American IPA Bell's Two Hearted Ale Clone (close as they come)

Thank you, sir. I hope that someone can answer your question regarding the shifting taste.

Lando said:

Damn, now I can't be sure, but I am almost positive this was it. (I am not near my computer with beertools)

Light LME-7.5 lbs
Cara-pils .5 lbs
C-20 .5 lbs
Centennial .5oz 60 mins
Centennial .5oz 45 mins
Centennial .5oz 30 mins
Centennial .5oz 15 mins
Centennial .5oz flameout
Centennial 1 oz DH

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aaaaaaand sig'd!

Jared311 said:

Brewing this recipe as we drink... I mean speak.

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I brewed a full-boil extract version of this on Saturday. I modified just a tad according to the hop schedule as well as the ingredients used (based on availability at my LHBS). Here's what I used:


.5 lb Caravienne (Belgian, Castle)
.5 lb light munich (Weyermann)
.5 lb Light Caramel Pils (Briess)

8 lbs Light LME
1 oz Centennial (6% AA) @ 60 minutes
.5 oz Centennial (6% AA) @ 15 minutes
.5 oz Centennial (6% AA) @ 5 minutes
WLP051 Yeast (No starter)
I plan on dry hopping 2 oz Centennial after primary ferm is complete

I'm worried that I won't get the full bitterness that I'm looking for in this clone as the AA is a bit lower than expected for the Centennial hops, but I don't doubt it'll be good. I actually think this is going to turn out awesome.

I'm planning on brewing this recipe this weekend. (my first all-grain effort).

I've got a noob question about all-grain on this recipes with so much grain (13lbs!):

With 13 lbs of grain, you'll need like 4 gallons of water for the mash (1.25 quarts/per lbs of grain), then an additional 5 or 6 gallons of water for the sparge (1.5 times more than mash water). How do you get a yield of 5.5 gallons.

I must be missing something on technique.

Thanks for even considering answering a noob question on this recipe.

My grain absorption for 13 lbs would have been 2.275 gal. that leaves you with 7.725 gal. I tpically boil off 1.5 gal for an your. That leaves you with 6.225. Figure .5 gal loss for hops and such, that gets you down to about 5.725.

smakudwn said:

My grain absorption for 13 lbs would have been 2.275 gal. that leaves you with 7.725 gal. I tpically boil off 1.5 gal for an your. That leaves you with 6.225. Figure .5 gal loss for hops and such, that gets you down to about 5.725.

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I spent some time on the "read this first" thread for all-grain brewing and the first point of confusion was noted about sparge water. Palmer from How to Brew (Chapter 17) has some calculations that show a larger quantity of water for the rinse.

smakudwn are you using 1/2 the volume of mash water for the sparge? Also do you normally boil for an hour before you start the hop additions? Or just in these heavy grain beers?

Thanks again!

Smakudwn beat me to it. +1 to his answer. Make sure you're relaxed while you do this. If I didn't have a friend over I would have gone nuts during my first all grain batch. Good luck. All grain rocks.

I brewed this 6/1/2010 and it was actually great at 19-20 days so we've been drinking it. Had to sub for the 60 minute hops because I was short Centennial. After brewing I received a few bottles from another HBT'er in trade and yesterday we did a side by side. I'll use my neighbors comments because I think he nailed it pretty well. Two Hearted was hoppier and finished hoppier, more bitter and less sweet compared to mine. Ultimately he liked mine better and felt that Two H, tasted like many commercial IPA's. My wife really likes the clone.

I pretty much like them both, but I can clearly see the difference in the hop bite and I really don't think mine is sweet, it just lacks the sharp hop presence. The color was spot on, the aroma was exact, the head was the same. Mine was a bit cloudy being that it is still only 26 days young.

So my thoughts are next time, use something closer to the correct yeast and/or some Gypsum in the boil. Also go all Centennial.

Any other suggestions????

