How to build a control panel (part 1)

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How big is the box? How big is your heat sink? I'm assuming it's sealed/closed (no airflow)?

The trick with external heat sinks is that airflow or convection helps suck away heat from the heat sinks.

Assuming your box is 100% closed, install the heat sink inside and what happens is that the heat sink gets hot sucking heat out of SSR which then heats up the inside components (reducing their lifespan to some degree). The whole inside hit some max ambient temp and stays there as heat hits the sides of the box and outside air currents/convection helps keep the whole box cool, but everything inside runs hotter than if you have the heatsink outside.

It would likely be fine, but outside is always better.

Kal

Kal

Ok, I'll give it a try and see what the temps end up peaking at. It wouldn't be any harder at the stage I'm at now to move it out later. thanks, kal
 
Kal, I just realized for my setup I need a second internal fuse (this one at 15amps) between the SSR and Shunt for the power to the heating element. I am planning on using 14 ga wire and a 15 amp plug for the element, so I need to protect it from the 20 amp circuit. The rest of the components come off the negative terminal, which is already protected by a 7 amp fuse. In your setup it's not an issue, since the elements are wired to the same protection as the power in. However, I do note that the heating element "on" lights are wired right off the element plugs and the wire used is only 14 ga. Technically, this circuit is only protected to 30 amps, so if the element lights shorted, you would smoke those wires. I would change out the wire with 10 ga to be safe.
 
However, I do note that the heating element "on" lights are wired right off the element plugs and the wire used is only 14 ga. Technically, this circuit is only protected to 30 amps, so if the element lights shorted, you would smoke those wires. I would change out the wire with 10 ga to be safe.
Just changing the wires to 10 ga is not enough as the light itself cannot handle 30 amps. The more correct way would be to leave the wires as 14ga but fuse the 2 wires plus light with a 15A or lower fuse.

That said, frankly I don't think it's worth it. Most consumer devices do not have a whole bunch of sets of fuses for the various sub-parts of the device. I went with only 1 fuse for the 15A sub-section of the panel. That one fuse controls all of the sub 15A devices but not the 2 element lights as you saw.

If someone really wants to, they could most certainly put a small fuse rated at something under 15A in series with each of the lights and 14ga wires. Two fuses would be required.

Kal
 
The same thing is true for your panel on/off circuit which comes off your main power feed to power the coil on your "main" contactor. My system is the same way. I did put a 1 amp fuse in my start/E-stop circuit which comes off my main power feed (50 amp, 240 vac) but I have 2 inches of 14 awg wire between the feed and the fuse. I figure if that 2 inches of wire goes up in smoke, the whole control panel will turn off. I don't know if I am taking false comfort.
I think Ed actually put 6 awg between his main power feed and circuit breaker that feeds his start/E-stop circuit.
 
The same thing is true for your panel on/off circuit which comes off your main power feed to power the coil on your "main" contactor. My system is the same way. I did put a 1 amp fuse in my start/E-stop circuit which comes off my main power feed (50 amp, 240 vac) but I have 2 inches of 14 awg wire between the feed and the fuse. I figure if that 2 inches of wire goes up in smoke, the whole control panel will turn off. I don't know if I am taking false comfort.
I think Ed actually put 6 awg between his main power feed and circuit breaker that feeds his start/E-stop circuit.

Yes, I did run 6awg to the breakers.
However, I do have a similar potential issue with my indicators.

Ed
 
The same thing is true for your panel on/off circuit which comes off your main power feed to power the coil on your "main" contactor. My system is the same way. I did put a 1 amp fuse in my start/E-stop circuit which comes off my main power feed (50 amp, 240 vac) but I have 2 inches of 14 awg wire between the feed and the fuse. I figure if that 2 inches of wire goes up in smoke, the whole control panel will turn off. I don't know if I am taking false comfort.
I think Ed actually put 6 awg between his main power feed and circuit breaker that feeds his start/E-stop circuit.

The contactor is run off the auxillary power terminals, isn't it? That one is fused at 7 amps. Maybe I'm missing something.

