Old Speckled Hen.

Okay, this past Sunday I was waiting for my pork butt to smoke (17 hours!!) and I realized my OSH had been conditioning for 3 weeks. So I busted out a bottle and my can of the real deal, and did a comparison.

First off, Orfy really NAILED the color with his recipe. Of course the can has the nitro widget so it's easy to distinguish the two, but the color itself is spot on. Mine (on the right, if you haven't already figured that out!) has a touch of chill haze, which actually clears up quite a bit ten minutes after pouring. (Warm in the bottle, it's crystal clear.)

When it comes to drinking, the differences are far more apparent. Due to the creamy head created by the widget, the first sip of the commercial product has a wonderful mouthfeel, but it quickly dissipates and subsequently feels rather watery and thin. There is a pronounced but simple sweetness and a minimal hop presence. While refreshing, the flavor is rather muted and again, watery.

Orfy's OTOH, has a much fuller mouthfeel and a rich, malty sweetness that lingers and seems to spread to the side of your tongue. The hops are quite pronounced, with a flowery/fruity character that I assume is from the EKG. There is also a slight touch of yeastiness, which I'm guessing will all but disappear with time...it's still a very young beer. Overall, it seems to be closer to an ESB than what I would consider a classic bitter. I over-carbed a bit for the style, next time I'll use less priming sugar.

The best part of this comparison is that I was obligated to drink two nice pints of beer! While it's not a perfect match to the Morland product, I enjoyed Orfy's quite a bit more, and feel it's a better beer. It's certainly more to my taste anyhow. I'll be brewing it again, perhaps I'll alternate it in the rotation with my own ESB recipe.

WOW that look fantastic.

I'm glad you liked it. It's one of my favourites. I must admit you can normally distinguish one of my brews from the original. I can't resist leaning a brew towards how I think it should be. I'm selfish like that.

You can probably see now why I have quite a narrow spectrum when it comes to brewing. I like to try the new stuff but when it comes down to it I'm happy with this type of Ale along with a few others.

Last month I actually re-chilled a second keg of this that had been aging since last October. WOW.

Talk about a nice caramel goodness. I forced myself to BMBF ten 12-ounce bottles before it was too late.

Hi Orfy
I was just wondering if you had any other good clone recipes for good old English ales
As an expat English man from Bath living in the US, I was looking for some clones of Exmore Gold, Or Badger’s Tanglefoot but myself I do love the hobgoblin and old speckled hen and I will have to try out your recipes.
Thanks

thewurzel said:

As an expat English man from Bath living in the US

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Did you ever visit the Salamander? I stopped there last September for lunch, and enjoyed a few wonderful pints, as well as (oddly enough!) one of the best hamburgers I've ever had.

Actually yes quite often
My main Haunting ground was the Hatchetts which was just down the street
Which is now called the Raven
Or the gay crow as know by the old locals due to the dancing raven sign.

BlindLemonLars said:

Did you ever visit the Salamander? I stopped there last September for lunch, and enjoyed a few wonderful pints, as well as (oddly enough!) one of the best hamburgers I've ever had.

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Wow, I at first glance I thought, hey, that looks familiar! I went to that pub in March. It was recommended to me by a local, my wife's cousin. I was visiting my buddy Peter Gabriel in nearby Box (JK). Bath was a great city to visit (expensive one to live in, though!) and Bath Ales are delicious.

i can't get northern brewer hops but really want to brew this beer what would be a good hop to use instead?

kinghellsfire_NZ said:

i can't get northern brewer hops but really want to brew this beer what would be a good hop to use instead?

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I believe Northern Brewer is a variety of Hallertau, that might be a place to start. Although, this substitution guide suggests Nugget, Chinook, Columbus, Bullion, Perle, or Styrian Aurora.

Hop Substitution Chart

Have I confused you sufficiently?

no that is excellent i can get Chinook and EKG for about 2USD an oz(6.5NZD per 100gms) so i will just use Chinook and hope for the best

Message deleted

Apologies for bumping up a year-old thread, but I've got a little hop question on this one...

