Where is the taste?

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

gwood

Senior Member
HBT Supporter
Joined
Oct 31, 2007
Messages
572
Reaction score
2
Location
Los Angeles, CA
Ok, I just bottled my first batch of beer and while I can honestly say that there were absolutely no off flavors or smells, I can also say that there really wasn't much in the way of anything else in the nose or palate either. It tasted very watered down with very little of the expected hop or malt signatures we all know too well.

I brewed the recipe that was suggested on howtobrew.com (cinci pale). There was one mishap in terms of ingredients in that I had to go with a last minute replacement of the amber extact (DME) with a liquid amber lager extract. I hopped at the called for intervals, cooled in time, and overall carried a full rolling boil for the perscribed duration of time. Pitched at the correct temps for both wort and yeast, let it sit in the primary for one day over two weeks at an even 67 F, racked, primed, and bottled uneventfully.

Where did the taste go?

EDIT: I should also mention that I followed Palmers' direction and did a three gallon boil and topped it off with two into the primary so the water volume was correct from what I can gather from my notes.
 
Beer generally tastes a little watered down before it's carbonated. Give it a couple weeks in bottles before you judge it.
 
In order to gauge if anything went wrong, some gravities, volumes and a recipe would help us along :)
 
You didn't mention how long it's been in the bottle. It needs at least 3 weeks a month is better. Be patient, along with good sanitation it's a very important aspect of brewing good beer.

If you don't have much hops flavor I would suspect old or incorrectly stored hops.
 
abracadabra said:
You didn't mention how long it's been in the bottle. It needs at least 3 weeks a month is better. Be patient, along with good sanitation it's a very important aspect of brewing good beer.

If you don't have much hops flavor I would suspect old or incorrectly stored hops.

I was tasting during bottling. I've been very patient...hadn't tried it until that point (hadn't even taken the airlock off the primary). I'll condition for at least two weeks prior to tasting again. Everything was sanitized to the nth degree (not worried there).

EDIT: Hops were from northern brewer (pellets). My notes state that they had a good strong smell and were stored in a cool dry place until ready to use. That is about all I could tell you with respect to the hops.


zoebisch01 said:
In order to gauge if anything went wrong, some gravities, volumes and a recipe would help us along :)

4 lb. Pale malt extract syrup, unhopped
2 lb. Amber Lager LME (as per OP, this changed and will most likely darken things up as well as lower gravity a tad)
1 oz. of Nugget @ 30
1 oz. of Cascade @ 60
2 packets of dried ale yeast (mutons - rehydrated)

Didn't bother with the hydro first time out, I know...should have, I will next batch. The volumes as stated were a three gallon boil topped off in the primary with an addtional two to get to five total.
 
flat beer doesn't taste the same as carb'd beer. its surprising what those bubbles do to expose the flavor to the tongue and the aroma to the nose.
 
Just bittering and flavor adds, no aroma (5 min.) add? As mentioned, mouthfeel will change once it is carbonated. Without an aroma add or dry hopping, you won't have much of a nose.

You have more of a Bitter than a Pale. If you had used the Nugget at 60 and split the Cascades at 30 & 5, you would have had a very different beer.
 
gwood said:
4 lb. Pale malt extract syrup, unhopped
2 lb. Amber Lager LME (as per OP, this changed and will most likely darken things up as well as lower gravity a tad)
1 oz. of Nugget @ 30
1 oz. of Cascade @ 60
2 packets of dried ale yeast (mutons - rehydrated)

Didn't bother with the hydro first time out, I know...should have, I will next batch. The volumes as stated were a three gallon boil topped off in the primary with an addtional two to get to five total.

Now did you add the hops 30 miutes into the boil and 60 minutes into the boil or did you add the hops and then let the wort boil for 60 minutes and 30 minutes. How long was your total boil time? Was it a rolling boil or just a simmer, hop utilization and the creation of IBUs from AAUs requires a rolling boil, this is why so many people have boilovers.
 
With nothing but pale and lager extract you certainly won't get a lot of malt flavour. As others have pointed out it would come down to hops timing in the boil at that point. Based on the way you wrote out the recipe I would guess that you added the cascade 60 minutes INTO the boil rather than with 60 minutes LEFT in the boil. But maybe that's just a miscommunication.
 
Beer probably tastes the thinnest at bottling time. The yeast has fallen out. The beer is room temperature. There is no carbonation. And the beer is still generally green.

Believe me…let those bottles sit at around 70 degrees for 21-25 days. Chill for a week and then report back.
 
Donasay said:
Now did you add the hops 30 miutes into the boil and 60 minutes into the boil or did you add the hops and then let the wort boil for 60 minutes and 30 minutes. How long was your total boil time? Was it a rolling boil or just a simmer, hop utilization and the creation of IBUs from AAUs requires a rolling boil, this is why so many people have boilovers.

