Question about brewing in buckets

I've been brewing for a few years now and I have owned glass carboys, plastic jerry cans (for no-chill brewing) and hdpe buckets. I like buckets because they are easy to clean and have plenty of headspace as I have 7 gallon ones that seem to be perfect for 5.5 gallon batches.

Anyway, my only real concern is how well they keep co2 after primary fermentation. With a carboy you have a small opening up top, and you stick a racking cane in there and there is minimal disturbance to the protective layer of co2 covering your beer.

With the brew bucket, it's obviously harder to keep that co2 on top of the beer. Does anyone think that there is an oxidation risk here? Once the top of the brew bucket is removed for the first time, should the beer be kegged immediately?

Thoughts?

I use a 3 gallon glass carboy and a 2 gallon brew bucket. The bucket is definitely easier to handle but for me the downside is you cant see what's going on. I like to watch the fermentation in progress so I prefer glass.

I have not had any issues with the bucket. The gasket in the lid seals tight and it is difficult to remove. I also have a couple buckets and lids that I got from the local bakery. The lids do not fit as tight therefore I would not use those for fermenting although some do. Buckets from the home brew store are inexpensive so if i would use those with no reservations.

I only open the top to add hops and reseal with no issues. In your post you mention you have a 7 gallon bucket and brew 5.5 gallon batches. That's alot of head space- you may want to consider brewing a bit bigger batch to eliminate some of the head space or get a 6 gallon bucket. I brew 2.5 gallon batches when using my bucket and leave as little head space as possible. I do use a blow off tube for the first 5 days or so then switch to an air lock.

If you have doubts about the CO2 in the head space of your fermenter you could buy a hand held Co2 gun and give it a shot or 2, this should take care of the problem. I always give my fermenter a couple of shots if I do a secondary prior transfer.

I have been brewing all grain now for about a year and haven't had any problems with my buckets. Once the wort and yeast is pitched I generally only open the bucket twice. Once to check gravity at 14 days and then again at 19-21 days after dry hopping/putting into the keg.

There is oxidation risk whenever you open it so to limit it you just have to be patient and prepared when you do.

brew703 said:

n your post you mention you have a 7 gallon bucket and brew 5.5 gallon batches. That's alot of head space- you may want to consider brewing a bit bigger batch to eliminate some of the head space or get a 6 gallon bucket.

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There is nothing wrong with that amount of headspace and it's been proven time and time again. Most fermenters are 7 gallons and are designed for 5 gallon batches. Heck, my old Coopers fermenters are 8 gallons and I open them up to dry hop or add adjuncts and never have had oxidation issues. While it's certainly possible of course I think you're more likely to get oxidation when the beer is agitated rather than sitting calmly. I'd rather have the headspace than lose beer to blowoff.


Rev.

Rev2010 said:

There is nothing wrong with that amount of headspace and it's been proven time and time again. Most fermenters are 7 gallons and are designed for 5 gallon batches. Heck, my old Coopers fermenters are 8 gallons and I open them up to dry hop or add adjuncts and never have had oxidation issues. While it's certainly possible of course I think you're more likely to get oxidation when the beer is agitated rather than sitting calmly. I'd rather have the headspace than lose beer to blowoff.


Rev.

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I knew someone would refute what i said. No biggie. I've only been brewing since June and most of what i've read states little head space is best.

I brew 2 and 3 gallon batches and i fill my 3 gallon carboy to the point where the bottle begins to get smaller. Most of the time I have to use a blow off tube to avoid a mess. With my bucket I usually leave 4 inches or so of head space. I have also left much more space and haven't had any issues.

But I can say the buckets and lids you get from your home brew store are much better than the free ones from a bakery. The bakery ones dont seal good enough for me, at least the ones I have.

brew703 said:

I knew someone would refute what i said. No biggie. I've only been brewing since June and most of what i've read states little head space is best.

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Yeah that's just pretty old information. I've only been brewing for coming up to 5 years myself, but I brew a crap ton and frequently during my brewing season (September through May). It's like the old info that you must secondary to get clear beer. Here's my IPA, no finings at all and only was in the primary:


Rev.

Why remove the lid from a bucket until you're ready to package?

Snake a skinny hose down the grommet hole to suck some beer out for a gravity/taste test. The headspace will remain almost undisturbed. For good measure you could flow some CO2 in there, if you feel it will help.

I usually don't take a test until 3 weeks after pitching. I will raise the temps a few degrees after a week, and again after 2 weeks.

IslandLizard said:

Why remove the lid from a bucket until you're ready to package?

Snake a skinny hose down the grommet hole to suck some beer out for a gravity/taste test. The headspace will remain almost undisturbed. For good measure you could flow some CO2 in there, if you feel it will help.

