Not happy with results

I've now brewed 2 batches of extract beer. The first being an Amber Ale, and the second being a Liberty Cream Ale. I purchased both kits from Midwest Supplies.

As far as I know, I followed all steps as closely as I could have. The beer isn't terrible, but I just feel like it's lacking something. They both taste very similar (both made from the same extract "GOLD"). The carbonation is great, neither are very hoppy (I did use a filter bag for the hops), but overall they both kind of taste like carbonated bittersweet water. The best way I can describe it; initial taste is fine, but both are lacking a back end flavor that you get with most beer. Could this be an issue with my yeast?

TwoSheaStl said:

I've now brewed 2 batches of extract beer. The first being an Amber Ale, and the second being a Liberty Cream Ale. I purchased both kits from Midwest Supplies.

As far as I know, I followed all steps as closely as I could have. The beer isn't terrible, but I just feel like it's lacking something. They both taste very similar (both made from the same extract "GOLD"). The carbonation is great, neither are very hoppy (I did use a filter bag for the hops), but overall they both kind of taste like carbonated bittersweet water. The best way I can describe it; initial taste is fine, but both are lacking a back end flavor that you get with most beer. Could this be an issue with my yeast?

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I had the same problem with my first extract kit, did ya have more than 5 gallons total of beer? reason i ask cause i did and it tasted watery as well. It gets better with time but could be the problem. Were there steeping grains? I tend to leave mine in for 10 min longer than the recipe calls for. How long did ya primary for? Also, most beer actually all commercial beer are made with all grains, huge differance between that and extract brewing..Need at least a good 3 weeks for the bottles to condition as well..

How long did you let them stay in bottle before drinking them? I had the same issue with my first batch. I first would taste water and then the beer flavor would kick in. I found out that letting them condition would change the overall mouthfeel of the beer.

I have never ordered a Midwest Kit. but i use my Local brew store kits all the time. of course they come with the standard set of instructions. but what i have learned:

Leave it in primary for two weeks. I rack to a secondary (i know not neccesary) just to clean it up a little bit more for one week.
Bottle with a batch prime and dont even think about touching it until week 3 in the bottles.
put one in the fridge for one day and taste.

Good, put them all in the fridge.
little weak, wait another week and then start over with one in the fridge for a day.
good, drink on!

i have only done extract, and am on my 6th batch,,, the last batch was my best (Wit).. and i did exactly what i said above....

Are these kits full boil or top off kits?

If you followed the instructions then you prolly were mislead into rushing the process. Most of those instructions that come with the kits indicate 3-4 days in primary, then drink. That is terrible. 2 weeks primary, 2 weeks secondary (or bottle conditioned) is pretty minimum.

i am in the process of my first batch right now and i did 9 days in the primary and now they have been in bottles for 2 weeks as of yesterday. i opened one just so that i could taste the beer. it was pretty good, but i am pretty sure that it needs to sit for another week or two. i agree 100% with testing one bottle, if it isn't what you are expecting, then let it sit for another week and trying it again.

I would advise not rushing your initial batches into bottles... IMO, 9 days would be ok for a low OG brew (~1.040 and under). Anything higher should go at least a couple/few weeks. This is especially true with ales (or brews made with ale yeast) and can often be true of many other styles/types.

If you don't have tight temperature control over the brew (within a degree, or two) then time is your ally.
If it doesn't taste right (ALWAYS taste the hydrometer sample), give it more time.
Make sure you get two matching hydrometer readings 2-3 days apart before you consider it at FG.
Don't just blindly go by the directions that come with kits (after it goes into fermenter, you can pretty much toss the directions out).

Don't feel bad about rushing your initial batches into bottle. I think almost everyone here has done it (myself included, on my second batch, since then, I've learned patience).

If you want to brew another batch, and your primary (or primaries) contain fermenting brews, then get more primaries. I'd also advise racking to another vessel only when it makes 100% sense. There are a few cases where I do it, but the vast majority of my brews stay in primary for 4-8 weeks before going to bottle/keg. Since going with that model, I've been getting excellent tasting brews (my own recipes) that are super clear. I also do NOT cold crash or use gelatin in my batches. I do use Irish Moss/Whirlfloc in the boil, but that's it.

Where the hops leaf or pellet? If it was pellet I wouldn't have used the filter bag...

Jayman931, I use nylon hop bags with pellet hops all the time without issue.

I will say that the kits I used from the LHBS for my initial brews were pretty good. But I quickly graduated to making my own recipes. While this allows me to make exactly what I want, it also means I have no one else to blame if it turns out different than I wanted/intended.