Here is the process from my notes:

- Boiled three gallons
- Removed from heat
- Added LME and stirred until completely disolved
- Brought wort back to a boil
- Added 1oz of nugget once wort hit full boil
- Started timed one hour boil
- Added 1oz cascade

This is where my notes/memory get a bit hazy. When I went back and read my previous post adding hops at 30 minutes and 60 minutes doesn't jive with my notes. As per above though, I don't know how long I boiled after adding the cascade. I think that this is at least part of the slip up, I should've added the cascades in the last fifteen minutes of the hour long boil (as per Palmer) and then cooled.

EDIT: Missed some other comments...

roofman70 said:
is there any taste to it at all?

It does, there is a very light tinge of the nuggets and just a tad bit of the cascade (reminds me of a 50% watered down Mirror Pond if you've had it). As another post mentioned there isn't much of a malt profile up front or in the middle.

bradsul said:
With nothing but pale and lager extract you certainly won't get a lot of malt flavour. As others have pointed out it would come down to hops timing in the boil at that point. Based on the way you wrote out the recipe I would guess that you added the cascade 60 minutes INTO the boil rather than with 60 minutes LEFT in the boil. But maybe that's just a miscommunication.

Yep. The prime character of the beer (being that the LME had to be adjusted from the original recipe) would have been the hops. I added the cascade 60 minutes in and added the nuggets at the START of the 60 minute boil.
 
gwood said:
...Yep. The prime character of the beer (being that the LME had to be adjusted from the original recipe) would have been the hops. I added the cascade 60 minutes in and added the nuggets at the START of the 60 minute boil.
OK that would pretty much explain the flavour then. You always get a small amount of flavour from your bittering hops (which you mentioned) but you had no actual flavouring additions. That coupled with the pale and lager extract means there's not a whole lot of flavour in that beer. The cascade addition right at the end of the boil wouldn't have had time to give too much flavour but it should have added a nice nose.

That same recipe but with the cascade split at say 15 minutes and 5 minutes would have given you a nice hop flavour.

But hey at least it's beer! :mug: Think about doing your exact recipe again but with the different hop schedule so you can see the difference it will make - great learning experience!
 
bradsul said:
OK that would pretty much explain the flavour then. You always get a small amount of flavour from your bittering hops (which you mentioned) but you had no actual flavouring additions. That coupled with the pale and lager extract means there's not a whole lot of flavour in that beer. The cascade addition right at the end of the boil wouldn't have had time to give too much flavour but it should have added a nice nose.

That same recipe but with the cascade split at say 15 minutes and 5 minutes would have given you a nice hop flavour.

But hey at least it's beer! :mug: Think about doing your exact recipe again but with the different hop schedule so you can see the difference it will make - great learning experience!

When you say 15 and 5, you are refering to the time left on the hour boil correct?

All in all, if I can just take good notes and pay attention I would hope to learn something from each batch. I really like the process.
 
Yup, hop additions are always given as the amount of time they are IN the boil.

Eg.)
Northern Brewer, 30G @ 60 min
Cascade 15G @ 15 min
Cascade 15G @ 5 min

Your northern brewer would go in right at the start of your boil, the first cascade goes in 45 minutes later and the second cascade goes in 10 minutes after that. All of which assumes a 60 minute boil of course. If you did a 90 minute boil you would wait 30 minutes before you added the 60 minute hops. Hope that is clear as mud now, have a few 5PM Wednesday beers in me now. :D
 
bradsul said:
Yup, hop additions are always given as the amount of time they are IN the boil.

Eg.)
Northern Brewer, 30G @ 60 min
Cascade 15G @ 15 min
Cascade 15G @ 5 min

Your northern brewer would go in right at the start of your boil, the first cascade goes in 45 minutes later and the second cascade goes in 10 minutes after that. All of which assumes a 60 minute boil of course. If you did a 90 minute boil you would wait 30 minutes before you added the 60 minute hops. Hope that is clear as mud now, have a few 5PM Wednesday beers in me now. :D

Thanks. Sounds like I've got a pretty mellow brew on my hands, but brew none the less. Look at it this way...it'll go down quick. Started up EdWort's Apfelwein today as I've got to get a decent setup for controlling my fermentation temps prior to doing another beer (I ran the air in that room for TWO weeks!).

Chest freezer here I come :)
 
HBDrinker008 said:
maybe consider some steeping grains next time too...very easy

Most definitely. I've just been searching around trying to find a good resource for extract recipes that call for steeping grains. Any suggestions are more than welcome.

Thanks to everybody that posted. I'll plan on doing this brew again soon as I now have three 6.5 carboys and one 5 gallon. Hardest part is choosing the next recipe.
 
Back
Top