We Need A Condensed Thread To The Point - This one

I've subscribed to so many threads with so much info and so many opinions I'm burned out.

I say we need a single place for collective wisdom. We need to answer these questions for people in one place. Here are the questions:

"Once my cider is fully fermented out, and I rack into a clean container, then add a sweetner (concentrate for example) and the carbonation starts back up:

1. How long until I bottle in "Grolsch" type bottles?
2. How long do I let it go (bottle condition) before I pasteurize?
3. Will Pasteurizing stop the new fermentation I am striving for in order to make it fizzy?
4. How long on the stove top in a kettle of water with the lids on my fermenting cider do I leave my golden nectar in order to reach the desired pasteurizing temp?
5. Do I then just turn off the heat and refrigerate my bottles of perfectly carbonated, slightly sweet, kick ^$$ cider? And if so, will the bottles stop building up pressure in the Frigidare? And then, if so, how long can I store them before the explode?"

I know. All of this is out there. But could we collaborate to put this important info in one place, maybe even headed for a "sticky"?

Come on. There is a lot of real life experience that could be condensed here and I need your help and I suspect a lot of others do too.

What we need is a HomeBrewTalk book! Step by step instruction, a collection of recipies, and trouble shooting.

Maybe an ebook... one for each type of brew (beer, wine, cider, and mead) and one for unusual types of brews like kombucha, sake, and plum wine. Maybe split the beer into a few books.

Hmm, maybe got carried away there... anyways, not a bad idea. Lets see if it catches on.

Devo9 said:

What we need is a HomeBrewTalk book! Step by step instruction, a collection of recipies, and trouble shooting.

Maybe an ebook... one for each type of brew (beer, wine, cider, and mead) and one for unusual types of brews like kombucha, sake, and plum wine. Maybe split the beer into a few books.

Hmm, maybe got carried away there... anyways, not a bad idea. Lets see if it catches on.

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This man is a genius

I am also burned out with the lengthy discussion of certain topics. The real answers get buried so deep within the threads that people just keep going on and on about something. But it's good for business here.

I love how this is already getting off topic and now I'm contributing to this. But since I've already started, I like the book idea. Someone would really need to take the reigns on that so it probably won't happen but it would be interesting.

REcidermaker said:

This man is a genius

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Thank you!

inhousebrew said:

I love how this is already getting off topic and now I'm contributing to this. But since I've already started, I like the book idea. Someone would really need to take the reigns on that so it probably won't happen but it would be interesting.

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I'll take the reigns.... then get distracted 1/10 of the way in, and forget about it! Yeah, it sounds like a plan!!!

UncaMarc, sorry about derailing your thread... :-(

Devo9 said:

UncaMarc, sorry about derailing your thread... :-(

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That's okay. Maybe somebody will get us back on track.

Luckily all the answers are already in Papper's pasteurization sticky thread.

UncaMarc, I've followed a number of your threads here and I think this post finally explains why you're having so much trouble. A forum is not a beginners guide to making cider. Rather, it's a tool best at discussing specific aspect and techniques of cider making. These topics are difficult to piece together without an overall understanding of the basic process and how they relate. First one needs to grasp the fundamentals of cidermaking and fermentation and then delve into the minutia and detail.

Take time to read and understand an overall guide such as http://makinghardcider.com/ or buy either of the books by Anne Proulx or Ben Watson. Then come back here and search/ask for more info to flesh out your knowledge.

I agree that there are many answers in many places here on the forum-- but that is no different than any other forum out there. I appreciate that most brewing veterans have an open ear and answer questions on this forum. That being said(typed), almost all of these beginner questions have been answered hundreds, maybe thousands, of times. On other not so friendly forums, people get flamed for not using the search function. While the flaming is unnecessary, it is logical, and teaches people how to navigate forums quickly. New members here often type "I skipped a bunch of this thread. Was this question answered???"
You'd think that stickies are the answer, but many members and lurkers skip over them. Just venting here. I apologize if I'm offending anyone. In my opinion, there is all the info available in the forum already.

LeBreton said:

Luckily all the answers are already in Papper's pasteurization sticky thread.

