What's with the BIAB fan boys?

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What's wrong with zealousness or fanboyism? I dont' BIAB, but get me talking about homebrewing and I'll be overzealous. I'm a boor at a party for sure.

Since when do we criticize our own members for being overzealous? Geez.
 
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passedpawn said:
What's wrong with zealousness or fanboyism? I dont' BIAB, but get me talking about homebrewing and I'll be overzealous. I'm a boor at a party for sure.

Since when do we criticize our own members for being overzealous? Geez.

There is a difference between being passionate about something and being dismissive about anything that you are not passionate about.
 
I've noticed the same. I hate to make this analogy, but it reminds me a lot of the DOS boys back in the late 80's early 90's. They took great pride in being able to make their systems do what they wanted, and definitely carried an attitude of elitism and snobbery, which was ironic because their computers all sucked. I'm not saying your systems suck. I mean having a motorized pulley system bolted to the garage ceiling is a pretty serious investment. But it definitely doesn't give license for any kind of attitude, especially when I'm making beer at 80% efficiency with one 10 gallon kettle and a water cooler.

Do you have a link so we can call them out?
Any who has some kind attitude over beer brewing is a bit of a ****** don't you think?
 
aubiecat said:
Do you have a link so we can call them out?
Any who has some kind attitude over beer brewing is a bit of a ****** don't you think?

Nah, I could never instigate something like that. Although I'll have to say, the BIAB attitude being discussed could be a knee jerk reaction to the attitude the "real" AG brewers give them. I know I've told people that IMHO BIAB sucks before lol. I tried it twice, and had an absolute nightmare with it. For me a cooler mashtun is easier and better on all accounts. That's me though. And passedpawn is right, as usual. We need to stick together as brew bros. Why, just a week ago a guy was having trouble hitting his FG, and I told him his problems would go away if he starting AG brewing. How *****ey was that?
 
There are fan boys for every aspect of homebrewing. BIAB zealots, All grain snobs, hop heads, maltsters, keggers, the thermapen salesmen!... Sometimes they're a little *****ey but personally I have learned a **** load from all of them. People just get really passionate about their technique, system, gadget; you just have to filter out the hammer over the head.
 
Although I'll have to say, the BIAB attitude being discussed could be a knee jerk reaction to the attitude the "real" AG brewers give them.

For me personally this is what I see. BIAB people somewhat defending their technique from people who look down on it saying it does not work, it is highly inefficient, it is too difficult to lift some weight up. And trying to bolster their ranks in order to prove to those people who talk down to them that it does work. I admit I probably am one of those people who is the reason this thread was started. I will back off when it comes to trying to bolster the ranks.
 
I don't look down on Brew in bag folks at all, but why do it at all?

I've done a brew in bag and it's ok. How hard is it to pick up a 5 dollar ice chest second hand and build a braid?

I've done both, I'll spend the extra 10 dollars and one hour of time to build it.
 
I don't look down on Brew in bag folks at all, but why do it at all?

I've done a brew in bag and it's ok. How hard is it to pick up a 5 dollar ice chest second hand and build a braid?

I've done both, I'll spend the extra 10 dollars and one hour of time to build it.

That's not the point though. I actually started as an AG 3-vessel brewer. I have my own cooler MT, a March pump, and a full system for making some great beer. That said, I like the convenience of BIAB. It's easier on the clean-up, and I don't find it difficult to maintain my mash temperatures. I use a keggle with a custom-made bag, and it is a super easy brew day - that's important when you have a 1-year-old. Add to that the fact that my beer quality hasn't suffered and you have a pretty compelling process.
 
What's wrong with zealousness or fanboyism? I dont' BIAB, but get me talking about homebrewing and I'll be overzealous. I'm a boor at a party for sure.

:mug:

Sad but true about all of us I'm sure.

At party..

Friend "Hey man this beer is great!"

