SS washer hose VS. CPVC/Copper mash tun

I'm not sure if this has been discussed but....

I'm about to build my first official mash tun (4 AG brews and LOTS of frustration later) I cant make up my mind on which method to use. I have seen alot of builds on both SS washer hose style and CPVC/copper manifold and I cant make up my mind. I dont question the safety of the materials used or how to make a mash tun specifically but, which style has proven itself to be the most efficient. I have been "winging it" the past 4 brews and I have made some GREAT beers but they have not been without high blood pressure, sweat, and alot of wire hanger/blow back style of mashing. I'm done with that. I am an uber doityourselfer and must build my own but I am really tired of messing with a part of brewing that seems so simple. I just wanted to gather some opinions regarding what style some of you use and some results.

I am open to some ideas and suggestions.

I am going to use the blue monster on wheels (not sure of kind of cooler) for my tun. It has a flat bottom with a small "valley" for drainage. It seems like one should build the manifold to the cooler but I could be wrong. I always end up with alot of wort at the bottom that I cant get out.

What do you think?

I'm just getting into the hobby, but the stainless braid is easy to make and works like charm for me. Give it a shot. It's pretty cheap to make, too.

+1 for the braid. It works just as well as a manifold, but is quicker/ easier/ cheaper to make.

I first made and used a SS braid.

After 6-months I made a CPVC manifold and since made a second one.

I did notice an uptick in efficiency with the manifold.

Below is a link to my first manifold, which is turned over for viewing.

manifold

The slits were made with a very thin blade on a Dremel tool.

Interesting. Do you think you gained efficiency because of the manifold or did you change somthing in your process?

It's been awhile since I changed over... I don't remember any change other than the switch.

Maybe I just did a crappy job with the braid and a better job with the manifold??

Any efficiency differece between those two designs, assuming a batch sparging process, would be attributed to a difference in dead space (how much wort is left in the tun after full draining).

I use the SS braid. I found instructions online ( not sure if they were from HBT), and they suggested adding a spiral of SS wire inside the braid to keep the braid from being crushed. I did that and it works really well. I have never used a manifold, so I am of no use to you there. Sty not build both and see? I'm sure we'd all be interested in the results.

If you're batch sparging, the braid will work fine. If you really want to get max efficiency, fly sparge with a manifold.

Would there be any advantages to using one or the other? for example, if using the SS braid style on could tip the mash tun to get any leftover wort from the grain assuming this would not fluff the grain bed too much. maybe start the mash with the drain side slightly lower than the its opposing side? I dont think that would work with a manifold. However, with the manifold design, it seems easier to take apart/clean than the braid. Lots of tiny hard to reach places withing the braid that nasties could hide in...

I plan on fly sparging so maybe I should just quit over thinking this subject and build the manifold...

Yeah, you are over thinking this.

You're gonna fly sparge... do the manifold.

I should have qualified my first statement. Go with the cheap and easy braid for batch sparging. Go with a well designed manifold if you plan on fly sparging.

For fly sparging, would a false bottom on top of a SS braid work?

instapman said:

However, with the manifold design, it seems easier to take apart/clean than the braid. Lots of tiny hard to reach places withing the braid that nasties could hide in...

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Cleaning a braid is as simple as soaking it in oxyclean, and spraying it off with a hose, as for nasties hiding in the braid, it really doesn't matter since it is preboil.

FWIW, I have a 3/4" water heater supply braid, and I get roughly 80% efficiency, and have no problem cleaning it. I batch sparge.

"Bazooka T" FTW!



They work great in the coolers, especially the cubes and never a stuck sparge. I've been using one for over 10 years in the cooler mashtun and its never let me down.

Schnitzengiggle said:

FWIW, I have a 3/4" water heater supply braid, and I get roughly 80% efficiency, and have no problem cleaning it. I batch sparge.

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Did you put the wire in it so it doesn't collapse? I'm having trouble getting above 60% efficiency out of my tun.

knightbeer39 said:

"Bazooka T" FTW!

They work great in the coolers, especially the cubes and never a stuck sparge. I've been using one for over 10 years in the cooler mashtun and its never let me down.

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Did you buy that or make it yourself? I have seen them before and I like that design. Seems that I could fashion somthing like that with ease. Just need to find some SS screen.

I will build both and give them a shot. We shall see...

The problem with bazookas in general, tee or single, is that they leave a ton of wort behind. The siphon stops as soon as the liquid level hits the top of the horizontal opening.

I've been using it for 10+ years and according to beersmith I'm hitting efficiencies around 88% and always hit my O.G. mark or a little above. The little bit of liquid loss has been a non-factor. I still highly recommend it and have never had anything even remotely approaching a stuck sparge.

