MirImage
Well-Known Member
I have made this 3 times and each time hasn't shown more then a tiny layer if bubbles even when the airlock is going crazy. You are probably fine.
Man, I love Apfelwein
- Thread starter EdWort
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So I just mixed up my first batch. I used a glass carboy. Do I need to cover it to keep the light out? It's going to be hard to wait for this to be ready to drink. Thanks for the recipe Ed!
Yeah I was wondering this as well. Also, what is optimal temp? I googled montrachet yeast and a website said 60-80ish, but just trying to confirm. I will be keeping mine in room temp (roughly 77 Fahrenheit)
Also, how long does it take for fermentation to start? It's been 2 hours and not much activity going on. I'm afraid of such a huge batch getting stuck.
Yeast generally prefers darkness - just toss an old towel around it...it'll help keep a constant temp anyway.
Optimum temps are defined by your yeast choice. Obviously, consider the range stated on the package. The higher end will give you faster fermentation, more yeast-derived aromas and flavors, while the lower end will take longer, but give you a cleaner-tasting result. Most people just go with the room temp of an interior closet or basement, yeah, you guessed it, somewhere between 60 and 80. Below 55 or 60, your yeast may work extremely slowly or stop altogether (leaving you with undrinkably sweet syrup), much above 80 and you'll be getting more harsh results and rocket fuel to drink.
How long fermentation takes to start depends on your sanitation, health of your yeast, amount of yeast/size of your starter, liquid temp, ambient room temp, potential of thermal or sugar-shock to the yeast being added, air pressure within the fermentation vessel, etc. In other words, you haven't supplied nearly enough information for us to diagnose your fermentation start. That said, you're worrying after 2 hours? First, you may see NOTHING when fermentation starts...watching airlocks, looking for bubbles or sediment, etc. are all famously poor indicators. The only way to be sure is to take gravity readings with a hydrometer or spectrometer regularly and see that it is dropping. If you are a really paranoid type, I highly suggest buying a spare hydrometer, sanitizing it well, and simply leaving it in your carboy - you can see at a glance what it going on. Then simply RDWHAHB!!!
Hey that hydrometer in the carboy idea sounds neat. Might have to try that.
I wasn't really thinking of carbing this, but I just saw this thread and holy crap when he pours the cider into a glass the cider fizzing looks like diamonds.
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f32/easy-stove-top-pasteurizing-pics-193295/
Thanks DarkBrood for the reply. I wrapped a blanket around it.
FuzzeWuzze
I Love DIY
You should be fine, i fill mine pretty high, this produces no real krausen like beer. This yeast just has little CO2 bubbles that pile up near the top in a ring.
Give it 24 hours, it will go trust me. In a carboy you will see big waves of co2 flowing up the neck area of your Carboy soon enough.
TimpanogosSlim
Well-Known Member
Well, premier cuvee produced one little eruption of krausen in my apfelwein. Day 2 of fermentation i had to swap out the airlock for one that wasn't full of yeast. I filled my 18L carboy pretty close to the bottom of the neck.
jeepinjeepin
Well-Known Member
irchowi said:
Yeah, you are fine filling it pretty high. Check this out.
Last edited by a moderator:
Good thing I'm not using lalvin 1118 or I would have apple juice all over my closet. I actually had the carboy suck water from the fermentation lock so its even fuller now.
If I plan to carbonate, wine bottles and corks wouldn't be suitable would it?
i'm planning on going to the local pub and asking them for their beer bottles.
If I plan to carbonate, wine bottles and corks wouldn't be suitable would it?
i'm planning on going to the local pub and asking them for their beer bottles.
I know the answer is here SOMEWHERE in this thread... but I don't have the patience to read through 10,000 replies. LOL
What is the recommended formula/ingredient for backsweetening? Small can of apple juice concentrate? Large can?
What do you add to the fermented apfelwein to prevent further fermentation after backsweetening? What quantity?
Thanks!
What is the recommended formula/ingredient for backsweetening? Small can of apple juice concentrate? Large can?
What do you add to the fermented apfelwein to prevent further fermentation after backsweetening? What quantity?
Thanks!
TimpanogosSlim
Well-Known Member
Never used 1118 in cider but i used it in my skeeterpee and it actually foams at the top. not quite krausen but almost. That one has about a gallon of headspace.
I may use 1118 in my next batch of apfelwein, which I'm considering because there seems to be a deal on kirkland brand apple juice. Maybe four gallons of apple and a few quarts of whatever looks good at the grocery store in my other 18L carboy.
And yet my first batch of apfelwein isn't ready for drinking yet.