Thanks for all the responses. To answer some of your questions:

- I steeped the specialty grains for about 30 minutes at 150 degrees.

- I used hop pellets, but did use a steeping bag. I think next time I will just throw the hops right in.

- I added Irish Moss at the end of the boil for clarity.

- I left my first beer (amber ale) in the primary for 2 weeks, second (cream ale) in the primary for an entire month.

YEAST: This is where I think I might have messed up. On my first beer I used a Wyeast smack pack, but only let it sit for about 8 hours before I pitched it. For my second beer, I made a yeast starter the day before. I didn't really notice any extreme foaming on top. I pitched the starter, but DIDN'T shake it up before I did. There was a lot of yeast left on the bottom of my growler. However, my OG and FG were about right. 0.050 to start and finished at about 0.010.

- I let the beers sit in the bottles for 3 weeks. Once I opened them, the carbonation was fine, but that flavor that you get on the sides of your tongue w/ any beer is not there. I only taste it on the tip.

If your beer fermented completely I doubt the yeast is to blame. What temperature did you ferment at? Aside from that, the only other problem I can think of is possibly old extract.

When it comes to adding 'top off' water, I add my cooled wart to the carboy, and then I top off w/ tap water (straight from the faucet) until I get it up to the 5 gallon mark. Are you suggesting that maybe I'm adding too much water to my wart?

unionrdr said:

Measure 6 gallons & put it in the fermenter. See where it comes up to. Sometimes,those graduations are off. The symptoms you describe point to that as a possible cause.

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A 1.050 OG beer shouldn't be watery and flavorless. I exclusively use my buckets for measuring volume and have no problems with it.

How much priming sugar did you use? Low carbed beer always seems a bit watery and thin to me.

My first two kits were Midwest, and both were great. My stout was a little watery at first (or at least not nice and full like I had hoped), but after a month in the bottle was stellar. I'd also vote it is a carb issue, not yeast. How long have they been in bottles and did you chill for at least 48 hrs before drinking?

Edit: Just saw 3 weeks. Another week might help. Be sure to chill for a couple days! Good luck!

Carbonation has never been an issue, however, I cracked a few open this weekend (from my first batch) which was brewed about 3 months ago (amber Ale) and they tasted the best they ever have. So, unfortunately—looks like I'm going to have to wait 3 months to drink my beer rather than 1 :cross:

TwoSheaStl said:

Thanks for all the responses. To answer some of your questions:

- I steeped the specialty grains for about 30 minutes at 150 degrees.

- I used hop pellets, but did use a steeping bag. I think next time I will just throw the hops right in.

- I added Irish Moss at the end of the boil for clarity.

- I left my first beer (amber ale) in the primary for 2 weeks, second (cream ale) in the primary for an entire month.

YEAST: This is where I think I might have messed up. On my first beer I used a Wyeast smack pack, but only let it sit for about 8 hours before I pitched it. For my second beer, I made a yeast starter the day before. I didn't really notice any extreme foaming on top. I pitched the starter, but DIDN'T shake it up before I did. There was a lot of yeast left on the bottom of my growler. However, my OG and FG were about right. 0.050 to start and finished at about 0.010.

- I let the beers sit in the bottles for 3 weeks. Once I opened them, the carbonation was fine, but that flavor that you get on the sides of your tongue w/ any beer is not there. I only taste it on the tip.

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I use a hop bag. My OG sample blew my hair off from the hops last time.

TwoSheaStl said:

Carbonation has never been an issue, however, I cracked a few open this weekend (from my first batch) which was brewed about 3 months ago (amber Ale) and they tasted the best they ever have. So, unfortunately—looks like I'm going to have to wait 3 months to drink my beer rather than 1 :cross:

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aha....see?? Patience!


3-4 weeks in the fermenter, 3 weeks in the bottle at 70F to carbonate - 6-8 weeks total should get you a decent beer. Some better longer (like porters, stouts, )

Temp control, too, during the first several days at least - if you aren't doing that now -
Smack Packs don't HAVE to be smacked - that's just a little 'helper' to prove the yeast are viable. Starters rarely yield krausen, just more white layers of yeast at the bottom of the flask.

congrats on it tasting better now!

You'll notice that the Liberty Cream Ale will be great too after you allow it to age. I tasted mine after being bottled for 3 weeks. It was still too green with an apple off-flavor. I didn't try it again until it was 6 weeks old and it tasted excellent! I've been happy with all the kits I've purchased from Midwest.