v elements and used the elbow chrome drain fitting so they lay at the bottom of the HLT or boiler. This allows me to bring just a few gallons to boil quickly in my HLT for pre heating my tun. They work great and my system came out a few dollars cheaper than buying four ready made 1000 watt heaters. The heat sticks themselves were actually less than half the cost of my setup. The rest came from the GFI breaker, dryer cord pigtail and switched outlet control box.

Make 2 or 3 heaters to get your 4-5k watt total. This way you can regulate the boil a little or use one for your sparge water and have the boil going simultaneously.

If you have the 220v service available go that way.

Go with a minimum of 4000w total for full full boils.

GFCI!!!!
 
killian said:
luv, are you saying that 1 1000 watt bucket heater would not do much?
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Depends on the volume, but you'll never get 1KW to boil 5 gallons. It'll work for your HLT if you're patient.

Here's my 120V 2KW electric kettle boiling 4 gal of Jamil's Red Ale:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EV8t5iBiaEA]YouTube - Red Head Ale boil[/ame]
 
jkarp said:
Depends on the volume, but you'll never get 1KW to boil 5 gallons. It'll work for your HLT if you're patient.
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Exactly.
You might be able to boil a 3 gal extract batch with 1KW but that's even iffy
4KW brings 7-9gal to a boil in under an hour (from mash temp). 2KW is enough to keep the boil roiling.

Also, there are 2 different style elements. High density and low density.
The same wattage element is a different length. I believe the low density are the longer ones. At any rate, the shorter elements get hotter and the longer elements use lower temps and more surface area. The longer ones are good for RIMS heat tubes. The shorties are better for the HLT and boiling.
 
http://www.northernbrewer.com/pics/fullsize/brewheater.jpg

Boil wort, heat sparge water, or raise mash temperatures indoors without a vent hood or exhaust fan using this 110V electric heater. The 2200 watt heating element is controlled by a potentiometer with infinite adjustment from 120° to 212° F. Heating element has a stainless housing with a zinc-plated copper elbow. Also features a built-in ground fault interrupter. Use on a dedicated outlet with at least a 20-amp circuit breaker.
 
It will still take over 30 minutes after the sparge, to reach a boil with 2200W. Currently I run my 5500W element at 65% power to maintain a nice vigorous boil, which is 3,575W of power.

I know that for some 240VAC is not possible, but if it is... it deserves a good long look. For $30 you can build the element, $45 for the PID, $20 for the SSR and $20 for the heatsink. For $115 you can have a fully controllable 5500W element in a kettle that is capable of 10 gal. batches if needed in the future. At the very least it is fast and efficient for 5 gallon (7.5 gal) boils.
 
I can use spreadsheets too, but...

I have never seen 160F in the kettle after a sparge. Mine is always 150F dead on with a 168F grain bed.

Also, my 5 gallon batches start with 7.5 gallons.

So, not pessimistic, but all based in reality from what I have actually done with electric.

That equals 33 minutes with 7.5 gallons at 800' elevation from 150F to 210F (where water boils at 800' elevation)
 
The Pol said:
I can use spreadsheets too, but...

I have never seen 160F in the kettle after a sparge. Mine is always 150F dead on with a 168F grain bed.

Also, my 5 gallon batches start with 7.5 gallons.

So, not pessimistic, but all based in reality from what I have actually done with electric.

That equals 33 minutes.
Click to expand...

Granted, I do smaller batches than you, but started the electric brewing journey about the same time. I consistently see 160 post-sparge, but I also do a mashout. I chose 6 gal as my boil-off rate is 1 gal/hr. I'm at 6700 MSL so my rate is higher than most. Even at 5.5 going into the fermenter, 7.5 is a LOT of wort to start with. You really see 2g/hr boil-off or do you do 90-120 minute boils?

My numbers were 100% from experience. In fact, it took exactly 15 minutes to go from 160 to a 201 boil with 4 gallons last night in my kettle, just as the math predicts. :)
 
I am at about 600' elevation. I get 1.6 gal/hr boil off, and I boil for 90 minutes. 1gal/hr seems really low, so I am surprised to hear you say that it is high.

When I am heating my E-HLT which is insulated and has a lid, I get 95% efficiency when heating the water in that vessel. Id have to deduce that an un-insulated BK with no lid would not provide an environment where Id get 95% heating eff.

If you went from 160-201 in 15 minutes with 4 gallons, that is only 75% eff. In that case it would take 41 minutes to reach a boil in my scenario.
 
I'm sure kettle geometry has a lot to do with the differences we're seeing in boil-off rates. You're in a keggle whereas I'm in a 30 qt pot with a 11.5" diameter. And yes, I see roughly 75% efficiency in my lightly insulated kettle with the lid off.