There's lots of different ways actually, which is why I get kind of confused trying to figure it out.
To backsweeten, you can use potassium sorbate and sulphite to stop fermentation and then add sugar/concentrate. Or you can add non fermentable sugars like splenda.
cold crashing is another way, keeping it in the fridge so that it's too cold for fermentation to start. Or you can pasteurize it.
Here's the thread on pasteurization:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f32/easy-stove-top-pasteurizing-pics-193295/
Well I made Joe's quick grape mead with 1118 with only a few inches of headspace and yeah there's no krausen but the foaming was so intense that it went up into the lock and spilled out of the carboy.
I just started brewing this july and i haven't really tasted anything I've made yet but I'm really excited about apfelwein. I hope it lives up to its hype.
You don't need to read through all 10,000 replies (you could use the search functions!)....someone asks this again about every 3 days or so....if you read 4 or 5 pages of posts, you'll probably see the question (and answers) more than once.
detlion1643
Well-Known Member
Well, I bottled all of mine on 8/9 and since then, I consumed 2 bottles of it already. The first wasn't that great, it was room temp, and one night I just couldn't wait longer to try it.
However, the second bottle, amazing!!! It was chilled for 2-3 days in the fridge, and even though it was dry, being chilled, it was soooo smooth! It was the perfect compliment after mowing the grass in the sun! This is definately going to be available every day.
Oh, and official, EdWort, you MF'er (J/K)
!!!!
However, the second bottle, amazing!!! It was chilled for 2-3 days in the fridge, and even though it was dry, being chilled, it was soooo smooth! It was the perfect compliment after mowing the grass in the sun! This is definately going to be available every day.
Oh, and official, EdWort, you MF'er (J/K)
!!!!
Chuckabrewski
Well-Known Member
detlion1643 said:Well, I bottled all of mine on 8/9 and since then, I consumed 2 bottles of it already. The first wasn't that great, it was room temp, and one night I just couldn't wait longer to try it.
However, the second bottle, amazing!!! It was chilled for 2-3 days in the fridge, and even though it was dry, being chilled, it was soooo smooth! It was the perfect compliment after mowing the grass in the sun! This is definately going to be available every day.
Oh, and official, EdWort, you MF'er (J/K)
Was it carbed up already?
detlion1643
Well-Known Member
I didn't carb it. I kept it still and dry. Ended up chilling another bottle for this weekend for more people to try! I'm gonna run out before my next batch is ready. Being the first one I made, I didn't take notice to the "start another batch in 2 weeks"... I should've done that. :rockin:
Man I can't wait to get into my first batch of this stuff. I made it back at the end of May and I bottled it a couple weeks ago so I've been letting it carb up. I think I'm gonna throw one in the fridge when I get off work tonight, should have thought to do it this morning though.
tried this a few weeks ago you can read my recipe and experience here http://angryocelotbrewing.blogspot.com/2012/08/cider-apfelwein.html
Haven't tasted it yet but I'm hoping this turns out good because it is soooo easy to make
Haven't tasted it yet but I'm hoping this turns out good because it is soooo easy to make
FuzzeWuzze
I Love DIY
Would aging this (after fermentation is done) in a keezer or some other cold environment make things better, worse? Speed up drinkability?
I have two that fermented out totally dry, i can just keep them in my closet at around 68-70, but have a new chest freezer for storing kegs and probably have room for 1 Carboy, so curious if there would be a benefit to storing it in there at 35-40F
I have two that fermented out totally dry, i can just keep them in my closet at around 68-70, but have a new chest freezer for storing kegs and probably have room for 1 Carboy, so curious if there would be a benefit to storing it in there at 35-40F
jeepinjeepin
Well-Known Member
FuzzeWuzze said:
america said:
It should clear quicker, but age slower in a cold environment.
jprice
Well-Known Member
I made a batch of this up a few days ago. With 10,000+posts I figured you might be on to something. Hopfully i didn't stray too far from your recipe by adding 2# of brown sugar and 12 cinnamon sticks.
TimpanogosSlim
Well-Known Member
Yeah, you may have added 11 cinnamon sticks too many. It might be alright if you fish them out now.
FuzzeWuzze
I Love DIY
People tend to go crazy with the spices, i read yesterday of a guy who put a half dollar sized bundle of cloves into his 5g batch of cider....he's gonna have to age it forever to get that clove taste out.