BTW: After thinking about it, I agree with Kal. How often do we use a 16 ga extension cord in a 15 amp outlet? I can't imagine all those devices have separate protection in their circuit.

Edit: Edit: BTW, since I couldn't find another inline fuse holder for the SSR to main power connection when shopping tonight, I picked up a single buss fuse box (switchable) that fits inside a standard 2" box, which I'll mount to the back plate. Overkill, but definitely ads to the coolness factor.
 
Hi guys!

Anyone know any US based brewers who are detailed oriented, have an electrical background, and are looking at making a few extra bucks?

I'm looking for a business partner in the US to help build our Electric Brewery setups to other passionate brewers! Likely starting with the control panel only.

At this time I're only considering someone from the US as it will greatly reduce the end cost as the shipping costs of both receiving parts to build and shipping out the final product(s) will be lower.

If anyone knows anyone, send'em my way! Cheers!

Kal
 
What did you have in mind....perform primarily assembly functions (read schematics then solder/crimp/cable from them), or system design as well?

Kev.
 
What did you have in mind....perform primarily assembly functions (read schematics then solder/crimp/cable from them), or system design as well?

Kev.

The system is already designed (per my website). Looking for someone who wants to build/sell/ship/support the control panel and possibly the extras as well. This person would set the price and ship/sell directly to keep costs as low as possible. Most customers would be in the USA so it should be someone USA based as that would result in the lowest cost (no cross border duties or issues, costs less to get parts in the first place).

The gist of it is that I don't have time to do it myself so I want to hand off building/selling to someone else who understands this stuff. Some customers may want changes too so the person would have to have a good working knowledge of brewing and electricity to be able to make suggestions/changes as required.

Just need to find the right (interested) partner with the right skills. While it still needs to be ironed out this person would set the price and run it on their own. It would be their responsibility, built under licence. I would do all the sales/marketing/etc on the site where people would come to click and buy and the site would earn a small commission.

I do this with another home theater related website and it works very well. The trick is choosing good products (in this case the product is a known quantity since it's mine!) and then finding responsible, detail oriented, and available people to build/sell/support the items.

Kal
 
Hi guys!

Anyone know any US based brewers who are detailed oriented, have an electrical background, and are looking at making a few extra bucks?

I'm looking for a business partner in the US to help build our Electric Brewery setups to other passionate brewers! Likely starting with the control panel only.

At this time I're only considering someone from the US as it will greatly reduce the end cost as the shipping costs of both receiving parts to build and shipping out the final product(s) will be lower.

If anyone knows anyone, send'em my way! Cheers!

Kal

I wish I had time for that! Hope you find a good partner, Kal.

Cheers,
TB
 
I think I've got it figured out, but if anyone who bought the Auber timer vs the Omega timer can let me know how they've wired it, that'd be great. For now, I am following Kal on everything up to the timer connections. On the timer connections I will run the hot lead into the timer (#10), jumping the hot lead to the relay output (#8). I will then run a wire from the other side of the relay output (#7) to the alarm switch. Then I will run a neutral wire into the timer (#9), and jump to the buzzer and light. The reset button will be wired to #1 and #4 and I also installed a switch for pause, which will be wired to #2 and #4. Unlike Kal's setup, I am not jumping the neutral to the reset button. I think Kal needs to do this as the reset on the Omega timer needs current running through it to work. The Auber ASL-51 generates a small current off of both #1 and #2, so you can direct wire it to the common on #4.
 
Well, I've officially started ordering parts to build a replica of your control panel. Since I'm planning on building an electric boil kettle anyway, I figured why not go ahead and upgrade my control panel too! I'll be sure to post pics when its done, but I'm sure it will take me awhile.
 
Well, I've officially started ordering parts to build a replica of your control panel. Since I'm planning on building an electric boil kettle anyway, I figured why not go ahead and upgrade my control panel too! I'll be sure to post pics when its done, but I'm sure it will take me awhile.
Excellent! Can't wait to see the pics!

Kal
 
Hi guys!