Bobby_M said:

The problem with bazookas in general, tee or single, is that they leave a ton of wort behind. The siphon stops as soon as the liquid level hits the top of the horizontal opening.

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That makes since. Manifold with slits touching the bottom if the tun would be more efficient since the siphon wont stop until 1/8 of an inch or so from the bottom of the cooler.

I think I just made up my mind.

DrawTap88 said:

Did you put the wire in it so it doesn't collapse? I'm having trouble getting above 60% efficiency out of my tun.

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No, a 3/4" SS braid is pretty stout, I have had up to 21 lbs of grain in my 52qt mash tun, without any run-off problems. If you are using a 1/2" braid I would assume that the spring would help. Also, when choosing a braid you want to look at how many strands of wire are in the braid some have more making for a more flexible braid, and creates smaller holes inbetween, which can slow your runoff. I think the thread where the guy had added the SS spring to some SS sleeving he got from Mcmaster was disappointed in the braid itself because it caused run-off problems.

At any rate here is my braid:

The photo unfortunately doesn't have any scale reference, but the braid is pretty big.


I added a copper cap in the end, and secured it with a clamp to help wiegh it down, so when stirring it doesn' move too much.


This has worked great and I get a pretty consistent 79-80% efficiency.

I have pretty much the same set up, including the copper cap on the other end. I think I did go with the 1/2" braid. (Might be time to go bigger.) I'm also using the round Home Depot cooler, and occassionally, I do catch hold of the braid when stirring.

Thanks for the feedback with pics.

I have both. My smaller, 5 gallon tun has a braid, and my 60 qt Igloo has a CPVC manifold. With respect to efficiency, I have to agree with Bobby_M: It's all about deadspace.

It's also all about how vigorously you stir. I pulled out a fitting on my CPVC manifold thanks to vigorous stirring during the Big Brew day and had to improvise a temporary lauter grant to get all the husks out of my wort. I suppose you could have the same problem with a braid.

All said, I think it comes down purely to preference.

EDITED TO ADD: Whoops, I see you clarified and said you'll be fly sparging. To me, that means build a manifold.

I'm building my first cpvc manifold and am curious how you would mix the grain well with your hot water with the manifold being in the way of a good stir?

I built a cpvc manifold for my 55 quart coleman xtreme cooler. Honestly I do not even notice when i am stirring that it is getting in the way. I make sure I pour in my grain at a decent speed while stirring as I go and I have not had any problems at all. When I do stir it for the sparge water I just stir around and between it.

Shults said:

I'm building my first cpvc manifold and am curious how you would mix the grain well with your hot water with the manifold being in the way of a good stir?

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Shults said:

I'm building my first cpvc manifold and am curious how you would mix the grain well with your hot water with the manifold being in the way of a good stir?

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Assuming the manifold is against the bottom, it's sort of like a bump.

Schnitzengiggle said:

No, a 3/4" SS braid is pretty stout, I have had up to 21 lbs of grain in my 52qt mash tun, without any run-off problems. If you are using a 1/2" braid I would assume that the spring would help. Also, when choosing a braid you want to look at how many strands of wire are in the braid some have more making for a more flexible braid, and creates smaller holes inbetween, which can slow your runoff. I think the thread where the guy had added the SS spring to some SS sleeving he got from Mcmaster was disappointed in the braid itself because it caused run-off problems.

At any rate here is my braid:

The photo unfortunately doesn't have any scale reference, but the braid is pretty big.

I added a copper cap in the end, and secured it with a clamp to help wiegh it down, so when stirring it doesn' move too much.

This has worked great and I get a pretty consistent 79-80% efficiency.

Click to expand...

Man, I've seen one of this hoses at lowes and they look massive. Have you ever use a 1/2 inch braided hose before?. I just want to know if is not over kill to go with the 3/4 I have no experience what so ever with building a mash tun Lol. Anyway if is not big deal could you tell me the parts you used to build yours? Sorry for replying to this old thread but I need some guide to finally build my batch sparging system thanks.

I have been using this loop of copper for almost 10 years. I've often thought of replacing it, but it works every time, so why bother? Nothing could be simpler. The holes go on the bottom when in use.

I know I'll catch some heat for saying this, but my efficiency increased by 15% when I changed to a manifold from my braid... I think there were a number of reasons for this. I believe the length of the braid was actually detrimental and caused some kind of channeling. It was 4' long and I had it bent around and attached to a tee on the bulkhead. There is something to be said for how the design/layout of the braid will impact efficiency as well.

For what it's worth, I would suggest a coil of braided hose with a SS spring inside of it. The longer the better. Coil it up like a snake. Best of both worlds IMHO.

Thank you guys for your help and opinions. About the manifold I have to be honest, I'm lazy and the batch sparge way seems simple enough for me however I might change my mind later and go with the manifold. Thank you