TimpanogosSlim
Well-Known Member
But on the plus side, if he gets a tooth ache or a canker sore, he's golden.
bigbeergeek
Well-Known Member
FuzzeWuzze
I Love DIY
That will never, ever age out.
yea, probably not.but better trying than just dumping it
ArcaneXor
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I just poured myself the contents of an unlabeled bottle that I figure must be at least four years old - and it turns out that it's from my very first batch of Apfelwein. Very delicious. I need to make another batch sometime soon...
evilpresence
Member
Made 10 gallons on Saturday for December. Didn't take long for the bubbles to start and they are moving pretty hardcore right now. My carboy storage area smells like apples and vodka (use it in the airlock)!
nootay
Well-Known Member
well i finally started a batch! ive been saying i was going to for months now. my sg was 1.060 with 5 gallons of pure apple juice and 2 pounds of sugar. montrachet is bubbling away. im going to try and hold off putting it on gas until december.
ArcaneXor
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Very wine-like, except with light carbonation. Dry, but with noticeable apple aroma. No off-flavors. Very good overall - it was a nice surprise.
Seems my fermenting is done (been about 2 1/2 weeks)
Any reason I couldn't rack this to corny keg, flush/pressurize with CO2 and let it age at room temp for the next 3-4 months? (room temp is controlled at 70-72 degrees)?
Or is it helpful to have an airlock to let out nasties and such?
Any reason I couldn't rack this to corny keg, flush/pressurize with CO2 and let it age at room temp for the next 3-4 months? (room temp is controlled at 70-72 degrees)?
Or is it helpful to have an airlock to let out nasties and such?
Made a 5 gallon batch of this a week ago and I'm thinking of bottling 2 different versions of it.
Some of it will be bottled as is, flat with no backsweetening in wine bottles and corks.
The rest will be carbed and backsweetened. I'm thinking of backsweetening with apple juice concentrate. Has anyone tried this? Does anyone have a good ratio of concentrate to apfelwein I can follow?
Also, I will be pasteurizing both the still and carb'd batch. I hear that it's not a good idea to dump wine bottles and corks in a hot water bath and someone suggested that i'd have to rack the apfelwein itself into a pot and heat it directly. Would this be a problem from exposing it to oxygen?
Some of it will be bottled as is, flat with no backsweetening in wine bottles and corks.
The rest will be carbed and backsweetened. I'm thinking of backsweetening with apple juice concentrate. Has anyone tried this? Does anyone have a good ratio of concentrate to apfelwein I can follow?
Also, I will be pasteurizing both the still and carb'd batch. I hear that it's not a good idea to dump wine bottles and corks in a hot water bath and someone suggested that i'd have to rack the apfelwein itself into a pot and heat it directly. Would this be a problem from exposing it to oxygen?
There shouldn't be too much in the way of airborne "nasties" once the ferment is complete - little to no issue of rests for diacetyl and the like. To rack and/or filter and the pressurize your apfelwine is primarily going to separate your fermented wine from the lees and a significant portion of your remaining active yeast.
Separating your wine from your lees early (especially if your yeast has flocculated out to leave a bright/clear product) is going to slow down your conditioning as fewer yeast cells will be active with far fewer nutrients available.
However, you may also want to consider the impact of flavor and aroma on this decision. All packaged apple juice (and especially concentrates) contain actual particles of apple fibers and various trace components that have an impact on flavor, aroma, and body. Like beers, meads, and other wines, something happens during aging/conditioning with all of these components both during and after primary fermentation - and while the actions are still not understood, the results are undeniable: flavors/aromas blending and mellowing, while others appear from "nowhere" and become highlights. This is often when unusual aromas appear in wines, such as some of the tropical and floral notes (ones not created by the yeast itself that appear only after extended aging). By removing the apple particles early, you will be reducing the potential for apple flavor/aroma in your end product. If you want a flavor more like a generic white wine, that could be a good thing - if you're going for a refined-cider-taste, then you'll want to leave them in contact for as long as possible. EdWort (the OP for this recipe) recommends a maximum of 3 months on the lees - many posters here go longer, many shorter. There may be no consensus, but majority opinion seems to be 8-10 weeks before racking or bottling for best "apfelwine" results.
Of course, it should be pointed out that EdWort's recipe is not exactly traditional to the local Frankfurt-area apfelwine it is modeled after. The original style has no extra added sugar and is never (or extremely rarely) carbonated. Traditionally drunk VERY young (and so quite tart), most Germans sweeten it before drinking (the standard rather than the exception). Like fedderweisse, apfelwine's original place in the seasons was a harvest-time alcoholic beverage that had very fast turnaround time and often drunk with the yeast still active for added nutrients.
Justintoxicated
Well-Known Member
Ok so my apfelwein has been sitting in the carboy in my fermentation chest for 2 months 64-68 degrees. I need space for more brews. Can I remove the carboy and let it age the last month at about 85 degrees?