I usually don't take a test until 3 weeks after pitching. I will raise the temps a few degrees after a week, and again after 2 weeks.

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I just use regular bucket lids (like the cheap Lowes ones). To my understanding, despite the fact there isn't a perfect seal, its not a big deal because the co2 keeps your beer safe. AFAIK, the combo of an airlock with a perfectly sealed/grommeted lid is more so you can see what is going on, rather than keeping 'bad air' out and infecting your beer.

But yeah, I should have just waited 4 weeks. I do wish I was more patient though!

brew703 said:

.....But I can say the buckets and lids you get from your home brew store are much better than the free ones from a bakery. The bakery ones dont seal good enough for me, at least the ones I have.

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That's false information as well. The only good thing the home brew stores have over the bakeries is bigger buckets. 5 gallon buckets are the biggest I've seen. How the lid seals on the buckets is the issue imo as there's different buckets used due to differing brands of cake icing used. I have four small 2 gallon buckets where the lids snap in four places. Some of those seal better than others. I have a 3 gallon bucket I got from the same bakery that seals the same way as the ones you get from the brew suppliers.

All those buckets were free too. Granted, a 5 gallon bucket is useless for 5 gallon batches, but if you're doing small batches, then the freebies at the bakeries are still your best option. Just pick the ones that have the better sealing lids and you're good to go.

Yesfan said:

That's false information as well. The only good thing the home brew stores have over the bakeries is bigger buckets. 5 gallon buckets are the biggest I've seen. How the lid seals on the buckets is the issue imo as there's different buckets used due to differing brands of cake icing used. I have four small 2 gallon buckets where the lids snap in four places. Some of those seal better than others. I have a 3 gallon bucket I got from the same bakery that seals the same way as the ones you get from the brew suppliers.

All those buckets were free too. Granted, a 5 gallon bucket is useless for 5 gallon batches, but if you're doing small batches, then the freebies at the bakeries are still your best option. Just pick the ones that have the better sealing lids and you're good to go.

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The bucket itself is basically the same but the lids are not. I have buckets and lids from the bakery and none of them completely seal therefore I opt not to use them for fermentation. I use those for bottling or obtaining water.

brew703 said:

The bucket itself is basically the same but the lids are not. I have buckets and lids from the bakery and none of them completely seal therefore I opt not to use them for fermentation. I use those for bottling or obtaining water.

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That's why I mentioned about picking the ones with the better lids. The buckets are Ropak (same as my NB bucket). The lids I have that don't seal as well are also Ropak, but the better sealing lid on my three gallon bucket is made by Plastican.


In the end, I think the lid issue is similar to the bubbling/not bubbling airlock issue. With primary fermentation, it 'probably' doesn't matter. I've not had any infections with the less sealing lids with my small batches. However, I prefer the better sealing lid for piece of mind the same as I like seeing/hearing the air lock gurgling.

Yesfan said:

That's why I mentioned about picking the ones with the better lids. The buckets are Ropak (same as my NB bucket). The lids I have that don't seal as well are also Ropak, but the better sealing lid on my three gallon bucket is made by Plastican.


In the end, I think the lid issue is similar to the bubbling/not bubbling airlock issue. With primary fermentation, it 'probably' doesn't matter. I've not had any infections with the less sealing lids with my small batches. However, I prefer the better sealing lid for piece of mind the same as I like seeing/hearing the air lock gurgling.

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The buckets I have that came from the bakery are Ropak and the lids have a fairly large black rubber seal. The seal itself doesnt fit tight in the lid. I dont have the option to pick which lids/buckets to get as the store gives me what they have.

I do prefer the Home Brew Store buckets, mainly for piece of mind. Just dont want to take a chance with an infection. Also, I've had the hardest time getting the icing smell from the buckets. I've used Oxy at a higher rate, let sit in hot water and repeated the process but there is still a smell of icing. I store the buckets open to allow any smell to escape. Over time I'm sure it will be good but for now I just use them for bottling and getting water.

brew703 said:

The buckets I have that came from the bakery are Ropak and the lids have a fairly large black rubber seal. The seal itself doesnt fit tight in the lid. I dont have the option to pick which lids/buckets to get as the store gives me what they have.

I do prefer the Home Brew Store buckets, mainly for piece of mind. Just dont want to take a chance with an infection. Also, I've had the hardest time getting the icing smell from the buckets. I've used Oxy at a higher rate, let sit in hot water and repeated the process but there is still a smell of icing. I store the buckets open to allow any smell to escape. Over time I'm sure it will be good but for now I just use them for bottling and getting water.

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I wouldn't worry too much about the icing smell. That's kinda like the beer smell from the brew store buckets after first use.

Might be a good thing if you're making a vanilla porter and it's fermenting in a bucket that had vanilla icing in it. Ha!