Me "yeah it's ok, It has a, b, c off flavors and I wish the brewer would have done x, y, z"

Friend :confused look, sips beer, moves on to next conversation:
 
I've certainly seen more than a handful of traditional brewers call BIAB an "intermediate" brewing method, which usually illicits the BIAB defenders to speak up! I've never seen a BIAB brewer put down traditional brewing on any grounds besides the expense and space of the extra vessels and slightly longer brewday.

Point being, I've never seen a BIAB brewer call traditional brewing inferior on anything but the facts, but I've seen PLENTY of traditional brewers call BIAB inferior based on misinformation.
 
I thought most novice brewers were extract brewers. I didn't know most novices were starting out with the BIAB technique.
Is that like saying people with signatures the size of the Wall Street Journal documenting every beer they have ever brewed have L.A.M.S.?

You've misread my post. Most novice brewers do extract, and want to jump to AG. They start asking questions, and BIAB is a natural recommendation.
 
There is a difference between being passionate about something and being dismissive about anything that you are not passionate about.

Now you're describing 3 vessel AG brewers, who routinely dismiss anyone who do anything different than they do. Extract and BIAB brewers might have a chip on their shoulder that's created by people on this site that dismiss their method because they do it in a "more traditional" manner.
 
I've certainly seen more than a handful of traditional brewers call BIAB an "intermediate" brewing method, which usually illicits the BIAB defenders to speak up! I've never seen a BIAB brewer put down traditional brewing on any grounds besides the expense and space of the extra vessels and slightly longer brewday.

Point being, I've never seen a BIAB brewer call traditional brewing inferior on anything but the facts, but I've seen PLENTY of traditional brewers call BIAB inferior based on misinformation.

Agreed. I only see BIAB brewers recommending their method to people as an alternative to buying a much larger system. makes complete sense to me.
 
I did my 1st PM pale ale yesterday from a midwest kit. I figured that would be easier than trying to get the right amounts of what grains from scratch. Plus it came with a large grain bag,so I went for it. My new electric stove burners heat up faster & more evenly than the stock ones did. But harder to maintain temps than the old ones.
Worked out well,but I can def see where sparging may not be as good with biab vs traditional methods. But it's cheaper & easier to get started with mashing. Still added a couple hours to my brew day. But I have to say,the wort smells...cleaner. Hop aromas stand out a bit more defined in my experience with it. Now if the blow off would just start...
 
Nah, I could never instigate something like that. Although I'll have to say, the BIAB attitude being discussed could be a knee jerk reaction to the attitude the "real" AG brewers give them. I know I've told people that IMHO BIAB sucks before lol. I tried it twice, and had an absolute nightmare with it. For me a cooler mashtun is easier and better on all accounts. That's me though. And passedpawn is right, as usual. We need to stick together as brew bros. Why, just a week ago a guy was having trouble hitting his FG, and I told him his problems would go away if he starting AG brewing. How *****ey was that?

It's sometimes hard to tell the writer intent when reading their words in a forum.
I know you were being somewhat sarcastic when you said "real" brewers but the next guy might see it as an insult.
Giving a fellow brewer helpful information isn't being *****ey if done in a non condescending way.

I personally dismiss any "advice" from the "my way or the highway people". I put people on ignore that talk down to others because their advice is useless. Pissing contests and troll threads are useless in a place where people are trying to get help and/or help others.

99.99% of the people are great and I love this site because I have learned a lifetime of knowledge in a short time.
 
I've certainly seen more than a handful of traditional brewers call BIAB an "intermediate" brewing method, which usually illicits the BIAB defenders to speak up! I've never seen a BIAB brewer put down traditional brewing on any grounds besides the expense and space of the extra vessels and slightly longer brewday.

Point being, I've never seen a BIAB brewer call traditional brewing inferior on anything but the facts, but I've seen PLENTY of traditional brewers call BIAB inferior based on misinformation.