Anyone know any US based brewers who are detailed oriented, have an electrical background, and are looking at making a few extra bucks?

I'm looking for a business partner in the US to help build our Electric Brewery setups to other passionate brewers! Likely starting with the control panel only.

At this time I're only considering someone from the US as it will greatly reduce the end cost as the shipping costs of both receiving parts to build and shipping out the final product(s) will be lower.

If anyone knows anyone, send'em my way! Cheers!

Kal

That would be nice. The panel is by far going to be the most challenging thing for me. I do have most the of the parts now to build your panel. I now need to order the switches and breakers and a few other parts. It's going to be a long project with a kitchen renovation in the works as well. Oh well....
 
Kal,
Good luck on the build project. As a benchmark, we bill out $110/hr in labor (San Francisco Bay area), but you could easily find $40/hr in the rest of the States.
How about getting an apprentice, do a practice build before you go bulk?

By far, the build WILL require the person to be meticulous and conscious. Good luck, it is hard to find. It took me 5 years to build a good team for our business.
 
By far, the build WILL require the person to be meticulous and conscious. Good luck, it is hard to find. It took me 5 years to build a good team for our business.

Agreed 100%. Which is why I'm looking for people with prior experience in this field, not just people who want to "help out". I'm incredibly fussy about this stuff and want to make sure it's done right.

Kal
 
So, I'm working on building the temp probes right now and I must say that this is no easy task. That expandable sleeving is a pain to work with! I'm just going to do one layer I think simply because I don't want to mess with the sleeving more than I have to:)
 
So, I'm working on building the temp probes right now and I must say that this is no easy task. That expandable sleeving is a pain to work with! I'm just going to do one layer I think simply because I don't want to mess with the sleeving more than I have to:)
Really? Are you sure you got the same sizes I recommend? I don't remember it being very difficult given that the temp probe cables aren't very long. Getting it on was fairly easy and then I used heat shrink wrap to hold it in place to have nice clean edges.

I did two layers of sleeving just to give it more weight. I'm sure 1 would probably be fine too.

IMG_1268.jpg


Kal
 
someone posted a nice wire diagram for this, but I could not find it

Edit - Found it
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f170/asl-51-timer-wiring-207860/


I think I've got it figured out, but if anyone who bought the Auber timer vs the Omega timer can let me know how they've wired it, that'd be great. For now, I am following Kal on everything up to the timer connections. On the timer connections I will run the hot lead into the timer (#10), jumping the hot lead to the relay output (#8). I will then run a wire from the other side of the relay output (#7) to the alarm switch. Then I will run a neutral wire into the timer (#9), and jump to the buzzer and light. The reset button will be wired to #1 and #4 and I also installed a switch for pause, which will be wired to #2 and #4. Unlike Kal's setup, I am not jumping the neutral to the reset button. I think Kal needs to do this as the reset on the Omega timer needs current running through it to work. The Auber ASL-51 generates a small current off of both #1 and #2, so you can direct wire it to the common on #4.
 
Well, I bought the parts as listed from your site. It wasn't terribly hard I suppose...I just had to kind of shimmy the sleeving along the length of the cable to get it on. Once it was on it was pretty easy to do the rest.
Here's the progress I made on the cables tonight. I haven't added the XLR connectors yet...
I went from this
DSC_07322.jpg

to this
DSC_0735-1.jpg
 
So, I'm working on building the temp probes right now and I must say that this is no easy task. That expandable sleeving is a pain to work with! I'm just going to do one layer I think simply because I don't want to mess with the sleeving more than I have to:)

It was a little tricky to get started, but I did mine on Saturday and got both layers on, soldered the auber connector on the other end (I went with their stock quick disconnect vs what Kal used) and heat shrinked both ends to finish it off. I love the heft and finish of the cord (I went black/blue same as Kal) and the stainless wire rope, when looped through the clamps at both ends and heat shrinked in place, acts as additional strain relief. Great design by Kal. Like everything else in his build, NASA quality.