So, if you primary in a bucket, do you transfer to carboy after the krausen falls, or leave it in the bucket for the whole month or so fermentation time?

Leave it in for 3 weeks or so. Don't even lift the lid.

There's very little need for secondaries, unless you want to long term bulk age (2 months+). Even fruit additions and dry hopping can be done in the primary. Once you lift the lid, the head space will be filled with air, which can oxidize your beer with time. The CO2 "blanket" is a myth. So if there's no need to lift the lid, let it be.

Once you lift it there's little choice, either rack to secondary (with small headspace) or package away.

I've been using buckets exclusively since I started brewing, 2.5 years now. There was a period of time I was racking to secondary and I used plastic carboys then but I no longer rack to secondary.

I typically leave a beer alone for three weeks if it is about 1.050 O.G.
I typically leave a beer alone for four weeks if it is about 1.060 O.G.
I typically leave a beer alone for five to eight weeks if it is about 1.070 plus O.G.

I have pulled the lid off from all the types of beers mentioned above before I was ready to bottle/keg with no ill effects.

IslandLizard said:

Leave it in for 3 weeks or so. Don't even lift the lid.

There's very little need for secondaries, unless you want to long term bulk age (2 months+). Even fruit additions and dry hopping can be done in the primary. Once you lift the lid, the head space will be filled with air, which can oxidize your beer with time. The CO2 "blanket" is a myth. So if there's no need to lift the lid, let it be.

Once you lift it there's little choice, either rack to secondary (with small headspace) or package away.

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I've been using carboys; some glass and some plastic. I bottle directly from the primary, unless the trub is fluffy and stirs-up when I pick up the carboy (in that case, I'll rack to a different carboy and give it another week to settle) I've made wine in buckets, and just curious if the beer brewing process was any different when using them. Thanks.

z-bob said:

I've been using carboys; some glass and some plastic. I bottle directly from the primary, unless the trub is fluffy and stirs-up when I pick up the carboy (in that case, I'll rack to a different carboy and give it another week to settle) I've made wine in buckets, and just curious if the beer brewing process was any different when using them. Thanks.

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I've not made larger batches of wine than a gallon, but the methods are similar from what I understand. I don't know how wine makers battle oxidation, except for topping up after each racking to limit headspace. If you have access to CO2, I'd blow the headspace of the secondary/clearing vessel out, unless the space is relatively small. If clear beer is needed, cold crashing for a few days with or without gelatin helps in clearing and compacting the trub/yeast cake. Otherwise "lagering" for a few weeks should drop the last of it.

I've never come across very fluffy trub/yeast layers, but you can't really tell in a bucket until you see cloudier beer come up after a while. My siphon has one of those plastic diverters on the bottom, to suck from the top rather than bottom. That mitigates most of the trub transfer problems.

I keg most of my beer and dry hop/infuse and dry oak in kegs.

JLeuck64 said:

I've been using buckets exclusively since I started brewing, 2.5 years now. There was a period of time I was racking to secondary and I used plastic carboys then but I no longer rack to secondary.

I typically leave a beer alone for three weeks if it is about 1.050 O.G.
I typically leave a beer alone for four weeks if it is about 1.060 O.G.
I typically leave a beer alone for five to eight weeks if it is about 1.070 plus O.G.

I have pulled the lid off from all the types of beers mentioned above before I was ready to bottle/keg with no ill effects.

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Those times are quite liberal. I'd say it should depend on the beer. For example, IPAs are best fresh, so are Wits. Many beers that don't improve from longer conditioning can be packaged earlier, but 2 weeks seems to be about the minimum. A dry hop/spice/infusion period can be part of that conditioning period, after the krausen has fallen and most activity subsided.

You should try a few batches without lifting the lid until ready to rack or package and avoid as much (needless) exposure to air as you can during the whole process. You may be amazed at the difference it can make. When I started to pay more attention to process techniques in detail such as those my beer improved, overall. Now this is assuming you've got all the gross factors such as water and treatment, removing chlorine/chloramines, temperature control, sanitation, etc. taken care of.

There have been discussions on minimizing exposure to air and the consensus is to try to minimize wherever you can. I always hate it when my siphon suddenly sucks air, blowing bubbles through the beer. Now I clamp the hose before that dreadful moment.

I ferment in buckets. No problem. I would never go less than 5L (1.3G) of headspace. Even have a wit going right now that had that much and still required a blowoff tube.

The only time I would be concerned with the bucket is if it was going to sit long-term in there, but I'm talking months. My christmas beer this year, for example, sat in the primary bucket for 5 weeks. The time I lifted the lid was to pour in the christmas spices that had been soaking in vodka. But I also added some fermentables at that point, in order to make sure it would purge the headspace.