Great point. I can't count how many times I've read comments from seemingly pretentious AG brewers questioning how good the beer you can make doing extract or BIAB brewing. Because some AG brewer didn't get good results trying BIAB somehow means that no one has great results?

My thing is, I could care less how you brew beer. I choose to do mostly extract due to time constraints and discovering BIAB has given me a way to expand into AG brewing while not expending the time and money traditional AG brewing requires. All that should matter is whether or not you are happy with whatever method of homebrewing you choose to use. If you are an AG brewer, and are happy with AG brewing, why feel the need to disparage or discredit other methods? And the same can be said for BIAB and extract brewers.

In the end, it shouldn't matter what method of homebrewing you choose. What matters is if you are enjoying that method and if you are making good beer...
 
Great point. I can't count how many times I've read comments from seemingly pretentious AG brewers questioning how good the beer you can make doing extract or BIAB brewing. Because some AG brewer didn't get good results trying BIAB somehow means that no one has great results?

My thing is, I could care less how you brew beer. I choose to do mostly extract due to time constraints and discovering BIAB has given me a way to expand into AG brewing while not expending the time and money traditional AG brewing requires. All that should matter is whether or not you are happy with whatever method of homebrewing you choose to use. If you are an AG brewer, and are happy with AG brewing, why feel the need to disparage or discredit other methods? And the same can be said for BIAB and extract brewers.

In the end, it shouldn't matter what method of homebrewing you choose. What matters is if you are enjoying that method and if you are making good beer...

You, sir, get a gold star. :eek:nestar:
 
There are lots of ways to skin the brewing cat and most of them are represented on here.

It seems like most of the people on here are pretty open minded about different ways to do things, except the BIAB crowd. Ok now that I think about it maybe there is a general lack of open minded-ness but the BIAB crowd seems to be the most vocal. Why is it that in any thread someone posts asking about their process the answer from this crowd is always "you should be BIAB"?

I'm sure its been said, but you can replace 'BIAB crowd' with 'AG crowd' and you'll still be right. i think it comes down to personal preference and perhaps some people doing BIAB have found quick success so they're subconsciously thinking they know it all... and want to pass their new knowledge to anyone who'll listen. Maybe they've long been the ones on here without a lot of information or knowledge to share and we're jealous of those AG brewers who know more and now have something to contribute?

Either way, BIAB is great just like AG is great. Personally, BIAB is a great way to practice and get some things dialed in BEFORE that leap to traditional AG. Learn how to mash consistently, sparge, and find what recipes work before you spend tons of cash going traditional (as in buying burners, propane, big kettles/keggles, sculpture, temp control, and whatever else traditional brewers use).
 
How hard is it to pick up a 5 dollar ice chest second hand and build a braid?

I've done both, I'll spend the extra 10 dollars and one hour of time to build it.

I've asked earlier, and I'll ask here again: If you want to do traditional all-grain, don't you need three vessels? I.E., don't you need a vessel for sparge water, your mash tun, AND a kettle for the boil?

I'm asking because I'm curious (I'd like to try traditional AG), but also I want to understand the comparative simplicity.
 
Tell me about it. Those a hole BIABers and their stupid 2 cents. They don't know anything. Just a bunch of cheap, lazy, beginners, practicing for "real" brewing. They should save their dumb ass opinions for some sort of forum dedicated to homwbrewing.
 
I've asked earlier, and I'll ask here again: If you want to do traditional all-grain, don't you need three vessels? I.E., don't you need a vessel for sparge water, your mash tun, AND a kettle for the boil?

I'm asking because I'm curious (I'd like to try traditional AG), but also I want to understand the comparative simplicity.


You dont need three vessels it makes it easier though.

I have one 10 gallon kettle and a cooler MLT.

I use a large pasta pot for my sparge water additions

If you dont have that you can always use a bucket to collect your wort while you sparge with your brew kettle.

*Edit you should probably just BIAB, that's what all the cool kids are doing. Apparently the aborigines pioneered it and the kiwis took it international.
 