I'm really interested in making this, and while I have a bunch of hops in the freezer, I have neither Northern Brewer nor EKG. So how do people think this recipe would come out if I used, say, Galena for bittering and Willamette for the flavor/aroma (adjusting for AA%, of course)?

I'm sure the answer is something like "it won't be exactly the same beer, but it'll probably be great anyway; just go for it," but I'm just wondering how far off the original these subs'll take me.

Thanks in advance!

You read my mind

mMaybe some one can give you first hand experience with suitable substitutes.

Hey, is Dememera Sugar the same as Demerara Sugar?

Kilted Brewer said:

Hey, is Dememera Sugar the same as Demerara Sugar?

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Yes. But Demerara sugar is harder to come by making it....rara. :cross:

Don't quite your day job!

Just finished brewing this a few hours ago! My f'in thermometer got all wacky so I'm not sure what my mash temp was (somewhere between 150-155, I'm pretty sure) - my OG was 1.055 (expected 1.052) so who knows. Used Galena and Willamette cause that's what I had, and I didn't feel like spending more money on hops. But earlier this week I did find a British Import store right near me that carried Lyle's Golden Syrup. I had to use the whole tin in the beer, but I may just go back and get some for personal use after taking a little taste ... mmm ... syrup...

Hydro sample was pretty awesome. Can't wait to see how it turns out!

Just bottled after ~4 weeks in primary ... man, the whole kitchen smelled like caramel. Mmmm. Have a pretty decent stock right now, so I should be able to go at least 4 weeks before drinking it. I'm super excited.

Oh, it ended at 1.009. Lower than I had hoped for, but when I mashed my thermometer was all wacky jacky, so I must have mashed at a lower temp than planned. Oh well. So it's going to be a 6% ABV. A bit stronger than a session brew, but I have a feeling that these'll be so good that I'll want to make sure all my friends get a bottle or two.

I'm about to try my hand at brewing for the first time, and decided to go with the extract version of this recipe.

I have everything that I need to brew this clone EXCEPT for the Lyle's. I bought 7 lbs. of extract but spaced on getting the Lyle's (mostly because I'm giddy about trying this!)

Going back to the Brew Hut isn't a problem, but I was wondering about two things:
1. What would be the effect of skipping the Lyle's completely?
2. What would be the effect of using all 7 pounds of extract AND Lyle's?

I'm assuming that skipping the Lyle's would mean a less 'caramel' final product, and that using all 7 pounds of extract plus the Lyle's would result in a closer clone with a higher final ABV.

Any thoughts?

The Lyle's is not a caramel syrup type product (it has 0 SRM color).. It is basically partially converted cane sugar.

I would just use table sugar in place of Lyle's Golden Syrup if you are ready to brew.... or make your own golden syrup.

Thanks for the advice, kappajoe.

Adding the extra LME and mashing the Crystal 60 made the ABV approximately 6.5%. A little higher than I was hoping for, but for a n00b experiment, I'll take it.

I also realized that I did a really crummy job of letting the wort settle before putting it in my primary, so my end product will be fairly cloudy, I'm afraid. Racked to secondary today.

At any rate, I'll post again in 4-5 weeks, after this brew has been bottled for a couple of weeks.

So, I've had this bottled for two weeks now. It keeps getting better and better.

Earlier samples had a much fruitier/butterier flavor, but the yeast seems to have cleaned up after itself quite a bit.

I'll have to go pick up some of the original in a few weeks to compare. Either way, this turned out great and I'm looking forward to tasting how well it ages.

Orfy
I've gotta tell you, although as you can see I'm a noob to posting, like the rest I'm constantly seeking beer knowledge and tripped across this thread.

Having gotten the chance while in England to try OSH drawn from a keg in Chester, specifically at the "Frog & Nightingale", I can attest to how amazing this beer is! Went great with their delicious yorky pudding.

I was so happy with the OSH, I went to the nearest grocery store around my hotel and bought a bottle, then brought it back in the luggage for the family to try. To my dismay, however, the bottled OSH tasted like what I'd imagine a 50 year old unwashed bar rag would taste like. I was truly disappointed in not being able to share my beer happiness.