Kettle Volume: 13.33 gal (S.G.: 1.053)
Boil Duration: 1.25 hr
Evaporation: 1.88 gal
Water Volume Added: 0.0 gal
Final Volume: 11.0 gal (S.G.: 1.064)
Efficiency: 74.75%
Attenuation: 75.0%
Evap/Hour: 1.5 gal
Ingredients:
22 lb GW NW Pale
4.00 lb Vienna Malt
1.0 lb Crystal 15
0.75 oz Zeus sub for Centennial (16.4%) - added during boil, boiled 60.0 min
1.5 oz Centennial (7.8%) - added during boil, boiled 45.0 min
1.5 oz Centennial (7.8%) - added during boil, boiled 30.0 min
1.5 oz Centennial (7.8%) - added during boil, boiled 15.0 min
0.75 oz Centennial (7.8%) - steeped after boil
0.75 oz Centennial (7.8%) - added dry to secondary fermenter 5 gallons only
1 tsp Wyeast Nutrient - added during boil, boiled 10.0 min
2.0 ea Whirlfloc - added during boil, boiled 7.0 min
2.0 ea Fermentis US-05 Safale US-05
Water:
1.8 g Baking Soda ()
0.0 g Calcium Chloride (+CL, Ca) (Calcium Chloride (anhydrous))
6.4 g Epsom Salts (Magnesium Sulfate)
16.7 g Gypsum (Ca & SO4) (Calcium Sulfate)
1.8 g Table Salt (Sodium Chloride)
9.25 gal Distilled Water

does anyone actually finish at 1.010? I made my second batch of this a little while ago and it looks like it may finish around 1.013, right where my first batch finished. I mashed at 151 for 90 minutes and I'm definitely not underpitching.

I tried an experiment on my current batch (3rd of this recipe). OG was 1.063, after two weeks using 051 yeast she was sitting solid at 1.014. This is where the other two batches stopped and I was very happy with the beer. However.....nothing is sacred... After the two weeks I added a packet of Notty right outta the package and moved the primary to my beer room @ 70 degrees. Not much noticable fermentation but a week later came in at 1.011. Dry hopping now with 2oz of centennial, but tastes great and is now pushing closer to Bell's 7%.

I used WLP007 dry English ale (which has become my go to strain for any kind of pale) and went from 1.064 to 1.010 in 4 days. I have yet to taste it, but it smells great. I recommend 007 for any pale ale or ipa. Love it.

mb2696 said:

does anyone actually finish at 1.010? I made my second batch of this a little while ago and it looks like it may finish around 1.013, right where my first batch finished. I mashed at 151 for 90 minutes and I'm definitely not underpitching.

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well i spoke too soon again. it's sitting at 1.008 right now, but my OG was pretty low @ 1.058.

I started at 1.066 and finished at 1.008 using 2 pkgs of notingham.

i brewed this over the weekend. i used the exact same grain bill but with 75% efficiency only got 1.05 starting gravity. i would recommend boosting the grain bill if you have efficiency in the 70-80% range.

the OG after the boil was 1.056

adamtopher said:

i brewed this over the weekend. i used the exact same grain bill but with 75% efficiency only got 1.05 starting gravity. i would recommend boosting the grain bill if you have efficiency in the 70-80% range.

the OG after the boil was 1.056

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You measure the OG after the boil. And according to Bell's website, the OG is 1.064

yep. i mentioned my pre-boil starting gravity that i got with my efficiency of 75% which lead to a post-boil OG of 1.056.

just mentioning that i would need to boost my grain bill with my lower efficiency compared to the recipe author.

adamtopher said:

yep. i mentioned my pre-boil starting gravity that i got with my efficiency of 75% which lead to a post-boil OG of 1.056.

just mentioning that i would need to boost my grain bill with my lower efficiency compared to the recipe author.

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You could've boiled longer as well, although you wouldn't end up with as much beer.

My eff is around 72% and I hit my numbers with beersmith conversion from 75% to my 72. No biggie......

Gonna brew this this weekend. I'm adjusting it a bit due to different hops. I'm going to use Nelson Sauvin Hops and some Yeast from a local Brewing company which I think is California Ale yeast. Will let ya know how it turns out. I don't expect it to be that similar to Bell's but with such a Citric hops I think it will be good. I plan to name it "The Full Nelson" IPA.

My "Grass Hearted Ale" extract batch been on tap for about a week and a half now and while I think it's the best beer I've made to date, it's just a bit off from the real thing. I'll post my side-by-side comparison pics as soon as I can.

I didn't get the bitterness just right - most likely due to a lower AA% on my centennial hops. Other than that, the color is just a shade lighter but the aroma is just about the same.