This thread has certainly taken off...and apparently chapped some asses, which wasn't my intention.
 
unionrdr said:
Speaking of saving dumb ass opinions....def a cheap shot.

Woah, Woah, Woah. Please do not take that post serious. I meant to be sarcastic but apparently it was a poor joke. I BIAB and love it. I'm just getting a little defensive. Apologies for any offense.
 
Woah, Woah, Woah. Please do not take that post serious. I meant to be sarcastic but apparently it was a poor joke. I BIAB and love it. I'm just getting a little defensive. Apologies for any offense.

I gathered a hint of sarcasm in your first post, but you might want to add an emoticon as it can be hard to gauge sarcasm in writing... ;)
 
MMJfan said:
I gathered a hint of sarcasm in your first post, but you might want to add an emoticon as it can be hard to gauge sarcasm in writing... ;)

Noted. :)

I'm having a panic attack thinking I just pissed off the guy whose countless posts, advice, and opinions have exponentially increased my beers quality.

Xpertskir: I understand your original point. Some of the other posters I started taking a little too personal. Sorry again. I shall kindly bow out of this debate.
 
I always read all threads with a grain of salt. When I was a wee lad, I had a conversation with the father of a friend of mine. We were discussing motor oil and he professed that motor oil XXX was the best stuff made since pharoah. I knew he happened to be the regional salesman for motor oil XXX, and I figured I would get a little lesson on motor oil chemistry, so I asked "why is it better?". He looked at me, stunned. Then he shrugged his shoulders and said " I don't know, it just is". Needless to say, I never took automotive advice from that particular man again. The point is that if someone chooses to post information here, I listen critically and look for the answer to the question "why?" If someone is willing to engage in an intellectual conversation, I will listen. If not, i usually remove myself from the thread and move on my way. I started with extract and steeping grains, and made very good beers for quite a while. This past summer I switched to AG BIAB for many of the reasons listed above. There are drawbacks, which anyone that has done a 10 gallon BIAB batch already understands. Personally, if I choose to add a mash tun to my equipment list, I will most likely line it with a bag, not a manifold. That's my choice. Since I haven't done it yet, I do not choose to offer that as a viable alternative. Once I have facts on the method, I may elect to share them here, if i believe it will be helpful to others. To those "traditional" 3 vessel brewers; I have read and learned a great deal from your AG threads about protein rests, to mash out or not, etc., I have yet to find experiences in 3 vessel AG that did not directly translate to BIAB. To me BIAB is "real AG brewing", its just a different way of separating the grains from the wort. I am a bit weary of the discussion of "real AG" vs "BIAB AG" To me we're all brewers, whether we use extracts, bags or 3 vessels. We all have much to learn from each other's successes and mistakes. That's what this forum is for, and quite frankly, threads like this is one of the reasons I will most likely never join a local brew club.
 
I always read all threads with a grain of salt. When I was a wee lad, I had a conversation with the father of a friend of mine. We were discussing motor oil and he professed that motor oil XXX was the best stuff made since pharoah. I knew he happened to be the regional salesman for motor oil XXX, and I figured I would get a little lesson on motor oil chemistry, so I asked "why is it better?". He looked at me, stunned. Then he shrugged his shoulders and said " I don't know, it just is". Needless to say, I never took automotive advice from that particular man again. The point is that if someone chooses to post information here, I listen critically and look for the answer to the question "why?" If someone is willing to engage in an intellectual conversation, I will listen. If not, i usually remove myself from the thread and move on my way. I started with extract and steeping grains, and made very good beers for quite a while. This past summer I switched to AG BIAB for many of the reasons listed above. There are drawbacks, which anyone that has done a 10 gallon BIAB batch already understands. Personally, if I choose to add a mash tun to my equipment list, I will most likely line it with a bag, not a manifold. That's my choice. Since I haven't done it yet, I do not choose to offer that as a viable alternative. Once I have facts on the method, I may elect to share them here, if i believe it will be helpful to others. To those "traditional" 3 vessel brewers; I have read and learned a great deal from your AG threads about protein rests, to mash out or not, etc., I have yet to find experiences in 3 vessel AG that did not directly translate to BIAB. To me BIAB is "real AG brewing", its just a different way of separating the grains from the wort. I am a bit weary of the discussion of "real AG" vs "BIAB AG" To me we're all brewers, whether we use extracts, bags or 3 vessels. We all have much to learn from each other's successes and mistakes. That's what this forum is for, and quite frankly, threads like this is one of the reasons I will most likely never join a local brew club.