Now though, thanks to your recipes, I will be able to attempt to recreate this wonderful brew... and luckily even if I am way off, my brother's heading over there soon, so I'll be able to have him try OSH 'spot on'.

Oh, and while we're on the subject of beer and England, what is it called when someone has a Carlsberg with 1/2 lemonade in it? I can't blame them, personally I think it's a horrible beer and it can use whatever help it can get!

Cheers for the recipes!

Shandy.

Happy to oblige.

Ah right, thanks! If I could trouble you once more on beer trivia, this one's regarding Guiness in Europe.

One of the drafts of Guiness over there taste infinitely better than any I've had in the states. It was deliciously smooth with vanilla tones, and I haven't been able to put my finger on it as to which it was... I'm hoping you might know which type it was off hand. I had just gotten back from an extremely long day of work and ordered room service that night, and did not get to see which exact guiness it was.

If you think i'm 'irish' and have no idea what i'm talking about, no problem either.

Thanks again Orfy

There are all sorts of reasons you'll never get a Guinness like you have had in Ireland.

One is that it lacks the Craik.

For other reasons read here for some starters

Great article!!
Wow I did not realize the differences in alchohol content, even between Ireland and England. Actually I got to have that brew near the 'admired' town of Grimsby in England... so my brew must have been in the 4% range.

I did some searching around but could not pin point what 'Craik' is... is this referring to the water used to make the beer?

It's the atmosphere, the banter, the people and the place. The "Moment"

Brewed another batch of this stuff a week ago. Didn't have any Lyle's (nor did the three closest Whole Foods / World Markets) so I subbed in 1 cup of molasses / 5 gal batch.

I put the wort on a WLP001 yeast cake that had just finished fermenting a vanilla porter.

Took a gravity reading of the OSH tonight and it is shockingly good. I feel like the molasses adds a bit more of the earthy note I detect in the real deal.

At any rate - I wouldn't shy away from using treacle or molasses instead of inverted syrups - your mileage may vary.

I'm a n00b making an attempt at the Extract and Steep recipe. I went to the LHBS for the ingredients and there they mentioned that 2.4 oz of Northern Brewer seems like quite a bit for Old Speckled Hen. Has anyone else made the extract recipe or can it be confirmed that 2.4 oz is correct? Thanks in advance and sorry for the rookie question.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that the AAU of the 60 minute addition of Northern Brewer is 20.4. Is that high for an English Pale Ale?

Meddle said:

I guess what I'm trying to say is that the AAU of the 60 minute addition of Northern Brewer is 20.4. Is that high for an English Pale Ale?

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Nope. Actually a bit on the low side...but OSH leans to the sweeter side of things if I recall.

I brewed the extract and steep version tonight. I made a boneheaded mistake - instead of throwing in the East Kent Goldings at 15 and 5 minutes, I put them in at 30 minutes and 15 minutes. No idea why. Total brain freeze I guess. Not sure what exactly that means for the beer, but I guess I'll just have to wait and see.

I'm sure it'll be fine.

just dropped a 2 gallon tester of this in the keg last night.

A+

I was dead on with the O.G and F.G., for once.
Can't wait to make the full batch!!!

I am going to try a version of this as my first all-grain, and I will be using Brew In A Bag (BIAB). I will also no-chill, but I have been doing that with extract batches already.

As another first for me, I put the recipe I am going to use into Beer Smith. It is a derivation of Biermuncher's "Yankified" recipe, scaled down to 5 gallons, that I am naming Venerable Snipe Ale. Beer Smith does not appear to support BIAB as a mashing method, so I put in the full water volume as a mash-in and zero volume as a step for a single infusion mash with no mash-out. It also does not appear to support calculating the IBUs for a no-chill hop schedule, so I used the handy spreadsheet based upon Pol's adjustment schedule and put the adjustments into the Beer Smith notes. If anyone knows whether there is a better way to do this in Beer Smith, or whether Beer Smith plans to release a version that will support this, please let me know.

