my cider is a little weak on flavor... suggestions?

All,

I'm a new guy to home brewing and cider making, so I had posted a while back, asking some guidance on making my cider. Thank you all so much for the input. I will say, though, that I finally got to taste the end product, Friday evening, only to be a little disappointed.

Let me say that it doesn't taste "bad", it just doesn't taste like much of anything. the apple flavor is minimal goes away, very quickly.

So, my process, in a nutshell, was 1 gallon of fresh-pressed, local cider, into which I dissolve one crushed campden table. after 24 hours, I added half of package of champagne yeast that I'd done a small starter with, with a water/honey solution. 2 weeks in a primary, racked into a secondary for another 2 weeks, bottled and conditioned for 4 weeks, and that was that.

the carbonation is great and, like I said, it tastes ok, but it's kind of "blah". So I'm looking for some pointers on different ways to up the flavor ante, preferabbly making it more "apple-y". My wife suggested mulling spices in the secondary, and I had considered aging it on fresh apple slices in the secondary if any of you have had experinces with either of these ideas or have a better suggestion, please let me know.

One thing that I've thought about, though, was that the cider I used was obviously very early season and even the fresh cider wasn't overly flavorful. So that could have a lot to do with it, too. I plan to do another batch in a few weeks with later-season cider, now that some of the tart apples have really come in, and see how that turns out, but I wanted to check in with the fine folks at homebrew talk before I gave it another go.

I'll be anxious to hear what you suggest. Thanks!

use concentrated apple juice as priming sugar before bottling. use 1/2 or more of a can per gallon

I will have to agree. My ciders taste more "appley cidery" when I prime with concentrate. Also if you let it ferment out completely I think you lose a lot of apple flavor.

Champagne yeast strips a lot of flavor. I like Nottingham ale yeast. Ferment cool and slow
Some flavor will normally come back over time, but if your fresh tasted weak your fermented likely will also. As state backsweetening with frozen AJC helps.

Mulling spices can be nice....little goes a long ways. Cinnamon and vanilla add nice flavor.

Where do you get your concentrated apple juice that doesn't have preservatives? Our grocery stores in Texas only sell the cheap kind with preservatives

I get mine from the grocery store. Asorbic acid is used, but not harmful to the fermentation.

I don't know that I remember seeing any concentrates that had chemicals that would prevent fermentation.

aggieeric said:

Where do you get your concentrated apple juice that doesn't have preservatives? Our grocery stores in Texas only sell the cheap kind with preservatives

Click to expand...

I use the frozen.......have never seen any with preservatives.....I buy the walmart stuff.

If you are backsweetening and not planning on carbonating, preservatives won't matter.

great! this information is all very helpful. thank you all, so much.

I had read, before starting, that a champagne yeast will give you a dry cider where ale yeast would give you a sweeter cider. I wanted a dry cider but I still want it to taste like apples

I think maybe a later season press of cider might make a difference but I'm thinking that priming with apple juice concentrate is an excellent idea. I think I will probably give that a try.

if it still doesn't turn out the way I'd like, then maybe I'll give ale yeast a try on the next batch.

Just to make sure I understand everything, though, 1/2 can of AJ concentrate per gallon of cider will be enough to replace the corn sugar to carbonate the cider? ...and it should be preservative free, so as long as you use a pasteurized concentrate it should work?

Thanks again!

Another yeast option is a white wine yeast, I've been using Red Star Cotes de Blanc and liking my results for my last four or so batches. I got too much yeasty flavor out of Ale yeast, probably due to high temps and fast ferments. I'm trying a batch of carrot apple cider with US-04 right now at a lower temp, so I haven't given up on ale yeasts yet.

1/2 a can per gallon works well, you can bump a dry cider up to 1.010 or so. a full can can will be pretty sweet but not as much as woodchuck, which tastes like soda to me.

1/2can/gal will over carb bottles, so plan to bottle pasteurize or make some room in the fridge

hellpatrol said:

1/2 a can per gallon works well, you can bump a dry cider up to 1.010 or so. a full can can will be pretty sweet but not as much as woodchuck, which tastes like soda to me.

1/2can/gal will over carb bottles, so plan to bottle pasteurize or make some room in the fridge

Click to expand...

would you be willing to expand on this, please? ...and don't be afraid to dumb it down, either. I have to stress again, that I'm a newbie and I'm not really sure how to bottle pasteurize (but it sounds like a giant pain) and by "make some room in the fridge", I guess you're talking about cold crashing? I would like to try the apple juice concentrate idea but I would also like to avoid exploding bottles, as well, if that's what you're getting at.

I'm not a fan of woodchuck, either. it's way too sweet, for my liking. I am hoping for something a little more comparable to Strongbow.

Thanks again!

CRock303 said:

Another yeast option is a white wine yeast, I've been using Red Star Cotes de Blanc and liking my results for my last four or so batches. I got too much yeasty flavor out of Ale yeast, probably due to high temps and fast ferments. I'm trying a batch of carrot apple cider with US-04 right now at a lower temp, so I haven't given up on ale yeasts yet.

Click to expand...

!!!!!!!!!!!! Carrot apple cider???????????? Recipe, please?

!!!!!!!!!!!! Carrot apple cider???????????? Recipe, please?

Click to expand...

Waiting on the batch I have going to at least finish secondary fermentation then I'll do a recipe post, just put it in secondary so it shouldn't be too long. The first batch I tried was good but super sour so I'm doing a second batch with less acid. Basically it's a gallon of carrot juice and 4 gallons of apple with brown sugar to boost the carrot's gravity then yeast and time.

Can you still get carbonation if you backsweeten (with AJ concentrate) and you racked into bottles (off the lees)?
Maybe I'm 'mis-speaking'... You add AJ concentrate then rack off the lees into bottles. Will I get carbonation? (and subsequently have to pastuerize or fridge it)

Yes, even after racking off the lees there is plenty of yeast in suspension to carbonate.

If you want semi sweet and carbonated and you don't have kegging equipment you about have to pasteurize. Small batches can be clod crashed and handled in the fridge. Few of us have fridge space to keep 5 gallon batches.

Here's what I'd do if I were you.

1 Rack off lees
2 Backsweeten to your taste + just a bit for carbonation consumption.
3 Bottle......(use a plastic soda bottle...not a water bottle.......to use as your test bottle) Fill 1 soda bottle and the rest in your glass bottles.
4 Closely monitor (daily) the soda bottle. When it becomes quite firm.....like soda bottles are when you purchase......it is time to pasteurize.
5 Read the sticky at top of page for pasteurizing.