UncaMarc, I've followed a number of your threads here and I think this post finally explains why you're having so much trouble. A forum is not a beginners guide to making cider. Rather, it's a tool best at discussing specific aspect and techniques of cider making. These topics are difficult to piece together without an overall understanding of the basic process and how they relate. First one needs to grasp the fundamentals of cidermaking and fermentation and then delve into the minutia and detail.

Take time to read and understand an overall guide such as http://makinghardcider.com/ or buy either of the books by Anne Proulx or Ben Watson. Then come back here and search/ask for more info to flesh out your knowledge.

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Currently HBT is taking submissions for brew related articles. I bet you it won't be long before there is an article section that will cover most of the common issues that new brewers have. Hold on tight, it's going to be one hell of a ride!

So who wants to edit my 1/10 complete HBT cider book when I get it done.... or... errrr.... partly done? lol (couldn't resist)

LeBreton said:

UncaMarc, I've followed a number of your threads here and I think this post finally explains why you're having so much trouble. A forum is not a beginners guide to making cider. Rather, it's a tool best at discussing specific aspect and techniques of cider making. These topics are difficult to piece together without an overall understanding of the basic process and how they relate. First one needs to grasp the fundamentals of cidermaking and fermentation and then delve into the minutia and detail.

Take time to read and understand an overall guide such as http://makinghardcider.com/ or buy either of the books by Anne Proulx or Ben Watson. Then come back here and search/ask for more info to flesh out your knowledge.

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Thanks for the suggestion. I've looked at the link you sent but didn't see where rank arrogance was a necessary ingredient to successful cider making.

You might think that a forum is limited to those who already know so much that they only come here to show off, but for some of us who read many of the threads (like me) my suggestion was simply that sometimes it is a good idea to TTT a concise guide for certain techniques.

Unlike some people I have traveled quite a bit to visit cideries. I have studied a number of methods. I have read several books and I have quite a bit of cider in various phases of production.

In addition I have also finished a few gallons and served them to guests with a very high approval rating.

Sometimes I ask questions to spark discussion or to help others.

I appreciate your info, just not your tone.

I'm sorry if my post came of as arrogant, that was definitely not my intention. Rather, I was agreeing with you that due to it's format and way of operation a forum is better at answering specific question as opposed to providing a general introduction of the topic whereas there do exist other mediums which do in a more organized fashion.


Personally, I think it would be cool to have a flow-chart style guide to making cider with yes/no questions based on goals and equipment.

for example:
Do you want to make a sweet, sparkling cider? - Yes
Do you have a kegging system? - No
Do you want to use unfermetable sugars? - No
Do you have a pot big enough to pasteurize bottles in? - Yes

With each choice having a link to a guide to that particular technique and maybe a pro/con list for things like coldcrashing V. Pasteurizing.

LeBreton said:

I'm sorry if my post came of as arrogant, that was definitely not my intention. Rather, I was agreeing with you that due to it's format and way of operation a forum is better at answering specific question as opposed to providing a general introduction of the topic whereas there do exist other mediums which do in a more organized fashion.


Personally, I think it would be cool to have a flow-chart style guide to making cider with yes/no questions based on goals and equipment.

for example:
Do you want to make a sweet, sparkling cider? - Yes
Do you have a kegging system? - No
Do you want to use unfermetable sugars? - No
Do you have a pot big enough to pasteurize bottles in? - Yes

With each choice having a link to a guide to that particular technique and maybe a pro/con list for things like coldcrashing V. Pasteurizing.

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Thanks for the clarification. Sounds like a good idea. Want to work on it together? We can divide up duties, scour the forum and maybe create that helpful checklist/flow chart.

UncaMarc said:

Thanks for the clarification. Sounds like a good idea. Want to work on it together? We can divide up duties, scour the forum and maybe create that helpful checklist/flow chart.

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Absolutely I'd be in for helping. Been considering writing an article on cider for the site, but it's hard to decide where to start and what exactly to cover. Especially hard since there is rarely a 'best' answer, due to all the variables in ingredients, equipment, & motivation etc.

If you want to try to pin down a focus we could build on that.