As this is a full-volume BIAB, I plan to start with about 9.25 gallons, losing about 3.75 gallons to absorption, evaporation (90 minute boil), and whatever I do not drain from the kettle, for about 5.25 gallons into the fermenter. I found this spreadsheet to estimate this. I also converted all of the factors in the formulas from metric to English, so if anyone is interested, let me know.

I am going to mash at 156F for 70 minutes and a ramp-up to 168F for 20 minutes. This is lower than Biermuncher's recipe, but from what I have read this seems to be at the high-end of what is recommended for BIAB. It will be interesting to see how it turns out regarding mouth-feel and maltiness. I tend to prefer my ales a bit drier and higher ABV anyway.

I would appreciate any feedback and suggestions on the plan. Many thanks.


BeerSmith Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Venerable Snipe Ale
Brewer: Big Slap Brewing Co
Asst Brewer:
Style: Extra Special/Strong Bitter (English Pale Ale)
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (0.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 5.25 gal
Boil Size: 8.50 gal
Estimated OG: 1.054 SG
Estimated Color: 9.1 SRM
Estimated IBU: 47.3 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70.00 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
1.00 lb Lyle's Golden Syrup [Boil for 15 min] Extract 9.52 %
7.50 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 71.43 %
0.75 lb Biscuit Malt (23.0 SRM) Grain 7.14 %
0.50 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 4.76 %
0.50 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 4.76 %
1.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.10 %] (60 min) Hops 38.6 IBU
0.50 oz Goldings, East Kent [7.20 %] (15 min) Hops 6.8 IBU
0.33 oz Goldings, East Kent [7.20 %] (5 min) Hops 1.8 IBU
0.25 lb Demerara Sugar (2.0 SRM) Sugar 2.38 %
1 Pkgs Nottingham (Danstar #-) Yeast-Ale


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body, No Mash Out
Total Grain Weight: 9.25 lb
----------------------------
Single Infusion, Medium Body, No Mash Out
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
60 min Mash In Add 37.00 qt of water at 159.8 F 156.0 F
20 min Step Add 0.00 qt of water at 168.0 F 168.0 F


Notes:
------
Hop Adjustment for No-Chill:
- 0.5 oz. EKG First Wort Hop (Mash In + 50 minutes, outside of bag)
- 1.25 oz. Northern Brewer at 40 min (Boil + 50 minutes)
- 0.33 oz. EKG Dry Hop


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When should one add the invert sugar syrup and the demerara sugar? Do these go into the boil or the fermenter, and when? Thanks.

Well after several years and a couple tries I finally got my hands on an un-skunked bottle of it. This was going to be a "third Strike you're out" third, but a place that has mixed sixers had some in the fridge, so I grabbed one...from the back of the row.

I am so glad I did. I can now see what you and other Brits have raved about the beer. It was a perfect session beer, nicely balanced, and even though it was balanced, you still got a nice malty taste.

That bottle was enough to get me to re-visited this recipe. I am going to give it a try, I might even brew it on May first during the Big Brew Day.

Thanks!!!

Revvy said:

Well after several years and a couple tries I finally got my hands on an un-skunked bottle of it. This was going to be a "third Strike you're out" third, but a place that has mixed sixers had some in the fridge, so I grabbed one...from the back of the row.

I am so glad I did. I can now see what you and other Brits have raved about the beer. It was a perfect session beer, nicely balanced, and even though it was balanced, you still got a nice malty taste.

That bottle was enough to get me to re-visited this recipe. I am going to give it a try, I might even brew it on May first during the Big Brew Day.

Thanks!!!

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I've never seen Old Speckled Hen in bottles. It's available in nitro draft cans similar to Guinness cans at a few places around here (Alexandria, VA), and on tap at several area bars.

SumnerH said:

I've never seen Old Speckled Hen in bottles. It's available in nitro draft cans similar to Guinness cans at a few places around here (Alexandria, VA), and on tap at several area bars.

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I've seen it in both manners and prefer the bottles. It is really not as good I would have hoped though, and prefer Hen's Tooth (even if it is labeled as a strong ale, which it is not that much more ABV than the Speckled). Now if I could find them casked then I would spend all night comparing.