Came in a little over OG with 1.068 (didn't have enough sparge water). If this finishes to 1.010, it'll be 7.5% ABV. Whoops!

Got a new mash tun and brewed this on Sunday. I came out with a Pre boil gravity of .056 and post boil of .059. I started with 6.5 gallons and ended up at 5.5 gallons. Seems like the gravity should have gone up a bit more post boil. According to beer calculus I got about 70% efficiency. Not too good compared to my 82% on my last batch. Got to figure out what happened.

EricT said:

Got a new mash tun and brewed this on Sunday. I came out with a Pre boil gravity of .056 and post boil of .059. I started with 6.5 gallons and ended up at 5.5 gallons. Seems like the gravity should have gone up a bit more post boil. According to beer calculus I got about 70% efficiency. Not too good compared to my 82% on my last batch. Got to figure out what happened.

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Did you get a 5 gallon or 10 gallon mash tun? Is this the first batch on your new mash tun? There a number of reasons for lesser efficiency.

I normally score mid to high 80's for eff but on this batch (mind you: I did a 10 gallon batch with only a ten gallon mash tun - it was a tight fit!) was low 70's. I've found that higher grain bills tend to leave me with not as great efficiency.

Got to account for all the hop absorbtion too. You may have burned off quite a bit less than the gallon you figured on. I dunno. 70% isn't bad at all....but when your planning on 80+.....that can suck.

My Mash tun is a 36qt Igloo Extreme. I used the same gain bill here on page one but was hoping for better efficiency. A couple things.
1. I didnt measure my Mash water correctly and ended up collecting about 2.6 gallons on my first runnings.
2. I added too much water to my sparge in order to make up for the 1st runnings. So pretty sure the efficiency issue is due to my not measuring correctly.
3. for some reason my sparge was only 151-150F when it should have been around 168. Not sure if the sparge temp would affect gravity. Thanks for the responses all.

Hello All,
I stumbled across this thread due to the bottle I am currently enjoying now. My wife picked up a few bottles for me on a recent trip. No date on bottle but Id assume fairly fresh. Its not as floral as west coast IPAs go but real clean malt profile with loads of the hops I love.
For a while now Ive been wanting to do a clone . I just wanted to say Thank You for the information that everyone has posted.

Update: Bottled this up today, was nice and clear in teh Carboy. Final Gravity was 1.005. Way lower than I expected, but I guess with the lower mash temp, it makes sense. Will be sure to mash higher next time for sure. Also i used California Ale yeast I got from a local brewery, which evidently was a beast of a yeast. The sample taste pretty good but very dry.

Here's my data:
Centennial IPA
14-B American IPA
Date: 7/11/10

Size: 5.25 gal
Efficiency: 73.04%
Attenuation: 79.4%
Calories: 208.78 kcal per 12.0 fl oz

Original Gravity: 1.063 (1.056 - 1.075)
Terminal Gravity: 1.013 (1.010 - 1.018)
Color: 6.79 (6.0 - 15.0)
Alcohol: 6.57% (5.5% - 7.5%)
Bitterness: 60.4 (40.0 - 70.0)

Ingredients:
10 lb 2-Row Brewers Malt
2 lb Vienna Malt
.5 lb Cara-Pils® Malt
.5 lb Crystal Malt 20°L
2 tsp Ferm-Cap S - added during boil, boiled 60 min
.5 oz Magnum (14.4%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min
42.52 g Centennial (8.7%) - added during boil, boiled 15 min
1 ea Whirlfloc Tablets (Irish moss) - added during boil, boiled 15 min
56.7 g Centennial (8.7%) - added during boil, boiled 5 min
2 oz Centennial (8.7%) - added dry to secondary fermenter
1 ea Fermentis US-05 Safale US-05

Schedule:
Ambient Air: 70.0 °F
Source Water: 60.0 °F
Elevation: 0.0 m

00:05:00 Mash In - Liquor: 5.5 gal; Strike: 169.47 °F; Target: 154.0 °F
01:05:00 Rest - Rest: 60 min; Final: 152.2 °F
01:05:00 Sparge - First runnings: 0.0 gal sparge @ 168.0 °F, 0.0 min; Sparge #1: 3.31 gal sparge @ 190.0 °F, 0.0 min; Total Runoff: 7.12 gal

Notes
dry hopped on 8/3

Results generated by BeerTools Pro 1.5.3

What I did differently:

1) Used Magnum as my 60 minute addition
2) Dry hopped with Centennial
3) Used S-05 instead of -04

Drinking one of these now. This is a great IPA! Not too bitter, loving the Centennial flavor, fantastic mouthfeel. I will be brewing this again.

