Imperial Stout pitched on Irish Stout yeast cake

Sound like a good idea? Or just pitch 2 packets S04?

Dry Irish Stout extract kit w/ speciality grains.
Safale S-04 yeast
OG 1042
primary for 3 weeks...then pitch on yeast cake

Imperial Stout extract w/ speciality grains.
OG 1086

Thanks for any suggestions!

The yeast cake police are going to tell you no. But, that's how I do my RIS (by making a smaller beer than dumping the RIS on top). Either way should be fine though.

A 1086 onto a 1042 cake isn't bad - overpitched for sure, but not by a lot.

Sounds great. Aerate the shiz out of it, don't skimp on the nutrient addition, and for GOD'S sake, keep the carboy cool during fermentation to keep the higher alcohols at bay and the esters reasonable. Good luck!

Thanks guys! I thought it might be overpitched a little, but better than not enough. It's hot here in Florida, but I have a swamp cooler setup that keeps it between 65-70. Aeration technigue has been pouring back and forth several times between fermenter and boil pot. Ferment in 6.5 gallon plastic bucket and don't have a blowoff. Thought I would just leave the lid loose. Sound OK?

If you have a 3 piece airlock and the right sized tubing, then you have a blowoff. Just take the extra 2 pieces off and attach the tubing. It's worked for me in a pinch.

I'm getting ready to brew a RIS that will have an OG of 1120 in theory and am planning on just using the Irish Ale (Wyeast 1084) yeast cake from a cream stout that's just about ready. The last time I used an entire yeast cake was when I brewed two batches of Patersbier back to back which was probably not the best idea as I wasn't prepared for how hot it got or the massive blowoff. Dumping 5 gallons of 1.050 wort onto an entire cake of 3787 was a disaster waiting to happen and a good lesson as well.

This time should go better as I have a swamp cooler set up and I'm going to ferment in an 8 gallon bucket.

Mexicanconnection2002 said:

Thanks guys! I thought it might be overpitched a little, but better than not enough. It's hot here in Florida, but I have a swamp cooler setup that keeps it between 65-70. Aeration technigue has been pouring back and forth several times between fermenter and boil pot. Ferment in 6.5 gallon plastic bucket and don't have a blowoff. Thought I would just leave the lid loose. Sound OK?

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I'm sure you can rig up a blowoff as the above post describes. A loose lid will suffice too. If I were you, I'd keep the ambient between 55 and 60*F for the first 5 days of fermentation. The batch is going to go nuts. Easily 10 degrees hotter than the room the beer sits in. I'd spend $8 on one of those rope-handled 20 gallon utility buckets you can get at most mega-marts these days. Keeping the bucket surrounded by water will suck up heat a lot better than just the cooled air of the swamp-cooler room. Frozen bottles of water (a lot of them, maybe two sets of 5 or 10 bottles (10-20 total) to rotate between the water bath and the freezer) will keep the water bath around 60 while the beer is rocking during those first days of fermentation. If you can keep things under control for the first 5-7 days, you'll be rewarded with much smoother flavor in your high gravity brews. After the explosive exponential yeast phase, you can leave your bucket at normal room temps without harming the beer. My thoughts, anyway.

Why not just wash the yeast? It's an easy process and doesn't take that long. That way you'll get the old trub out and be pitching just yeast. Otherwise, I'd think you would have a ton of trub at the bottom after the second brew finishes. Either way save the S-04 for backup.

The lose lid will generally be fine from a sanitation standpoint but be sure to have the mop ready, especially if you are going to pitch on the yeast cake.

I just reused a yeast cake for the first time last week... I was cloning a bush de noel for my xmas beer. I have never witnessed such a fierce fermenation. My blow off tube literally sounded like a machine in my sanitized solution mason jar!!

Does anyone have any idea if reusing a yeast cake would diminish the amount of time you can allow the beer to sit in the primary... Maybe thats a question for a different thread.

It may affect fermentation time, but I would leave it on just as long. You want the yeast to clean up as many off flavors as possible. Most people rack off primary way too early.

SethMasterFlex said:

It may affect fermentation time, but I would leave it on just as long. You want the yeast to clean up as many off flavors as possible. Most people rack off primary way too early.

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I'm not sure what the "most people" are doing, but pitching at proper rates (or slightly overpitching, as may be the case with pitching entire yeast cakes) will shorten the length of primary fermentation time. Terminal gravity will certainly be reached in a shorter time, but in response to your "yeast clean up" comment, the fermentation will be cleaner and require less cleanup time -- as long as aeration, nutrition and fermentation temperatures are properly managed. My local brewpub has some solid 7 day old beers in their serving kegs, and Jamil and the CYBI team keg their clones at around 10 days. If you manage the fermentation properly and pitch the correct yeast volume, you don't need month-long primaries for most beers.

Thanks again for the responses!

I had thought about the airlock blowoff tube, but was nervous about it getting clogged up. Aren't these type blow off tubes smaller (inside diameter) than a normal one or about same size?

Thought this would be easier than washing yeast since the trub left behind from the Dry Irish Stout most likely would not alter the Imperial Stout much.

I leave everything in primary for 3 weeks then rack to keg. This one I plan to age for 4-6 months. Should I leave at room temp as aging until ready to carb or stick in corner of my kegerator @ 39degrees while aging? Also do I need to vent keg any while aging?

This forum and the posters here are great! Thanks!

Mexicanconnection2002 said:

I had thought about the airlock blowoff tube, but was nervous about it getting clogged up. Aren't these type blow off tubes smaller (inside diameter) than a normal one or about same size?

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For blowoff tube, I use the same size tubing as my racking cane/bottling wand because that's what I have on hand. You can slip this size tubing over one of the arms on the universal carboy cap or slip it over a small cut piece of old racking cane stuck into a bung. I have both types of caps and unlike the airlocks, I've never clogged a blow off tube. Alternatively I've also seen other people use larger diameter tubing over the center section of the three-piece airlock and the entire center section of the bung. Another even larger alternative is some huge tubing directly into the mouth of the carboy. I'm sure if you search here or look around Google images, you can see some of the various options.

The fermentation will go nuts and it'll be awesome. Last time I did this, fermentation started much, much sooner than I expected. I had bubbles in less than an hour and krausen in three hours.

Point is, it'll go nuts and it'll go nuts FAST. Don't wait to get that blowoff on there. Cheers!

swoof said:

The last time I used an entire yeast cake was when I brewed two batches of Patersbier back to back which was probably not the best idea as I wasn't prepared for how hot it got or the massive blowoff. Dumping 5 gallons of 1.050 wort onto an entire cake of 3787 was a disaster waiting to happen and a good lesson as well.

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I did the same thing about a month ago. How did yours turn out? Mine has really intense esters that haven't died down yet. Exceptionally sweet as if it didn't attenuate all the way (FG was 1.008). And I can not get that yeast out of suspension. I have been chilling ~30 degrees for over a month now and it still looks like a hefe

WASH YOUR YEAST.... your beer and yeast will think you! I'm not the po po I've just done it both ways and get WAY better results with washing and fermenting in a clean fermenter... Pitching on a cake is the lazy mans big beer remedy.