Just about as succinct as you can get on the whole subject.
 
You dont need three vessels it makes it easier though.

I have one 10 gallon kettle and a cooler MLT.

I use a large pasta pot for my sparge water additions

If you dont have that you can always use a bucket to collect your wort while you sparge with your brew kettle.

*Edit you should probably just BIAB, that's what all the cool kids are doing. Apparently the aborigines pioneered it and the kiwis took it international.

Umm, no offense, but you're using three vessels there: kettle pot, MLT cooler, and sparge pot.

:)
 
I always read all threads with a grain of salt. When I was a wee lad, I had a conversation with the father of a friend of mine. We were discussing motor oil and he professed that motor oil XXX was the best stuff made since pharoah. I knew he happened to be the regional salesman for motor oil XXX, and I figured I would get a little lesson on motor oil chemistry, so I asked "why is it better?". He looked at me, stunned. Then he shrugged his shoulders and said " I don't know, it just is". Needless to say, I never took automotive advice from that particular man again. The point is that if someone chooses to post information here, I listen critically and look for the answer to the question "why?" If someone is willing to engage in an intellectual conversation, I will listen. If not, i usually remove myself from the thread and move on my way. I started with extract and steeping grains, and made very good beers for quite a while. This past summer I switched to AG BIAB for many of the reasons listed above. There are drawbacks, which anyone that has done a 10 gallon BIAB batch already understands. Personally, if I choose to add a mash tun to my equipment list, I will most likely line it with a bag, not a manifold. That's my choice. Since I haven't done it yet, I do not choose to offer that as a viable alternative. Once I have facts on the method, I may elect to share them here, if i believe it will be helpful to others. To those "traditional" 3 vessel brewers; I have read and learned a great deal from your AG threads about protein rests, to mash out or not, etc., I have yet to find experiences in 3 vessel AG that did not directly translate to BIAB. To me BIAB is "real AG brewing", its just a different way of separating the grains from the wort. I am a bit weary of the discussion of "real AG" vs "BIAB AG" To me we're all brewers, whether we use extracts, bags or 3 vessels. We all have much to learn from each other's successes and mistakes. That's what this forum is for, and quite frankly, threads like this is one of the reasons I will most likely never join a local brew club.

I agree with everything but your last comment. The homebrew club I'm in has brewers of all different levels: extract, PM, BIAB, 3 vessel. There isn't any issue between members, everyone's supportive.
 
Because it's like mowing your lawn your entire life without a lawn bag attached to the mower, letting the cut grass spew everywhere, and then buying a mower with a lawn bag attachment. Why go back? It's just easier, more convenient, and makes for quicker clean-up.
 
Sentiments that BIAB is inherently inferior to 3-vessel brewing, or a step before graduation to 3-vessel brewing, contribute to the mythology and tend to provoke a response. QED :)
 
This thread has certainly taken off...and apparently chapped some asses, which wasn't my intention.

Well, you called a segment of the forum population 'fan boys' as well as closed minded... I'd say you got exactly what you wanted from your post. :confused:
 
Because it's like mowing your lawn your entire life without a lawn bag attached to the mower, letting the cut grass spew everywhere, and then buying a mower with a lawn bag attachment. Why go back? It's just easier, more convenient, and makes for quicker clean-up.
Wait . . . explain this in English please.
 
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