BTW, I've never had a Bell's Two-Hearted, but if I come across it in a bar, I'll be ordering one!

Well Sunday I went to Bell's for the 25th anniversary thing. Went to their brewery for the tour and took a picture of the tag on one of the fermentors. My camera phone isn't too good, but it did give details on the dry hop....

16,741 gallons and the dry hop was 292 lbs. Doing the math... 292/16,741 = .017

.017 x 16oz = .272 oz per gallon.

I believe the original recipe here called for .5 oz. I know there are differences from commercial to home brewing... but Bell's uses almost triple the hops. I also asked the brewer stand around and he said they leave it on the dry hop for one week. He said they ferment for a week in a primary, temp controlled, then they transfer to other tank with the dry hops for a week where the temp is not really controlled, then transfer back to the primary tank where they can better control the temp and crash cool. He said this is because they don't filter any of their beers. On the far end blocked off from the tour was a filter, so I asked him what that was for then. He said they do filter all their lagers.

Here is the picture, hard to read, time for a new phone...

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos...00340922300794_2308487_66943343_5842424_n.jpg

Nice work, thanks!

JSomps6 said:

Well Sunday I went to Bell's for the 25th anniversary thing. Went to their brewery for the tour and took a picture of the tag on one of the fermentors. My camera phone isn't too good, but it did give details on the dry hop....

16,741 gallons and the dry hop was 292 lbs. Doing the math... 292/16,741 = .017

.017 x 16oz = .272 oz per gallon.

I believe the original recipe here called for .5 oz. I know there are differences from commercial to home brewing... but Bell's uses almost triple the hops. I also asked the brewer stand around and he said they leave it on the dry hop for one week. He said they ferment for a week in a primary, temp controlled, then they transfer to other tank with the dry hops for a week where the temp is not really controlled, then transfer back to the primary tank where they can better control the temp and crash cool. He said this is because they don't filter any of their beers. On the far end blocked off from the tour was a filter, so I asked him what that was for then. He said they do filter all their lagers.

Here is the picture, hard to read, time for a new phone...

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos...00340922300794_2308487_66943343_5842424_n.jpg

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So I've read through this entire thread and I'm trying to nail down the exact figures for this beer in order to get it as close as possible to the real thing. So far I have the OG as 1.064, and I think the dry hops should be more than usual. Several pages back I think I read that there's no Vienna, just 2-row. Nearly everyone seems to be using Vienna malt though.

I've been playing around in BeerSmith a bit, but can't for the life of me get this program to adjust for mash temperature. Surely this is a very important parameter which should be accounted for, no? The difference in finishing gravity and mouthfeel is huge between 149 and 155, but Beersmith doesn't change it's predicted finishing gravity at all. Any help here?

Here's what I have so far:

Batch Size: 6.00 gal
OG: 1.065
FG: 1.015
SRM: 6.1
IBU: 62
Efficiency: 75%

11 lbs 2-row
1.5 lbs Vienna
1 lb crystal 20
1/2 lb dextrose in boil
mash 60 min @ 150F

1.25 oz Centennial pellets 9.9% @ 60
1 oz Centennial @ 15
1 oz Centennial @ 10
1 oz Centennial @ 5
1 oz Centennial @ 0
1 oz Centennial dry-hop for 7 days in secondary

1/2 gallon starter of Wyeast 1272

Ferment at 65F for one week, rack to secondary on the dry hops for 7 days, rack to keg, carbonate and condition.

I added the corn sugar for the purpose of drying out the beer, but it's tough to know how this is going to come out if BeerSmith doesn't account for the mash temperature or the fact that corn sugar is more fermentable than 2-row. Surely BeerSmith is programmed with this in mind. Are there numbers which I can change to account for these things? I'm not trying to knock BeerSmith here, I'm just trying to get my numbers right before I brew this beer.