I ran out of MAP gas for my torch, which I normally use for heat shrink tubing. For those of you contemplating obtaining a heat gun, a candle at a careful distance from the flame does the charm.

someone posted a nice wire diagram for this, but I could not find it

Edit - Found it
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f170/asl-51-timer-wiring-207860/

Thanks, I finished it this weekend and mine is similar, although I also wired in the pause switch, by wiring #2 and #4 to a selector switch. After playing with it for a bit, I can't imagine not having the pause switch. Obviously you can use the tiny one on the face of the instrument itself, but that's no fun.
 
Nice work hatfieldenator! I still find it really freaky seeing people build stuff hat looks identical to mine. I guess I still find it strange that anyone would want to follow in my footsteps. ;)

Kal
 
It was a little tricky to get started, but I did mine on Saturday and got both layers on, soldered the auber connector on the other end (I went with their stock quick disconnect vs what Kal used) and heat shrinked both ends to finish it off.

What is the stock quick disconnect? What part number is that?
 
What are the disadvantages/advantages compared to the XLR connections described for Kal's electricbrewery? Both options seem very similar and about the same cost (cheap).

The only advantage is that since you order it with your PID, temp probe, SSR, Heat Sink, and in my case, Timer, there is little if any extra charge for shipping.
 
For what it's worth, I prefer the XLRs as they're beefier and XLRs (by their nature) are meant to be tough/roadworthy/disconnected/reconnected continuously.

What you use at the control panel however probably isn't that critical since you rarely ever disconnect there. At least I don't! The ones I disconnect are at the kettle end every time I clean the boil kettle or mash/lauter tun. At that end it's worth having a much smaller disconnect at that end and XLRs are not small.

Kal
 
for the pause switch, did you just use a 2 position selector switch? Where did you place it, next to the reset button? I am drawing up my panel tonight and might add one
 
Hi Milldoggy, check out post #151. I won't be home in time tonight to get you a more current picture, showing all the tags and such, but this one shows all the switch locations. You can see the reset button to the right of the timer, and the pause 2 position selector directly above. The alarm light and buzzer are located above the timer, and the element light and switch to the left. Since I used Kal's design to build a RIMS vs HERMS setup, I only have one PID, so I bought the larger one to fill out the panel better. All of my 2 position selectors are the same, I bought a box of ten.

BTW: the alarm buzzer also flashes, so you don't necessarily need the alarm light if you are hampered for space in the panel, but it does add to the cool factor so I'm glad I put it in.
 
One more thing. If anyone else is building a RIMS version and thinks they can get away without a selector switch and mechanical relay to kill all power to the element since they don't have to worry about firing two elements at once, note Kal's warning that SSR's are notorious for "leaking" small amounts of power. When my selector switch for the element is in the "on" position, there is enough power leaking through the SSR to faintly light the element light.
 
Thanks, I will see if I can fit it tonight. just sucks, ordered all my switches already, hate to pay all the shipping for one switch :)

I did order the switches with the yellow NC/NO blocks with the plasitc mounts, I guess I could replace them all with the nice metal tele... switchs.

Might skip it for now and add it later if I want it, not to hard to cut one 22mm hole and wire it up.
 
One more thing. If anyone else is building a RIMS version and thinks they can get away without a selector switch and mechanical relay to kill all power to the element since they don't have to worry about firing two elements at once, note Kal's warning that SSR's are notorious for "leaking" small amounts of power. When my selector switch for the element is in the "on" position, there is enough power leaking through the SSR to faintly light the element light.

Yup. I noticed this as well. This is one of the reasons why the 240V element lights are *directly* wired across the heating elements and not done some indirect way. For safety reasons you see exactly what's going on.

Kal
 
Well, I've actually started working on building this control panel over the last couple of days. Here are some shots of the progress I've made so far. I'm sure some of this will look familiar...Notice the mess I've made of our kitchen table (my wife is actually being patient with me still, little does she know I've still got a few more weeks until its done:))
DSC_0743-1.jpg

DSC_0738-1.jpg

DSC_0746-1.jpg

DSC_0745-1.jpg
 
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