OP never did say what size batches he wants to do. To be honest, I'd never even consider 120V for 5 gal or up, except in a HLT perhaps. 2KW works for me because I never start with more than 5 gal in the kettle and have zero plans of going bigger. I'm very partial to my indoor counter-top brutus 20. :)
 
so is 240V 4500W over kill for EHLT?
EHLT is my next project and I got the okay from SWMBO to use the dryer outlet on brew day. I still plan on using propane for boiling for now, but will be using a racno controller ELHT. Want to have the fastest rise times I can with a 10G Round Cooler. Don't mind overkill if it means faster. The price difference in elements is pretty small considering brew budgets.
 
4500W for the EHLT is good! Be sure to take into consideration how much water you need to keep in the HLT to submerge the element.
 
I would like to stick with 10 gallon batches if possible and I can use a 240V outlet. Im thinking I would use a 10 gallon cooler for the HLT and a keggle for the Boil kettle. Where can I find some plans for this?

$30 you can build the element, $45 for the PID, $20 for the SSR and $20 for the heatsink. For $115 you can have a fully controllable 5500W element in a kettle that is capable of 10 gal
 
thanks pol, that looks like some really useful info there.

I would like to avoid purchasing a pump at the moment, so a HERMS or RIMS isnt going to work for me. I dont think I need a PID and SSR, Im planning a 3 tier gravity fed system. So could I just build the heat stick for the HLT & Keggle only running one at a time?
 
You can run whatever you like. Do you want to be able to control the element? Or just on and off?

What size of element are you using?

PIDs and SSRs are used to simply turn the element on and off with some level of control.

Ranco and A419s cannot handle the amp load of anything more than 1650W at 120VAC.

If you just use a switch to turn the element on and off, make sure your outlet, breaker and switch are all rated for 120% of what you intend to use. Essentially, make sure you are using no more than 80% of the circuits rated capacity for safety sake. Also, make sure it is GFCI, obviously.

Hope this helps...
 
Keep an eye on eBay for one of these immersion heaters. I picked this one up for the minimum bid of 99 cents (plus shipping.)

3000W / 240 volts with temperature control!

ImmersionHeater01.jpg
 
Coffeeaddictnova said:
AnOldUR, do you plan to install this immersion heater to your brewing kettle/pot?
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Yeah, the 15 gallon SS pot to its left. Still need to round up some hardware. Not sure the 3000W will be good for a boil. Plan to use it as an HLT and gas to boil in a second matching pot, but I'll have to do some experimenting.
 
killian said:
Electric Brewery Control Module - High Gravity

Im looking at picking one of these up but it would be nice to be able to find something similar but cheaper.
Click to expand...

You could put something like this together for around $60.00 in parts.
The one I made for my heat sticks is similar. I am the only one using it and keep it put up when not in use, so I cheaped out a little and went with two 15amp, 110vac (my 220vac heaters pull less than 11 amps) switch/receptacle combos mounted in the same type box used in your linked controller. Add a dryer pig tail, clip the receptacle buss and wire up as switched receptacle. Doesn't meet code but it is safe if you know what you have. Mine came in under $40.00 with the short cut.
 
well, Im about to contact my electrician to see if he will build the control box for me.

my plan for my system is a simple three tier gravity set up and for now I will only need to run one element at a time. Im thinking on/off control is all that I will need. I would like to have the control box ready for my next up grade when I can afford it, but for now it has to be as cheap as possible. Eventually I want to add a pump and some kind of temp control.

I think Im going with this

for the HLT - Heating Element - 5500 watt - Burners & Electric Pot Heaters - High Gravity

for the boil kettle -
Heating Element - 3500 watt - Burners & Electric Pot Heaters - High Gravity

What do I need to control 1 element at a time with only on/off control? The 240V outlet that I have access to is mounted on the ceiling so I think it will be about 12 to to 15 feet from the hlt and BK so I will have to have some kind of extension to reach the control box.

Any help is appreciated
 
killian,
Just my $.02
I would go the other way with the heating elements.
5.5kw in the boiler and 3.5 in the HLT.
I would also wire the 5.5kw control with a 110/220 4 wire line and switch to run it on 220 or 110Vac. You will not want 5500w constantly during your boil.
This presumes that you have a neutral pulled to your 220v service.

Good luck!
 
The electrician that you were going to talk to should not have any problem with it.
I could draw something up for you and pm it if you'd like.

Like I said, this would require a a 4 wire 110/220v circuit.
 
luvmy40 said:
The electrician that you were going to talk to should not have any problem with it.
I could draw something up for you and pm it if you'd like.

Like I said, this would require a a 4 wire 110/220v circuit.
Click to expand...

I would love to see a rough schematic if you have it!
 

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