Lateralus, unfortunately, the mash temp doesn't adjust in Beersmith or any recipe tool that I know of. However, you should know what to expect from your Tun/Thermometer/Etc. In a perfect world, 149 will dry out quite a bit more (~.010) than 155, or maybe more. But, not all thermometers are created equal. That being said, plug in your 'actual' gravity based on what you know/think to predict better.

disclaimer - i've been drinking homebrew for the past 3 hours while i work on my brewery logo and update/cleanup my recipes. hopefully, the advice i offered is sound and coherent.

I've got a noob question....If I brew this beer and at completion of secondary, keg it, will it be fine for 2.5 months? If so, do I want to carbonate it before I leave it for that amount of time and do I want to refrigerate or let it sit @ about 55f. See I work on a ship and am gone for a few months at a time. With all the great reading/results here I really want to do this brew but with only 2 months off it would be tough to get it done (properly) and in my belly before I have to leave.

i'd probably brew it as close to the departure date as possible as i like my IPAs fresh. in 2 months time it will surely lose some of that hop aroma, but it will still be a great beer. i would probably dry-hop in the keg too, to try and keep some of that aroma throughout the life of the keg.

For whats its worth after trying a couple combos out, I think WLP001 is closer to Bell's strain then WLP051

swoody said:

I've got a noob question....If I brew this beer and at completion of secondary, keg it, will it be fine for 2.5 months? If so, do I want to carbonate it before I leave it for that amount of time and do I want to refrigerate or let it sit @ about 55f. See I work on a ship and am gone for a few months at a time. With all the great reading/results here I really want to do this brew but with only 2 months off it would be tough to get it done (properly) and in my belly before I have to leave.

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Like the other guy said, I;d time this that it goes into the secondary about the time you leave, then carb it accordingly. I'd dry hop when I got back for a couple of days so the aroma is still there.

I brewed this recipe about a week and a half ago, on Sunday the 12th to be exact. I opened the fermenter last night to check the gravity and it was at 1.011, so obviously it's pretty much done fermenting. (I used Bell's yeast harvested from 2 bottles of Oberon). But the beer was still very cloudy.

I plan on waiting a few more days before doing anything. But if it hasn't cleared up enough, should I use some gelatin? Unfortunately I don't have the ability to crash cool.

Also, should I transfer to a different bucket before dry-hopping, or does it matter?

I plan on using a hop bag to when I dry hop (I'll be using whole hops). Should I just throw it on top or should I weight it with something so the hops are submerged from the time I put them in?

Finally, is there any reason not to dry-hop longer than 5 days?

Just ordered the supplies to brew this (again, I think this'll make 15 or 20 gallons I've made)

I'm excited!

I used Bell's yeast in mine and no gelatin and it's crystal clear. BUT, I left it in primary for 3 or 4 weeks, and then racked to secondary for a week of dryhopping before bottling. Plus it's now been bottled for several weeks, so that helps too.

If I were you I would just let the yeast clean up after themselves for another couple of weeks and then dry hop. You can dry hop in the primary, but if clarity is a big concern I'd probably go ahead and rack it first.

I've always just racked onto loose hops (or dumped them on top in primary), but I'm seriously considering doing the weighted bag thing to try and submerge them. Good Luck!

pinkfloyd4ever said:

I brewed this recipe about a week and a half ago, on Sunday the 12th to be exact. I opened the fermenter last night to check the gravity and it was at 1.011, so obviously it's pretty much done fermenting. (I used Bell's yeast harvested from 2 bottles of Oberon). But the beer was still very cloudy.

I plan on waiting a few more days before doing anything. But if it hasn't cleared up enough, should I use some gelatin? Unfortunately I don't have the ability to crash cool.

Also, should I transfer to a different bucket before dry-hopping, or does it matter?

I plan on using a hop bag to when I dry hop (I'll be using whole hops). Should I just throw it on top or should I weight it with something so the hops are submerged from the time I put them in?

Finally, is there any reason not to dry-hop longer than 5 days?

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Brewed this today.

10lbs 2row
2lbs vienna
2lbs carapils

1oz 60 min
1 oz 45 min
.5 oz 30 min
1 oz 15 min
1 oz 5 min
.5 oz 1 min

Used a yeast cake of bells yeast from an oberon clone. The fermenter blew up after just 6 hours WOW.

Mashed at 150F and my og was 1.062.

Idk what my efficiency is because I don't have acces to beer smith.